Am I crazy to consider an EV?
- Thread starter oilerlord
- Start date
J.R.
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Piedmont Highlands
I've been reading about EV for a long time as well and an issue that never seems talked about on the auto side of it is that the batteries last about half as long with fast charging and all the auto owners insist on having it available. So that $5000.00 battery, instead of lasting 7 to 10 years, 3 to 5 years. That adds significantly to maintenance costs. We here at EBR Community talk about fast charging killing batteries all the time, when will auto manufactures start putting this type of information out in front? Because, lets face it the general public aren't as crazy about knowing what a battery will do as we areI find it ironic that we started our journey with Neo Jumper 650B and are thinking of EV's
I too, spend a lot of time reading up on the material from mynissanleaf forum.
I think with the launch of Chevy Volt 2016 model and 2016 leaf, we will see dramatic changes in the CPO prices. I think you're aware of this, Leaf had major battery problems in Arizona due to heat. The 2015 models come with the lizard battery which is much more resistant to temp +/- fluctuation. The replacement pack on a leaf is $5200 (for a 23KWhr). If you can get a MY2013+ with 12 bars, it's a no-brainer.
oilerlord
Member
Well, I've come full circle. I installed 9.2kW of solar last August, and as of today, now own a Mercedes B-Class electric car. While on vacation in California, we had the opportunity to drive a bunch of EV's including ones from Ford, Kia, Mercedes, and of course - Tesla. The Mercedes offered the best overall package for the money, and we like that Tesla supplied the motor & battery for the car.
So, after previously debating & criticizing the economic and environmental benefits of EV's with Court, I've embraced it. Just like the bikes, I'm importing the car from the US because Mercedes doesn't offer the car in Canada, and even if they did, there's no way I'd be able to buy a nearly new 2014 car for less than 50% of MSRP.
So, after previously debating & criticizing the economic and environmental benefits of EV's with Court, I've embraced it. Just like the bikes, I'm importing the car from the US because Mercedes doesn't offer the car in Canada, and even if they did, there's no way I'd be able to buy a nearly new 2014 car for less than 50% of MSRP.
Ravi Kempaiah
Well-Known Member
- Region
- Canada
- City
- Halifax
Dave,
Every time you visit here, it's quantum leap in your EV journey
Congratulations on your new Mercedes!
oilerlord
Member
The gasoline B250 sold in Canada is the same chassis as the electric B250e sold in the US. Consumables such as wipers, brake pads, cabin filters, lights, etc, are interchangeable between the two cars so I'll have easy access to those. I am rolling the dice with warranty service however because our local dealers don't have the equipment or training to service the electric powertrain. So, worst case if anything goes sideways there is the possibility that I'm putting it on a flatbed for a trip to Seattle. There was a software problem with a few of these cars suddenly stalling, which seems to have been fixed via a software update.
From the forum I've been following, problems have been very few but then again, there aren't a lot of these cars on the road either. We'll see. Because of regenerative braking, and because I do tend to hypermile a bit, I doubt that my brake pads will ever need replacing.
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J.R.
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Piedmont Highlands
Fantastic! When you were test driving the cars, did you get the impression that the asking prices were firm, or can deals be made for lower than sticker prices? Thanks for posting your experience.
oilerlord
Member
In my experience, it depends on the car, how much the dealership paid for it, and how long it's been sitting on the lot. I have an advantage of still having access to dealer auction sites (a friend of mine is a dealer), so I know what dealers are buying them for (for my car between $21,000-$23,000). Dealers still have to pay auction admin fees and transportation from the auction, so they also pay at least another $1000 to get the car to their dealership along with all the other paperwork, detailing, and stuff they need to do to get it frontline ready.
For the car I bought, it was a Mercedes "corporate car" meaning that it was leased or loaned to an employee. Manufacturers do that in order to get their EV numbers up in the effort to maximize ZEV credits. It was sold at auction back in February, and the dealership likely started out pricing the car at a $4000 profit. When the car has been sitting for three months or more, the dealership usually discounts the car to the point they are making ~$1000 on it. Most dealerships finance every car they have on the lot, so the longer they sit there, the more motivated they are to sell it. Everything is negotiable of course, down to the point where it makes sense to dump it if only to break even.
Long winded answer. Hope it helps.
For the car I bought, it was a Mercedes "corporate car" meaning that it was leased or loaned to an employee. Manufacturers do that in order to get their EV numbers up in the effort to maximize ZEV credits. It was sold at auction back in February, and the dealership likely started out pricing the car at a $4000 profit. When the car has been sitting for three months or more, the dealership usually discounts the car to the point they are making ~$1000 on it. Most dealerships finance every car they have on the lot, so the longer they sit there, the more motivated they are to sell it. Everything is negotiable of course, down to the point where it makes sense to dump it if only to break even.
Long winded answer. Hope it helps.
Nirmala
Active Member
I considered an electric or at least a plug-in hybrid when we shopped for our current car, a regular hybrid Prius. The main other contender was a Chevy Volt. But we do not have solar and cannot add it as we rent our home. When I calculated the actual CO2 emissions considering that here in Arizona, a good portion of our electricity is generated by coal, the Prius came in with much lower average overall emissions per mile. So that, and the fact that the up front cost was lower made the decision easy for us. If we had solar panels on our roof, I would love to have a car that could at least go 30 miles or so on pure electric.
I do think the plug-in hybrid approach makes a lot of sense if you want to make longer trips without range anxiety. Maybe in a few more years when there are more charging stations, the pure electric car will sound better to me. But there is still the challenge of the time spent at the charging station. I am definitely not used to spending a half hour re-charging for every couple of hundred miles on a long trip, and possibly longer if there is a line of cars waiting at a charging station when you get there. If we were going to get a second car for local driving only, the electric would be a no-brainer.
I do think the plug-in hybrid approach makes a lot of sense if you want to make longer trips without range anxiety. Maybe in a few more years when there are more charging stations, the pure electric car will sound better to me. But there is still the challenge of the time spent at the charging station. I am definitely not used to spending a half hour re-charging for every couple of hundred miles on a long trip, and possibly longer if there is a line of cars waiting at a charging station when you get there. If we were going to get a second car for local driving only, the electric would be a no-brainer.
George S.
Well-Known Member
It really does get complicated. The smaller the vehicle, the fewer of these impacts. An ebike has a battery 1% the size of the Teslas coming out.
http://www.wired.com/2016/03/teslas-electric-cars-might-not-green-think/
http://www.wired.com/2016/03/teslas-electric-cars-might-not-green-think/
oilerlord
Member
For me, it's more about sticking it to the man, and lowering monthly operating costs than having any delusions that I'm saving the planet. The "complicated" thing about solar & EV's is the dubious financial case that you save money doing it. I bought and installed all my solar gear mostly on my own, and inexpensively...it worked out to about $1.65 per watt - and that without any rebates (I'm from Alberta, none are offered). Even at that price, I'm still looking at ~9 years for the solar to pay for itself. Filling the car with electrons instead of gasoline will accelerate that ROI. Since last August, I've exported ~ 3.5mW to the grid, and though I do get paid for the power I export to the grid, it's a ripoff...I'm way further ahead using that electricity to propel a car. In a way, the car's battery has a similar function as Tesla's Powerwall - allowing me to store and use power at a later time. Assuming most of the car's energy will come from my rooftop, I figure that we'll save at least $5,000 per year on fuel & maintenance.
Nirmala
Active Member
Good points. And anything that reduces the miles you travel in your car, or better yet makes a car unnecessary altogether, is going to make a bigger difference than the particular type of car. I'm happy to say that our Prius is 4 1/2 years old and only has 24K miles on it.
Nirmala
Active Member
And in the meantime, you are helping at least some to save the planet....
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