Bosch owners, do you know this noise?

[DanInStPete]

This is from my 2019 Haibike FullSeven. I didn't notice it when I first got it about 6 weeks ago, but one day I heard it and I believe it is louder now.

At first I thought it might be the small pulley or the chain guide, but I put it on the bike stand and it sounds like it's coming from the motor.

In the video it is sort of a clicking sound over the whir of the motor. I watched Court's video review of this bike and the sound was not present when he did the motor noise test.

 

[Mulezen]

Some recent Trek Allant owners have been having a noise problem

POLL - Allant 9.9S Grinding Noise from Motor, are you affected?

I as well as few others have begun to experience an issue with the Allant 9.9S making odd noises from the motor. Just to keep all of out common interest and goals in 1 spot, and to have a further understanding of what is, what will and remains to be regarding this new problem, let's all chime...

electricbikereview.com

 

[DanInStPete]

It’s difficult to identify. Sounds like chain noise but at this point I don’t think it is.

 

[rich c]

Sounds mostly like the chain over the Sprocket Equalizing System (S.E.S.). Lube the chain, it'll quiet it down. My 2016 Full Seven has had that since day 1. Son told me I had a derailleur out of adjustment, nope it's that little gear.

Chain Noise?

So I've had my 2016 Full7 Bosch powered Haibike for about a year and 1400 miles of total enjoyment! Only issue is what seems like chain noise. It used to be so quiet, the only noise being the rubber hitting the road. But over the last several hundred miles it has developed a noise that only...

electricbikereview.com

A Couple of Bosch Drive System Issues

A friend was recently talking about the Bosch drive system with me (he rides a lot of off-road terrain) and we were discussing the smaller front sprocket that the system uses (apparently this part gets built by the bike manufacturer but Bosch specs three sizes... all relatively small, ideal for...

electricbikereview.com

 

[DanInStPete]

Rich thanks for the reply. I did find that first thread but there didn’t seem to be a resolution. Yours sounds like that?

I did clean and lube the chain, and just before I took that video. Maybe I need a wetter lube than Finish Line Dry...

 

[Alaskan]

I have one of offending Allant+9.9s bikes and it is a totally different noise. The Allant 9.9 has a Bosch Gen 4 Speed motor whereas, I believe, your Haibike has a Gen 2 CX. Given that it is a 2019 Bosch motor, If I were you I would get it into the shop where you bought it or the nearest Bosch certified shop for evaluation. Let them figure out what it is and replace it under warranty. Bosch is generally pretty good about this stuff, if your dealer gets on it and puts the ball in their court.

 

[Akrotiri]

I have one of offending Allant+9.9s bikes and it is a totally different noise. The Allant 9.9 has a Bosch Gen 2 Speed motor whereas, I believe, your Haibike has a Gen 2 CX. Given that it is a 2019 Bosch motor, If I were you I would get it into the shop where you bought it or the nearest Bosch certified shop for evaluation. Let them figure out what it is and replace it under warranty. Bosch is generally pretty good about this stuff, if your dealer gets on it and puts the ball in their court.

Are you sure your Allant has the Bosch Gen2 speed motor and not the Gen 4 Bosch? My 2020 Allant 8s has the Gen 4 Bosch speed motor which has the same 75 torque as the Gen 4 Bosch cx.

 

[Alaskan]

Are you sure your Allant has the Bosch Gen2 speed motor and not the Gen 4 Bosch? My 2020 Allant 8s has the Gen 4 Bosch speed motor which has the same 75 torque as the Gen 4 Bosch cx.

My bad, yes indeed the Allant has the gen four. Thank for catching that.

 

[steve mercier]

This is from my 2019 Haibike FullSeven. I didn't notice it when I first got it about 6 weeks ago, but one day I heard it and I believe it is louder now.

At first I thought it might be the small pulley or the chain guide, but I put it on the bike stand and it sounds like it's coming from the motor.

In the video it is sort of a clicking sound over the whir of the motor. I watched Court's video review of this bike and the sound was not present when he did the motor noise test.

Hard to tell where it is coming from exactly , but you could first try cleaning and degreasing your chain and front ring and see if it is chain suck and goes away? If it does go away I suggest switching to Squirt wax once you have it cleaned. Another possibility is you need to replace the front ring if it is damaged. I had damaged a front ring and it sounded somewhat like that. Either of these would be preferable problems to have and solve as opposed to more serious motor issues of course so hopefully that is all it is. Another thing you may be able to try on some bikes is to remove the ring and reverse it. If the noise stops you know that was the problem. I put on headphones and listened again and I think it is not the motor.

 

[DanInStPete]

Thanks all for the suggestions. I thought maybe something was loose inside the case and someone would recognize it, but maybe it actually is chain noise from the additional sprocket and guide. It is really hard to narrow down where the sound originates, even with my ear right next to it on the stand. I did clean and lube but maybe not well enough. I'll try it again.

Also Steve interesting thought on the chain ring. I did bump (slam) a log pretty hard one day on the drive side. I'll check that out as well.

 

[Alaskan]

The haibike front chain ring has an outer guard ring incorporated. If that is bent inwards the chain could be rubbing on it.

 

[Alaskan]

Bosch chainring with integrated protector

Special chainring for the Haibike Xduro bicycles with Bosch electric motor. One piece chainring and chainguard. Narrow-wide tooth for a perfect chain engagement.

www.tiendamtb.com

 

[steve mercier]

Bosch chainring with integrated protector

Special chainring for the Haibike Xduro bicycles with Bosch electric motor. One piece chainring and chainguard. Narrow-wide tooth for a perfect chain engagement.

www.tiendamtb.com

No reversing that one. Pricey too...ouch

 

[Alaskan]

No reversing that one. Pricey too...ouch

If you don't have the fancy one with the integrated outer ring guard, the Sram narrow wides can be purchased at Modern Bike. They are far more robustly built than the standard stamped sprocket and come with a spacer ring that is used to move the chain ring out 2mm. I only used these on my bikes and they last quit a bit longer and remain trouble free.

SRAM Chainring X-Sync EX1 Sprocket for Bosch Motors 18T Straight Steel Black

The EX1 drive train was designed specifically for the demands of electric-assist mountain bikes: a wide gear range with bigger jumps between gears and sturdy components to handle higher torque loads. Liberal use of features found on SRAM's high end MTB parts provide high value, quiet operation...

www.modernbike.com

 

[DanInStPete]

So everything looks perfect - chain, chain ring, sprockets, pulley. I cleaned with White Lightning and lubed with GT85 (rather than the Finish Line Dry I have been using). I also removed the chain guide next to the jockey pulley. This is the result:

Which is pretty much the same. I have found some references to people being annoyed with the noise from the Haibike jockey wheel (Sprocket Equalizing System, or SES), but I couldn't find any video. The only reference I have is Court's review, and the noise tests which start at around 22:00 here:

I do hear a similar sound in the beginning but it seems to go away.

So, maybe it's normal, and it's the jockey wheel. If so, it's surprising to me that more people aren't talking about it, because it's pretty loud. Significantly louder than the motor.

It's particularly loud coming from the Vado. That bike makes almost no sound whatsoever. It's freakishly quiet for an ebike...

I'll post in Haibike and see if anyone can verify.

 

[rich c]

So everything looks perfect - chain, chain ring, sprockets, pulley. I cleaned with White Lightning and lubed with GT85 (rather than the Finish Line Dry I have been using). I also removed the chain guide next to the jockey pulley. This is the result:

Which is pretty much the same. I have found some references to people being annoyed with the noise from the Haibike jockey wheel (Sprocket Equalizing System, or SES), but I couldn't find any video. The only reference I have is Court's review, and the noise tests which start at around 22:00 here:

I do hear a similar sound in the beginning but it seems to go away.

So, maybe it's normal, and it's the jockey wheel. If so, it's surprising to me that more people aren't talking about it, because it's pretty loud. Significantly louder than the motor.

It's particularly loud coming from the Vado. That bike makes almost no sound whatsoever. It's freakishly quiet for an ebike...

I'll post in Haibike and see if anyone can verify.

I told you my Full Seven has always had the noise. Surprised you didn't notice it more when you test rode it. I don't notice it at all when I'm thrashing on a single trail.

 

[DanInStPete]

I told you my Full Seven has always had the noise. Surprised you didn't notice when you test rode it.

You did Rich, you said it sounded like SES and mentioned lubing would quiet it down. Cleaned and fresh lubed again and it's still loud. If that's what it is I'll get used to it, just seems off to me.

 

[steve mercier]

You did Rich, you said it sounded like SES and mentioned lubing would quiet it down. Cleaned and fresh lubed again and it's still loud. If that's what it is I'll get used to it, just seems off to me.

Maybe try starting out on the highest and then the lowest gear. Is it different ( much less or absent ) on one extreme vs the other?

 

[mcmars]

I have a similar noise I suspect is the shot bearing on the SES sprocket. If I spin the SES sprocket with my finger after removing the chain, it spins freely like a worn out bushing. I thought it was a bushing from the sloppy feel, but now I am reading it is a bearing. Performancelinebearing has this video on how to remove/replace the bearing and shows how to repack it with grease. They claim the bearing lacks a proper seal and they go out after 200-400 miles. My bike has just under 200 miles and I am careful to not get water near the bearing, but I was surprised that it is already in need of grease or replacement. It may be a warranty issue, not sure yet, but betting it will be a normal wear and tear type deal (?). https://www.performancelinebearings.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/SES-sprocket-bearing.pdf

 

[DanInStPete]

I got pretty deep into this. I had communications with Performancelinebearings.com (Peter is awesome). After sending some photos we decided everything looked right. Many people told me it was normal, no one knew anything else to tell me, and I finally gave up. But guess what?

It's FIXED! I KNEW it was too darn loud, there's just no way it should sound like that! I wanted to sell the bike...

I started having some shifting problems and I couldn't get it properly indexed, so I took it to my mechanic. He found a minor cable routing issue, but most importantly he found that the chain was too long. He took out some links, and in addition to fixing my indexing issues, the SES pulley quieted by at least 75%. Apparently there wasn't enough tension on the chain and for whatever reason that was causing the excessive noise.

I can still hear that pulley a little, but NOTHING like before. I also do notice it gets a bit louder after a couple hours of riding so regular cleaning and lubrication is recommended (and Paul said not to use dry lube on bikes with SES, so I switched to Finish Line Wet).

I can't tell you how happy I am to have this figured out, it was really driving me nuts.