Looks like you are in the sweet spot of the country to try all of these. Would be interesting to see your take on the E8000, vs the PW-X, vs Brose mag, all in one shoot. I agree, they are all fine works of tech with so many great and varying characteristics. I test rode all but the E8000, back to back at an E-bike Expo and have to say my fav was the PW-X. Then again the newer versions of the others like the Gen4 Bosch may change my thinking.
Hope you find some interesting results.
I am. There's a 'lectric bike shop every few miles here.
So yeah, went to a few shops last week, exploring via ebike, wifey was a little bored but found some interesting things, like a rear strobe, and I got to see some awesome eMTB's.
First stop was our local Trek dealer - they have like 5 or 6 stores around the 'southland' and they are by far the nicest out of all bike shops. Obviously some profits there selling Trek can Electra. I was looking for the new RAIL5 - just sold their last one - sales kid not sure if he can get management authorization to 'bring in another $5K bike'. I said you'll sell them if you have them. He's going to call me if/when they get one.
They had the Powerfly models, even a 2018 one they're trying to blow out, but will need to discount it further to move it. The '19 models are nice, even had a carbon one, but none are 'cheap' - nothing under $4K.
The 2020 Powerfly is now a hardtail - the new Rail model is the full suspension bike with another update to the Bosch CX motor and 700w integrated battery, 29-er.
I did not ride any, but promised to try them all and choose one if they got a Rail in. So the new 2020 models have the upgraded 'gen-4' Bosch, and bigger 700w batteries - the '19s they had are 500w.
Next stop was Fullerton Electric Bikes - Sam has done a lot of the review videos with Court, super nice guy and very knowledgable about ebikes. He has Aventon, Motiv, Haibike, Bulls, BESV, Yamaha, Magnum, Surface, and a few others. I got to try out the Haibike XDuro All Mountain 2.0 with PW-X - it's a very nice bike, about $3200 OTD - our sales tax is 8%.
Then tried out the new BULLS E-STREAM EVO AM 4 (S MAG). This is a state of the art mtb with Fox suspension, 750w integrated battery, 27.5 wheels, Brose S Mag drive. He had special ordered in both of these bikes for customers that never showed back up to buy them - he doesn't require a deposit - does business the old way, based on your word. Both were size L which were perfect for me, and I enjoyed both of them.
The Bulls stickers at $6299 - offered for $5K OTD.
Now for the shocker - Sam has sold the business to Fullerton Bike Shop next door - the top Giant dealer in the country, and he's moving to Thailand (corrected). He said they have some family medical issues that is taking them there, so he's retiring. He'll get involved in the bike business over there - maybe even do some development or marketing assistance for bike builders there.
Then next door at the Giant dealer I took in the Trance E+1, they stock all the eMTB models from Giant, and have Santacruz and a few other pedalics. I really like the TranceE with sync-drive pro. They didn't offer me a discount yet, perhaps if i'm ready to sign. I bought my Explore from them, and have sent in buyers for two more bikes, so I'm a 'preferred customer'.
I did not bother trying out the Trance as it has the same mid-drive as the Haibike.
Now for my review notes...
I had a chance to pick Sam's brain a little on the various drive systems. The biggest surprise was his comment on Bosch - they've been building motors for a decade now and just opened their hundred-thousandth warranty claim. Oh my, they sell a lot but they also repair a lot. He says they have to work on the Bosch systems way more than any of the others. On the other hand, Yamaha doesn't even have a claim center - they just don't have very many failures, addressing any that do come up through their dealer network. His words - BULLETPROOF. That's good enough for me.
And on the Brose S-Mag - with the belt drive, is the quietest of them all, and is much better as the new mag-version. So far so good, but really not proven over long term yet.
His comment about the Shimano drive is that he just never cared for them much. But I don't know if he's worked on them much or not. I wanted his opinion though as that's the powerplant YT uses in their DECOY eMTB's - the 'Steps E8000'.
I got to finally try out the PW-X to compare to my 'pw' bike. It is more similar than different, just a little more punchy, and that's kind of hard to judge cuz the MTB bike is really geared differently than my Explore. And the Haibike version has a double front chain ring which is cool - great for commuting to trail, then super low gears for climbing. When I rolled up after my test ride I asked him why people are saying they are noisy - he explained the drive gears are straight cut and when you get to really high rpms you can hear that. I found out yesterday if I pick a lower gear, like 2 or 3 and pedal as fast as I can, the PW also buzzes some - it's the gears. He says it's not uncommon for people to comment on this after experiencing some serious climbing with the bike, but all in all it's quite insignificant. So the Yamaha drive is still my favorite. There isn't a big difference in feel for PW vs PW-X - they even make the same whirring noise when they're cold. Very easy to hit the speed limiter - all these bikes are Class1, no throttles on eMTB's.
The Brose S-Mag is a little more punchy and very nice to ride. The smaller display on the left is very nice, and the BULLS model was pure bliss - super cushy, great power, very nice to ride.
In comparing all these bikes - the Haibike is the best buy at $3000 or so, very comparably equipped to the others, the Giant next at $4500, then the Bulls for $4700, and now I would have really liked to try the new Trek for $5000. Worth noting, the Trek is the only 'twenty-niner'. Giant does have the 29" STANCE model but it's lower spec and the suspension lacks compared to the top RockShox and Fox options. Both Rockshox and Fox are very plush with adjustable damping - just excellent.
So there you have it - a quick eMTB comparo. Makes the BH PW-X upthread here for $2450 look like a bargain, although with shipping it's getting close to the Haibike Sam has in stock - and I get local support. If I had the $$ sitting I'd probly buy it, but I'm still paying off my Giant and would like to get that out of the way before taking on another one - I'm supposed to be saving for retirement!
Okay, I've rambled on enough...Q&A if anyone has any. I learned a lot yesterday. Oh, and we had a fun ride on our ebikes.
EDIT: I see now the 2020 Trek Rail5 has a 500w battery. Just FYI. And the color is awesome!
