Disappointed by TSDZ2 torque-motor performance

[EffectiveChapter]

Hi,

So I finally got the courage to order the mid drive 36v 350w conversion kit and little did I know that torque-sensing motor is not my thing at all. I was looking for zero effort pedaling and what I got was the opposite. I have to crank the assist all the way up to turbo mode (maximum assist) to even feel any proper help . I've changed the power settings to maximum but didn't feel much difference. I do regret buying this motor and not BAFANG, but I've already fitted it on to the bike and can't return it now. I bought it from aliexpress because it was also a bit cheaper than bafang. I should've done more research as all I read is everyone prefers torque-motors, I didn't quite realize why. Another thing I feel like I've failed with is the battery. I ordered it from a local vendor with warranty and not from aliexpress, but I have a feeling all they did was put a sticker on the same battery that is sold in chinese stores. And I overpaid 170 euros for it basically. The battery is 36v 12ah. I assume there is no way to convert torque sensing motor to pedal sensing? I also read that the motor can be programmed to be 500w, but I haven't tried that yet and doubt it would be of help. My only solution was to order a throttle, which now will require to get an insurance.

 

[Berserker26]

I've been researching this motor for 4 minutes and almost the first thing that comes up in every post is how you have to pedal and it feels like a real bike. This is why people like them, I have a Giant Quick-E with a torque motor and love it cos you still feel like you're riding a bike. You wanted a bafang BBSHD from the sounds of it.

 

[Dmitri]

From what I know, someone on Endless Sphere is promoting open-source firmware for TSDZ2, you might want to check it out.

 

[tomjasz]

From what I know, someone on Endless Sphere is promoting open-source firmware for TSDZ2, you might want to check it out.

Yes, but not a beginner project. Rather complex actually. A modified control and display can be purchased.

I have a TSDZ2. Given to me to ride and consider selling. First version came with no brake cutout, or throttle. Got the new display, brake levers, controller, and throttle and found the 48v a real dog performance wise. It sits on a KHS Smoothie and I let visitors use it. I thought about selling the thing for the bike and battery cost but don’t want to support it. So unless a DIY fella makes an offer and is independent enough to take care...it stays a dog ride for those n00b pals that don’t know any better. Almost true...

 

[tomjasz]

From what I know, someone on Endless Sphere is promoting open-source firmware for TSDZ2, you might want to check it out.

After rereading the OP, that would be worth upgrading. In for a penny, in for a pound! I find the throttle a dog as well.

TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Project status as of 2020.01.17: full working and tested, other developers did join and users are very happy, including online shops selling the TSDZ2 motor and 850C displays with our firmware installed. About the TSDZ2 Flexible OpenSource firmware/embedded software This OpenSource firmware...

endless-sphere.com

I think for around $130 you can get the modified replacement controller and display. No soldering or flashing firmware.

TSDZ2 OPEN SOURCE FIRMWARE (OSF) UPGRADE PRODUCTS

CUSTOMIZE YOUR TSDZ2 WITH OSF The launchpad for this TSDZ2 Open Source Firmware (OSF) Upgrade is an open source software project hosted on Github with the community bulletin board on Endless Sphere.This TSDZ2 OSF Upgrade adds advanced features and customization to the TSDZ2 motor that are even...

www.electrifybike.com

 

[yungleen]

I just put the 750w on a miyata road bike that I had. Pretty happy with the motor. Need to get my gearing straightened out and maybe a larger chain ring.

 

[Lumr]

Hi,

So I finally got the courage to order the mid drive 36v 350w conversion kit and little did I know that torque-sensing motor is not my thing at all. I was looking for zero effort pedaling and what I got was the opposite. I have to crank the assist all the way up to turbo mode (maximum assist) to even feel any proper help . I've changed the power settings to maximum but didn't feel much difference. I do regret buying this motor and not BAFANG, but I've already fitted it on to the bike and can't return it now. I bought it from aliexpress because it was also a bit cheaper than bafang. I should've done more research as all I read is everyone prefers torque-motors, I didn't quite realize why. Another thing I feel like I've failed with is the battery. I ordered it from a local vendor with warranty and not from aliexpress, but I have a feeling all they did was put a sticker on the same battery that is sold in chinese stores. And I overpaid 170 euros for it basically. The battery is 36v 12ah. I assume there is no way to convert torque sensing motor to pedal sensing? I also read that the motor can be programmed to be 500w, but I haven't tried that yet and doubt it would be of help. My only solution was to order a throttle, which now will require to get an insurance.

Hi,
I have both the Tongsheng and Bafang setups. Just some comments: My daughter loves her 750W Tongsheng mounted on her 2020 Trek Mariner 6. And yes you are correct: to get what you want, you need the throttle. I bought the Tongsheng setup online like you and then upgraded with the 860C display with ebrake and throttle controls. And I installed with the open source firmware which everyone says you have to have to unlock the power of the Tongsheng. This provides a more robust torque assist motor and a nice throttle when you don't want to peddle. However with that being said, it is not the easiest upgrade and setup to use the open source software is difficult because although there are a lot of online links to setting it up, you still have to do it by trial and error. The Tongsheng world would really take off if there was one online repository that you could go to to download specific profiles for the different version (on Version 1.1 now) for the type of riding and equipment that you had. For example: download a version 1.1 of the open source for someone who had a 500W motor, 48V battery, and did trail riding. At least it would get you into the ballpark and from there you could just tweek the settings. Bafang users already have this advantage. There is a lot more definitive help online for the Bafang and it's a lot easier to just download a user profile for your style of riding which is what I did. I have the BBSHD mounted on my 2008 Santa Cruz blur and initially it had way too much power that did not come on smoothly. Downloaded different profiles and found one that worked for me. Not that this helps you with your situation, but for other folks contemplating.....

 

[tomjasz]

If users work with a well respected TSDZ2 dealer, Eco Cycles, you will have fewer issues and good guidance.

 

[Hasaf]

I also have a TSDZ2 and have tried several things to get the performance where I wanted it. I added a throttle, which involved changing the controller. That seems to help a bit at the top, it adds about 2mph. However, it does very little at the bottom.

I normally start out with the torque sensor only and ride that way unless I hit a headwind. In the case of a headwind I use the throttle, it adds a little bit.

I ended up going with a 14t sprocket and a 52t chainring with a NuVinci hub. With this setup, I can ride at 20mph in most conditions. That said, the BaFang clearly outs out more power. There is just no way that I am going to believe that the TSDZ2 is a 750-watt motor.

 

[Lumr]

UPDATE TO MY EARLIER POST: Worked with David from Eco Cycles and he patiently helped me work out the bugs. Also took the time to explain to me more on the the TSDZ2 motor. OSF V1.1 now works beautifully and I definitely understand more about the V1.1 firmware and which parameters to tweak. My main problem was setting the power too low; i.e., 600W. I reset to defaults, re-calibrated torque settings and wheel size and it runs great!! V1.1 is definitely worth every penny.

 

[Lumr]

UPDATE TO MY EARLIER POST: Worked with David from Eco Cycles and he patiently helped me work out the bugs. Also took the time to explain to me more on the the TSDZ2 motor. OSF V1.1 now works beautifully and I definitely understand more about the V1.1 firmware and which parameters to tweak. My main problem was setting the power too low; i.e., 600W. I reset to defaults, re-calibrated torque settings and wheel size and it runs great!! V1.1 is definitely worth every penny.

Forgot to add...I have the 860C display and I have one screen set to monitor human power and motor power. With both motor and battery set at 18 amps, the motor consistently pegs 600-800 watts power when accelerating and continues to pull as cadence exceeds 90. This is from the 48V Tongsheng motor. Of course my daughter does not ride like this but I gave it several runs to test the power output.