Battle of the Budget Full Suspension Bike

[Mr_Reality]

I have 2 bikes I am looking at and would like your feedback. A 2017 ATOM LYNX 4.8 27.5 PRO (used with 250 miles) vs a new 2019 Motobecane 27.5 HAL eBoost Pro. The specs on the bikes are both similar but with different motor manufacturers. The Atom is located several hours away and the motobecane is mail order so test riding is not really an option. I have not done much eMTB but would appreciate your feedback if this would be a good way to enter the market. I live in Northwest arkansas and we have some great mountain biking with great technical and rolling hills. I have some experience with folding ebikes we travel with and they have been great. Budget is important but I also don't want to buy something I will regret due to poor quality. The atom can be had for under $2k and the the motobecane is around $3400. Trying to justify if its really worth spending twice the price to go to one of the Big 3 manufactures. Thanks for your help and suggestions.

 

[LimboJim]

I just sold my Motobecane HAL eMTB after putting ~700 miles on it, but only because I bought a Commencal, also with Shimano e8000. The eBoost Pro is a great bike for the money; it's rare to find that motor on a well equipped, full suspension ebike for under $4k new.

I still have my Bulls Estream EVO FS3 27.5+ (~1.5k miles), which uses the same Brose motor as the Atom you're considering. Fabulous pedal assistance, extremely quiet and efficient. I feel that the middle assist levels of Brose and Shimano are similar, with the most "natural" feeling response on MTB trails amongst the mid-motors I've experienced extensively (Yamaha, Bosch, TranzX, Bafang).

The Atom's extra 100 watt hours might come in handy, but to me, the user-controlled customization and firmware update-ability that Shimano offers is awesome. To my knowledge, Brose, like Yamaha, offers zero updating (except for Specialized's and maybe Giant's eMTB lines). Bosch has updates, but they can only be done by dealers.

If you're 5'10"+ and considering a consumer-direct purchase, however, I'd urge you to look at this 2018 Commencal Origin (only available in L size). It came out shortly after I ordered my HAL (but 4 months before I received it), and for a few hundred bucks more, it's far better designed and equipped, IMO (comes with a dropper seatpost, for starters). After riding a Commencal a couple hundred miles so far, I can readily attest that it rides better than the HAL, too.

The Atom Lynx is a good deal, though, especially if it's in good shape and the battery's been properly maintained. Apologies if that adds to your dilemma!

 

[bob armani]

I just sold my Motobecane HAL eMTB after putting ~700 miles on it, but only because I bought a Commencal, also with Shimano e8000. The eBoost Pro is a great bike for the money; it's rare to find that motor on a well equipped, full suspension ebike for under $4k new.

I still have my Bulls Estream EVO FS3 27.5+ (~1.5k miles), which uses the same Brose motor as the Atom you're considering. Fabulous pedal assistance, extremely quiet and efficient. I feel that the middle assist levels of Brose and Shimano are similar, with the most "natural" feeling response on MTB trails amongst the mid-motors I've experienced extensively (Yamaha, Bosch, TranzX, Bafang).

The Atom's extra 100 watt hours might come in handy, but to me, the user-controlled customization and firmware update-ability that Shimano offers is awesome. To my knowledge, Brose, like Yamaha, offers zero updating (except for Specialized's and maybe Giant's eMTB lines). Bosch has updates, but they can only be done by dealers.

If you're 5'10"+ and considering a consumer-direct purchase, however, I'd urge you to look at this 2018 Commencal Origin (only available in L size). It came out shortly after I ordered my HAL (but 4 months before I received it), and for a few hundred bucks more, it's far better designed and equipped, IMO (comes with a dropper seatpost, for starters). After riding a Commencal a couple hundred miles so far, I can readily attest that it rides better than the HAL, too.

The Atom Lynx is a good deal, though, especially if it's in good shape and the battery's been properly maintained. Apologies if that adds to your dilemma!

Commencal - sweet bike for $3699.00US. I always was a big fan of this company and the build quality of their bikes. Top notch category.

 

[FlatSix911]

I just sold my Motobecane HAL eMTB after putting ~700 miles on it, but only because I bought a Commencal, also with Shimano e8000. The eBoost Pro is a great bike for the money; it's rare to find that motor on a well equipped, full suspension ebike for under $4k new.

I still have my Bulls Estream EVO FS3 27.5+ (~1.5k miles), which uses the same Brose motor as the Atom you're considering. Fabulous pedal assistance, extremely quiet and efficient. I feel that the middle assist levels of Brose and Shimano are similar, with the most "natural" feeling response on MTB trails amongst the mid-motors I've experienced extensively (Yamaha, Bosch, TranzX, Bafang).

The Atom's extra 100 watt hours might come in handy, but to me, the user-controlled customization and firmware update-ability that Shimano offers is awesome. To my knowledge, Brose, like Yamaha, offers zero updating (except for Specialized's and maybe Giant's eMTB lines). Bosch has updates, but they can only be done by dealers.

If you're 5'10"+ and considering a consumer-direct purchase, however, I'd urge you to look at this 2018 Commencal Origin (only available in L size). It came out shortly after I ordered my HAL (but 4 months before I received it), and for a few hundred bucks more, it's far better designed and equipped, IMO (comes with a dropper seatpost, for starters). After riding a Commencal a couple hundred miles so far, I can readily attest that it rides better than the HAL, too.

The Atom Lynx is a good deal, though, especially if it's in good shape and the battery's been properly maintained. Apologies if that adds to your dilemma!

I am looking to purchase another eBike and see that you have owned both a HAL e and Atom Lynx.
Any preference between the two bikes with the Black Friday deals going on this week... thanks

ATOM LYNX 6 27.5 PRO $1,980

CRAZYDEAL - Crazy Lenny's E-Bikes

www.crazylennysebikes.com

HAL e27PLUS $2,473

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products...-hal-e27plus-electric-mountain-bikes-29er.htm

 

[emtbdude]

Nice find!

The motobecane has much more modern, aggressive geometry: shorter chain stays and shorter head tube.

The Shimano motor probably has more power than the brose mid drive.

The atom frame looks awful. The motobecane is a much more contemporary design.

 

[FlatSix911]

Nice find!

The motobecane has much more modern, aggressive geometry: shorter chain stays and shorter head tube.

The Shimano motor probably has more power than the brose mid drive.

The atom frame looks awful. The motobecane is a much more contemporary design.

Perfect, thanks for your feedback. Do you have any other advice on the specifications... XT vs. SLX?

Brose S vs. Shimano E7000... 90nm vs. 60mn torque? Integrated Battery 600Wh vs. 418Wh range?

Bottom line... is the 2020 Hal-e worth approximately $500 more than the 2017 Atom Lynx?

 

[Feliz]

The BH bike is a dated design and was updated in 2018. Brose S is in a different class than the Shimano E7000, the E8000 even has less power than the Brose.

 

[emtbdude]

Torque specs on paper mean nothing. You have to actually ride it. Shimano motors are more powerful. You will regret buying a 2016 or 2017 brose motor. They are grossly underpowered.

SLX works very well, actually. The brakes are good but xt are more powerful.

$2400 is an excellent price. The motobecane is clearly superior as a bicycle. The Atom is now 3-4 seasons out of date.

I wonder if the stock Shimano battery can be upgraded to 500 watt hours? 418 watt hours should be good for 2 to 2.5 hours riding on a full charge, if you are a very fast rider. It'll probably last closer to 3 hours if you are a novice. Still 500 watt hours is preferable.

The BH bike is a dated design and was updated in 2018. Brose S is in a different class than the Shimano E7000, the E8000 even has less power than the Brose.

I've ridden the most recent brose motors, as of April 2019. They are good motors but are not superior to Shimano in power. Some people say Yamaha motors are underpowered, but I've had good experiences with Yamaha, Bosch, and Shimano motors.

The e7000 is a lower series with less torque. The e8000 is highest rated for torque in shimano's line.

 

[Feliz]

The Brose S is superior to the Shimano E8000, so is the Yamaha. I didn't just test ride one I own them. Surprise.........you're not always right. The Atom in the ad is a seven year old design, of course it's dated. The Hal looks dated as well. I competed in mountain and have been riding mountain bikes for 40 years, I value my opinion more than I do yours. Find someone else to argue with.

 

[emtbdude]

The Brose S is superior to the Shimano E8000, so is the Yamaha. I didn't just test ride one I own them.

LOL, but you have no evidence to support this claim. Owning something doesn't tell us anything about the quality of a product. You own a yugo, but don't own a Ferrari. The yugo is clearly faster because you own it. WRONG, LMAO!

.........you're not always right.

Whoever made that claim? I certainly didn't. It doesn't address the fact that you not only have zero proof your claim above, and it certainly doesn't excuse your ridiculously flawed logic, i.e., ownership of a product proves it's superiority.

The Atom in the ad is a seven year old design, of course it's dated.

That much is obvious.

The Hal looks dated as well. I competed in mountain and have been riding mountain bikes for 40 years, I value my opinion more than I do yours. Find someone else to argue with.

it "looks" dated? LOL. You are clearly talking out of your backside. It has a four bar, Horst link design being used on many outstanding full suspension bicycles. The chain stays are not especially long when you take into account the additional space occupied by a mid motor. The head and seat angles are not as "up to date" but not so much as to make the bikes unrideable. Some people prefer a steeper head angle for faster steering, others prefer slacker for more stability. Head angles have varied from 72* to 64* over time, and still vary a lot in latest year models.

The SLX group is a year out of date, but it's still a very good component group. The fork and shock are good quality, name brand Rock Shox. 140/140 is a solid choice in suspension travel.

Your opinion doesn't mean anything unless you can point to specifics to back up your claim.

All of this ridiculous huffing and puffing about riding for 40 years doesn't mean anything. You have to have actual facts about the bikes themselves to offer anything approximating a meaningful opinion, which you clearly do not have.

Yeah, try updating everything with 12 speed SLX, XT brakes, higher end Fox 34 forks etc, Shimano e8000 motor, factory sponsored riders, loaners to the mtb press corps, freebies to youtubers, and now the bike costs $5000 rather than $2400.

It's a $2400 bike: you can't get top of the line spec at this price. The fact that it gives you as much quality as it does is pretty darn amazing. Stop being a hater.

The fact that you're so jealous of this bike, with it's superior spec and far lower price compared to your bike is proof enough it's a very good value. Thanks for your recommendation!

 

[LimboJim]

I am looking to purchase another eBike and see that you have owned both a HAL e and Atom Lynx.
Any preference between the two bikes with the Black Friday deals going on this week... thanks

ATOM LYNX 6 27.5 PRO $1,980

CRAZYDEAL - Crazy Lenny's E-Bikes

www.crazylennysebikes.com

HAL e27PLUS $2,473

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products...-hal-e27plus-electric-mountain-bikes-29er.htm

Never owned an Atom Lynx. My Bulls had the same Brose motor as the Atom. And the Motobecane I owned had the e8000 motor. I'll still offer my opinion, since you asked: the Atom at that price is a better value, even with Lenny's $200 shipping charge.

 

[Feliz]

Never owned an Atom Lynx. My Bulls had the same Brose motor as the Atom. And the Motobecane I owned had the e8000 motor. I'll still offer my opinion, since you asked: the Atom at that price is a better value, even with Lenny's $200 shipping charge.

How do you like your Commencal? I'm considering getting one they have great deals on one and two year old bikes, with better specs than any of these bikes. I'd like to go to the factory to pick one up, riding in the Swiss Alps would be cool.

Edit: Just checked both the USA and Canadian websites and there's 10% off everything for black Friday. Their prices are already good being direct to consumer and they always have great deals on past year models and now with another 10%, mmm.

 

[emtbdude]

Commencals and Motobecanes are not directly comparable. They operate on very different business models. Commencal is a full fledged DTC brand that's all in on supporting bicycling. They sponsor factory riders, they sponsor demo days, and send out dozens of loaners every year to the standard bike press reviewers such as bike radar and bike magazine.

They do their best to stay on top of the latest geometry trends (fads?) so their frame design is much closer to the industry average than motobecane.

Motobecane cuts costs ruthlessly: no phone support, limited email support, no pro team, no demos, no test rides, no loaners to the bike press, and there is literally zero R&D. They use generic frames across multiple lines. They sell in very large volume.

It goes without saying that Commencals are better bikes compared to motobecane. But they also charge significantly more. And direct comparisons are difficult since Motobecane has close ties with Shimano whereas Commencal specs SRAM almost exclusively.

I've always urged caution with regards to evaluating motobecane pricing. They are still using outdated 11 speed drivetrains from Shimano, and have done so for three years running. They really needed to step up to 12 speed for 2020 but are sticking with 11 speed Shimano.

You have to choose your poison if you are choosing between motobecane and commencal. Do you want outdated 11 speed Shimano, or do you want low end SRAM SX Eagle? Even mid-range GX Eagle is clunky, slow and loud.

Commencal makes some good frames but their close relationship with SRAM brings their bikes down a notch.

 

[LimboJim]

How do you like your Commencal? I'm considering getting one they have great deals on one and two year old bikes, with better specs than any of these bikes. I'd like to go to the factory to pick one up, riding in the Swiss Alps would be cool.

Edit: Just checked both the USA and Canadian websites and there's 10% off everything for black Friday. Their prices are already good being direct to consumer and they always have great deals on past year models and now with another 10%, mmm.

I freakin' ADORE my 2018 Commencal MetaPower Race Fox. By far the best eMTB I've experienced, and I've racked up hundreds of trail miles on several high quality full suspension ebikes over the last few years. The attention they give to things like pivots and hubs shows me that they take no shortcuts in building their bikes, and they're on par with other brands selling for 30-40% more. I believe you have quite a stable, and would be interested in your perspective if you get one.

 

[Feliz]

I freakin' ADORE my 2018 Commencal MetaPower Race Fox. By far the best eMTB I've experienced, and I've racked up hundreds of trail miles on several high quality full suspension ebikes over the last few years. The attention they give to things like pivots and hubs shows me that they take no shortcuts in building their bikes, and they're on par with other brands selling for 30-40% more. I believe you have quite a stable, and would be interested in your perspective if you get one.

Thanks for the input! Does your bike have 27.5 or 29 wheels? All my mountain bikes are 27.5 I think I'm due for a 29er. I'm thinking of grabbing a 2018 Meta Power only it's a Rockshock bike with an awesome price. Selection is limited and your version is no longer available. Does yours have the SRAM EX1 eight speed?

 

[emtbdude]

Commencal riders are on fire: Amaury Pierron has won multiple World Cup races, and Myriam Nicole is the reigning DH world champion.

The question is, are commencals well-suited for the beginning recreational rider or even average rider? A combination of 29" wheels, long travel, and reputedly one of the fastest rear suspension designs around, could get a rider with modest skills into trouble very quickly. You could find yourself riding relatively smoothly through technical sections with much more speed than you normally would, and if you push a little too far past your skill level, well....

Also, commencal and most all longer travel bikes will not pedal as well uphill. If you are out of shape as a beginner or weekend warrior, these bikes could tax you more than a bike with more modest suspension travel.

I've had so much fun riding 140/140 bikes: I think they are a nice balance point between xc bikes and dh, but I don't know, a 160/150 commencal might change my mind. Hopefully I can hop onto a demo in the spring.

 

[bob armani]

I am looking to purchase another eBike and see that you have owned both a HAL e and Atom Lynx.
Any preference between the two bikes with the Black Friday deals going on this week... thanks

ATOM LYNX 6 27.5 PRO $1,980

CRAZYDEAL - Crazy Lenny's E-Bikes

www.crazylennysebikes.com

HAL e27PLUS $2,473

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products...-hal-e27plus-electric-mountain-bikes-29er.htm

Those are 2 nice picks! I would think you might owe them a test ride to make a final decision on which one to purchase. I am not familiar with the Hal line of bikes. That was one of my options while shopping, and I opted for the Haibike instead. Perhaps Hal is also a close competitor?? Happy shopping.

 

[bob armani]

I am looking to purchase another eBike and see that you have owned both a HAL e and Atom Lynx.
Any preference between the two bikes with the Black Friday deals going on this week... thanks

ATOM LYNX 6 27.5 PRO $1,980

CRAZYDEAL - Crazy Lenny's E-Bikes

www.crazylennysebikes.com

HAL e27PLUS $2,473

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products...-hal-e27plus-electric-mountain-bikes-29er.htm

The Hal you have indicated in your post comes with the e7000 mid-drive motor. Will you be missing additional needed torque as you would get from the e8000 motor, or are they close in overall performance for your riding style?

Perhaps this is a typo in the comparison table below?

eBike Compare​	Motobecane HAL e27PLUS​	Trek Powerfly Plus​	Specialized Turbo FSR Levo 6​
Price​	SALE $2699* (List $7295)​	$4999 +Local Tax​	$9500 +Local Tax​
Frame Material​	Hydroformed Aluminum​	Hydroformed Aluminum​	Hydroformed Aluminum​
Electric Motor System​	Shimano e6100 MidDrive​	Bosch Performance CX MidDrive​	Specialized Branded MidDrive​
Motor/Battery​	Shimano 250W/ 418WH​	Bosch 250W/ 500WH​	Specialized 250W/ 504WH​
Derailleur/Shifters​	Shimano SLX/M7000 11sp​	Mix Shimano XT / SLX 11sp​	SRAM XX 11sp​
Suspension Fork​	Rockshox REVELATION​	Rockshox Yari​	Rockshox Pike​
Front / Rear Travel​	140mm / 140mm​	130mm / 130mm​	140mm / 140mm​
Brakeset​	Shimano M6000​	Deore​	SRAM Guide RSC​
Crankset​	Shimano E8000M/E7000 DRIVE​	Miranda Delta​	House Brand​
Wheels​	WTB TCS Tubeless​	House Brand​	House Brand​
Tires​	Maxxis REKON+ 120tpi TLR3C​	House Brand​	House Brand​
Price​	$2699+ FREE Ship 48*​	$4999 + Local Tax​	$9500 + Local Tax​

 

[bob armani]

Torque specs on paper mean nothing. You have to actually ride it. Shimano motors are more powerful. You will regret buying a 2016 or 2017 brose motor. They are grossly underpowered.

SLX works very well, actually. The brakes are good but xt are more powerful.

$2400 is an excellent price. The motobecane is clearly superior as a bicycle. The Atom is now 3-4 seasons out of date.

I wonder if the stock Shimano battery can be upgraded to 500 watt hours? 418 watt hours should be good for 2 to 2.5 hours riding on a full charge, if you are a very fast rider. It'll probably last closer to 3 hours if you are a novice. Still 500 watt hours is preferable.




I've ridden the most recent brose motors, as of April 2019. They are good motors but are not superior to Shimano in power. Some people say Yamaha motors are underpowered, but I've had good experiences with Yamaha, Bosch, and Shimano motors.

The e7000 is a lower series with less torque. The e8000 is highest rated for torque in shimano's line.

I can vouch for Yamaha performance. Far from being under-powered on any level. The torquey motor will take anything you put in front of it hands down.

 

[bob armani]

Commencal riders are on fire: Amaury Pierron has won multiple World Cup races, and Myriam Nicole is the reigning DH world champion.

The question is, are commencals well-suited for the beginning recreational rider or even average rider? A combination of 29" wheels, long travel, and reputedly one of the fastest rear suspension designs around, could get a rider with modest skills into trouble very quickly. You could find yourself riding relatively smoothly through technical sections with much more speed than you normally would, and if you push a little too far past your skill level, well....

Also, commencal and most all longer travel bikes will not pedal as well uphill. If you are out of shape as a beginner or weekend warrior, these bikes could tax you more than a bike with more modest suspension travel.

I've had so much fun riding 140/140 bikes: I think they are a nice balance point between xc bikes and dh, but I don't know, a 160/150 commencal might change my mind. Hopefully I can hop onto a demo in the spring.
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