Excuse my heresy and please help, need advice from the fat tire crowd.

[February]

I love my ebike, but I'm poor and need something that will work in the rain. While I intend to commence on another gas build, pardon the heresy, I would like everyone to give me their opinions on fat tires vs standard. I'm probably going with 26" wheels, this will be a road only bike with front suspension, but only seat suspension and a hard tail. Just wondering if fat tires will provide smoother ride or not? Pros vs cons?

 

[Chargeride]

You dont want fat tires on the road, they follow road ridges terribly, completely lose grip if theres mud on the road and without suspension they start buckarooing and of course increased drag.

 

[m@Robertson]

Fat tires are fine on the road You just choose the right tread. A smooth roller with evenly spaced small knobs will be stable on pretty much everything. Best example of this is the Chaoyang Big Daddy, which is also sold under a half-dozen other names, some of which are much less chinese-y sounding. Origin8 Tsunami is one of them.

At faster ebike speeds, bigger tires on pavement make sense on urban roads with urban imperfections. Just ask yourself how many motorcycles use skinny tires.

Myself, I have roughly 13000 miles across about 4 years commuting on fat tires before I switched over to cargo bikes. I used variations of that Big Daddy, plus I went smooth-ish with Vee Speedsters (26x3.5), the Arisun Big Smoothy (4.0) and best of all the Origin8 Supercell, which is probably the most popular labeling of the Chaoyang Sandstorm. That tire is a semi-slick with enough grooves to keep from hydroplaning. I found it sticks really well to pavement in hard cornering even in the wet. Front tire in the pic below is one of the Big Daddy clones in 26x4.8 (which is really about a 4.2 if you put calipers to it) and the rear is a Vee Crossroads in 4.8 (same deal its really a lot narrower if you measure it).

Notice the front chainring size. This bike is a street commuter that runs at speed roughly a constant 28 mph. This bike had about 7000 miles on it when I retired it as a daily driver.

In all cases, you want the 30 tpi tires as they have heavy casings that stand up to punishment. And for street use, if its a 20 psi tire, inflate to 20 and work your way down in 1 psi increments until you find the point where you reach the comfort vs. rolling resistance tradeoff point. Fat tires in the forest need to be 3-5 psi. On pavement you pump them up.

The smooth tires roll really well after you lift off power, but the low knob style of mixed-use tire stick good too, ropll ok if you pick the right tread (the Maxxis fatties are not good rollers at all) and can be taken onto doubletrack dirt roads without issue (the Surly Edna is another good one that wears like iron) and also have the benefit of 'singing' on pavement which has the surprising benefit of keeping pedestrians from walking out in front of you, because they can hear you coming. Probably not a thing for a gas powered bike.

Don't go overboard though. 26x4 is about as big as you should go. Thats probably the tipping point for speed and efficiency. A 3.0 or 3.5 can be a good option too but it becomes tough to find the right tire at that size.

 

[kevinmccune]

used to drive a truck that had the "wide floaters" on the front,that thing would beat you to death,the increased turning radius plus the cost had me wishing for regular tires,my advice if you are going with 26" use a 2.8 maximum,a wide tire is an awful drag unpowered,oth a 4"x26 "sandstorm rolls fairly good with enough traction for just about any situation

 

[m@Robertson]

Oh and also the fat tires will provide a varying degree of cush. You can see my orange bike above is a hardtail with a suspension seatpost. Decrease the tire pressure to about 12 psi and its like floating on pillows. At 20 psi its rolling on rocks, but its rolling fast. Don't forget your frame will make some difference in your ride comfort. The orange bike and a titanium-framed one I also have are noticeably more comfortable when I slide the rear dropouts all the way back, which lets the stays flex more.

You would not think such a small change would be noticeable, but it is. On the ti bike its is so much so I had to bring them back in again because titanium flexes more than chromoly and the longer wheelbase got woogedy in high speed turns thru intersections.

 

[m@Robertson]

if you are going with 26" use a 2.8 maximum

I upped this bike from 26x2.0 to 26x2.8 and the difference in ride comfort was amazing. Its just as comfy as a fat tire. The problem is there are so few tires available in this size you have very few options. WTB used to have a 26x2.8 knobby but they are gone. I think the next step is a Maxxis Aggressor in 26x2.5 for knobby, or Maxxis Hookworms in an awesome smooth roller in 2.5. These are Vee Speedster 2.8s and as you can see its a street tire only. And its pretty thin. But it can still be found for sale. Rim is 32mm inside width.

I wore the Speedsters out and recently replaced them with Duro Beach Bums, which have a super thick, almost-slick tread that is casing-thin in the grooves between the tread. Advertised as a 26x3.0 but its ETRTO reveals its really a 2.8.

 

[February]

Keep it coming guys, bad or good, thanks for all the info.
To give you an idea of what I'm going to build:

Think this or this combined with this or this or possibly this:

 

[gromike]

Granny trikes are known for their propensity to tip over at anything over low speed, so don't plan on going fast. If you enjoy noise and fumes, by all means put a gasser on it. At least everyone will hear you approach.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Fat tires

You dont want fat tires on the road, they follow road ridges terribly, completely lose grip if theres mud on the road and without suspension they start buckarooing and of course increased drag.

I would even say a fat bike has no advantage off-road compared to a suspension bike. Fat tyre ensures more traction on loose surfaces (deep sand, morass, deep snow) and has no advantage elsewhere.

 

[sc00ter]

Granny trikes are known for their propensity to tip over at anything over low speed, so don't plan on going fast. If you enjoy noise and fumes, by all means put a gasser on it. At least everyone will hear you approach.

Not always. We have a guy who rides a Worksman with a gas powered motor on it. Thing is VERY quiet, and shockingly quick! He passed me going 28mph on my Xpedition like I was standing still. I only heard his bicycle bell coming. I've been trying to catch him sitting still because I'd love to know what he's running. I'm pretty sure it's a 4-stroke as I don't smell heavy exhaust when passed. I think it comes down to quality of said motor and if it's being maintained.

February, please post your final build. I'd love to see it. Oh, and trikes are fun! Just take some time to learn them and their quirks.

 

[m@Robertson]

Yeah but when you turn a trike, at speed, if it doesn't have tilting suspension it still tilts

 

[m@Robertson]

Fat tyre ensures more traction on loose surfaces (deep sand, morass, deep snow) and has no advantage elsewhere.

Hit a pothole at 50 km/h and you won't say that. Or head-on into a standard 20cm curb at 10 km/h. Or ride down stairs, although that one is voluntary and I have done that on 26x2.0 mtb tires too. Still, the fatties held the advantage.

Also lets add wilderness/overland, where there is no path. Doesn't need to be a loose surface. But that is an area where fatties are meant to thrive in the first place versus one where you can be thankful for them when something goes wrong.

The statement is true if you snip off unexpected surprises from the realm of possibility. Plus you are not taking into account the size and strength of the sidewalls. Only the width of the tread.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Hit a pothole at 50 km/h and you won't say that.

That may only happen on a steep descent. A normal e-bike is nimble and you'd rather avoid the pothole. While a fat bike would ride straight onto it.

How even can roadies ride steep descents on their 28 mm tyres?

Or head-on into a standard 20cm curb at 10 km/h.

You just jump onto the curb. A fat bike is too heavy to do that.

Or ride down stairs, although that one is voluntary and I have done that on 26x2.0 mtb tires too

Any MTB will do that. Suspension.

Also lets add wilderness/overland, where there is no path.

Any MTB will do that. An MTB is nimble, a fat bike tries to ride like a tank.

On the latest XC ride, the group leader had as many as six punctures on his fat bike. No other rider (except one) experienced a flat. I rode XC trails on 42 mm tubeless tires on the same ride.

The group leader is fond of GoPro and a drone. I could watch his ride in his own video. It was fascinating to see how he was losing control while riding over tree roots on his 4.4" Jumbo Jims.

I rode in a race that lead through singletracks and gravel roads of very varying quality, sand and potholes:

Those were 700x47 mm tubed gravel tyres, and a 50 mm front suspension. I achieved the max speed on a steep descent full of potholes and with patches of sand in the forest. I hope you'd survive that race on a fat e-bike Especially when you had to carry the e-bike above terrain obstacles

Tell me something I don't know

 

[Chargeride]

Fat tires

View attachment 186328
View attachment 186329


I would even say a fat bike has no advantage off-road compared to a suspension bike. Fat tyre ensures more traction on loose surfaces (deep sand, morass, deep snow) and has no advantage elsewhere.

Yes, but they are very good at getting forward traction on loose gravel and climbing shale rock, there is a lot of that in the Lake District near me and I climb things an ordinary tyre would insta fail at.
They also spread the load on grass, causing much less damage and getting grip while climbing, where a thinner tyre just cuts through to the mud and slips.
On our dartmoor ride, we climb a grass hillside and my friends 2.6s are ripping it up, you cant even see where Ive climbed.

 

[Chargeride]

That may only happen on a steep descent. A normal e-bike is nimble and you'd rather avoid the pothole. While a fat bike would ride straight onto it.

How even can roadies ride steep descents on their 28 mm tyres?


You just jump onto the curb. A fat bike is too heavy to do that.


Any MTB will do that. Suspension.


Any MTB will do that. An MTB is nimble, a fat bike tries to ride like a tank.

On the latest XC ride, the group leader had as many as six punctures on his fat bike. No other rider (except one) experienced a flat. I rode XC trails on 42 mm tubeless tires on the same ride.

The group leader is fond of GoPro and a drone. I could watch his ride in his own video. It was fascinating to see how he was losing control while riding over tree roots on his 4.4" Jumbo Jims.

I rode in a race that lead through singletracks and gravel roads of very varying quality, sand and potholes:

View attachment 186338
Those were 700x47 mm tubed gravel tyres, and a 50 mm front suspension. I achieved the max speed on a steep descent full of potholes and with patches of sand in the forest. I hope you'd survive that race on a fat e-bike Especially when you had to carry the e-bike above terrain obstacles

View attachment 186339
Tell me something I don't know

Fatties are surprisingly light, and you're forgetting their greatest trick.
They float!

 

[kevinmccune]

Fatties are surprisingly light, and you're forgetting their greatest trick.
They float!
View attachment 186353ailer"

like that because I am a very poor "flailer"( despite numerous attempts to learn at the YMCA 5 ft is fine )however,anyway guy with future gas build why not a 72 volt 30ah build(instant torque no need to spool up)

 

[kevinmccune]

Fatties are surprisingly light, and you're forgetting their greatest trick.
They float!
View attachment 186353

that reminds me of the old "rokon" trailblazer 2 wd 2 cycle motor things they would float well as long as the rims were empty of liquids.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Fatties are surprisingly light, and you're forgetting their greatest trick.
They float!

My MTB buddy calls fatties 'pontoons'
I'm afraid an e-fattie would sink, though

 

[kevinmccune]

My MTB buddy calls fatties 'pontoons'
I'm afraid an e-fattie would sink, though

one of these days ebikes will get even lighter battery tech will help and motors will get better.

 

[SpinningGears]

Funny how this guy STILL speaks like he EMTBs and is an authority on ANYTHING related. Truth is the guy is absolutely clueless about most things but uses an air of authority to create the appearence of knowledge or ability. His influence has turned this forum into an ebike circlejerk.

Yes thats him, doing the walk of shame cos rocks scary. Me, i'd be doing 40 down there with my fatties deforming over every rock i hit making the ride smooooth and grippy.

And before you get agro stefan, theres nearly 300 miles of Pennines waiting for that race still and as for strava - i climb more to get to the end of the drive than you do over your 'centuries', Rab centuries are notable, yours less so.