4 Bike 500w Rear Hub Motor Builds from Greenergy

[AHicks]

I built 2 bikes and learned the "it ain't that much cheaper" lesson. The problem is, they spoiled me as I had chosen to build them with KT controllers and displays - which are very user configurable. What I didn't know at the time was that's almost unheard in the over the counter stuff. I bought a Rad City to replace the too tall 29'er I had built. It wasn't until after riding it for a while that I realized the display and controller were hopelessly locked down in a configuration I just couldn't stand. The soft start and trip meter reseting every time the power is cycled made me nuts. So I installed a "kit" from Amazon, replacing all the electronics on the 6 week old bike, everything but the battery.

Point being, that even including the price of the aftermarket kit, I still had a pretty inexpensive bike that was easily configured to my way of thinking/doing things!

 

[tomjasz]

I built 2 bikes and learned the "it ain't that much cheaper" lesson.

EEYUP! As I've written before, by the time I had the new wheel, MAC, Grin Controller, EM3ev battery and all the better to best quality components my build from a bare frame up is easily a $2500 bike. More sustainable and I'm happier with it than any off the shelf bike...it's not a cheap route.

 

[tomjasz]

For the controller, it might be worth a call to Grin in Vancouver,

The advantage of being the same controller is capable of multiple voltages, 36V, 48V, and 52V. AND they will usually quiet down the motor too!

 

[AHicks]

EEYUP! As I've written before, by the time I had the new wheel, MAC, Grin Controller, EM3ev battery and all the better to best quality components my build from a bare frame up is easily a $2500 bike. More sustainable and I'm happier with it than any off the shelf bike...it's not a cheap route.

Thomas, with the Mac 12t motor I've installed recently, I'm close, but still haven spent quite that much on this bike.

I am kicking around the idea of a new bike though, with more battery, the Grin controller, and a GMAC 10t motor. Can't help myself. I'm absolutely fascinated by the potential of variable regen in the hilly area I spend a lot of time riding in.

 

[tomjasz]

Grin controller, and a GMAC 10t motor. I can't help myself. I'm absolutely fascinated by the potential of variable regen in the hilly area I spend a lot of time riding in.

Oh, I can completely understand. The only way I've become happy with a build is to have tried all styles of kits. I thought GMAC will take a back seat to my first commercial mid-drive (Bosch et l). But now after riding a couple no throttle really stinks. AND regardless of ALL the opinions, they are anemic. I've become accustomed to beating traffic crossing the roadways with a quick flip. I keep looking for that great deal but my BBS01B is quicker.

 

[AHicks]

Oh, I can completely understand. The only way I've become happy with a build is to have tried all styles of kits. I thought GMAC will take a back seat to my first commercial mid-drive (Bosch et l). But now after riding a couple no throttle really stinks. AND regardless of ALL the opinions, they are anemic. I've become accustomed to beating traffic crossing the roadways with a quick flip. I keep looking for that great deal but my BBS01B is quicker.

When it comes to torque, the kind that gets you moving right now (even those of us that might be considered over sized loads!), I can't see myself going backwards any time soon. The ability to blast across a busy street way high on my list too! Best part is, when you aren't needing a lot of power, they aren't using any more than any other system might be using. Very effecient for the most part, with a ton of power on demand. Now, add the potential for regen on a gear driven bike. The only way you're going to top that is with VARIABLE regen! -Al

 

[BADsDAD]

Well, so deciding that I wanted to have a spare most everything and would really rather keep my Rockhopper as it was intended, and given that the wheel they sent me was cracked and I have to open a case with ebay to get some sort of refund/replacement... I decided to order a BD Fatbike with the Bafang setup already installed to add to the stable. BD's Garland TX warehouse is about 15mi from me, so hopefully I'll get this one in 2-3 days like I have with all the others I have ordered from them. This is premium Texas weather and I want to ride!!

This will give me a spare kit that I can draw from to fix the bikes as they have issues with either the Battery/Controller/Hub motor etc, without having to wait for the slow boat from China like I am now for the controller that was bad. And, it's a 1x10 so we'll see how that works out.

I intend to replace the included crappy Chinese battery with the Samsung one that I had purchased from Greenergy to up it from 11.5 to 17.5AH. But, I'll keep the exploder for a spare JIC..


Anyway, we'll see how this one works:

Frame	ADVANCED HYDROFORMED ALLOY 6061 FRAME, W/DISC MOUNT, TIG WELD, replaceable rear derailleur hanger, H2O bosses, T/T-35MM, S/T-31.8MM, D/T-44M, Rear Rack Seatstay Brazeons, 190mm symmetrical rear, Tapered HT
Fork	FRONT SUSPENSION, 120MM RST RENEGADE TNL COIL W/THRU AXLE, ALLOY BLACK, Tapered Steerer Tube, 150mm OLN
Crankset	SAMOX 32T ALLOY BKx175MM ALLOY BLACK CRANK
Bottom Bracket	SAMOX EB2403 120x1.37
Pedals	VP BLACK PLASTIC BODY W/STEEL BLACK CAGE
Front Derailleur	n/a
Rear Derailleur	SRAM RD-GX BLACK
Shifters	SRAM SL-GX 10-SP ALLOY BLACK
Cassette	SRAM PG-1030 11-36T
Chain	KMC E11S NPBK
Hubs	F/HUB : KT-M9CF ALLOY BLACK W/KT204B ALLOY BLACK 150mm THRUAXLEQR.
Spokes	14G STEEL BLACK W/BRASS NIPPLE
Rims	26"x32H HJC P-80 WIDTH 80MM W/BIG HOLES, ALLOY BLACK
Tires/Tubes	26"x4.25 VEE RUBBER BULLDOZER, 72TPI TIRE
Brakes/Levers	BRAKE: SHIMANO M365 HYDRAULIC DISC BRAKE W/SM-RT56S 160MM ROTOR. LEVER: SHIMANO BL-M365 ALLOY BLACK
Headset	VP BLACK W/ ALLOY BLACK CAP
Handlebar	KALLOY LowRise W:700MMx9 DEGREES, ALLOY BLACK
Stem	KALLOY EXT:90MM(14"~16")/110MM(18"~22")x7 DEGREES, ALLOY BLACK
Tape/Grip	WTB BLACK/GRAY KRATON
Saddle	WTB SPEED V SPORT SE, BLACK
Seat Post	Micro Adjust 400MM, ALLOY BLACK aluminum
Seat Post Clamp	ALLOY SEAT CLAMP
Sizes	See pull down
EBike DriveTrain	REAR MOTOR : BAFANG 750W/RATED VOLTAGE 48V. HMI : BAFANG ADVANCED LCD/48V/5 POWER LEVELS SPEED SENSOR : BAFANG SR.PA01.12.S. . CONTROLLER : BAFANG CR.S107.1000.SN 48V/SPEED MAX 32km/h. THROTTLE CONTROL : BAFANG 130X WITH CONNECTOR EB.1T2.AX. LEFT SIDE BATTERY/CHARGER : PHYLION SF-06 SMART 48V/11.6Ah (557WH)

 

[tomjasz]

crappy Chinese battery

aren't they all?

 

[BADsDAD]

LOL, yes.. I suppose so.. But at least the ones I already bought have Samsung cells and not some no-name China cells, but I am sure the bms is junk.

As usual, if I were to do it all again.. I'd buy EM3EV batteries and go with parts you have recommended.. I still think the controller situation is something of a mess in this world.

BTW, is it necessary to match the controller advertised wattage with the motor? i.e. can I use a 1000w rated controller with a 500w hub motor? I mean, I know I can't do the reverse.

 

[tomjasz]

LOL, yes.. I suppose so.. But at least the ones I already bought have Samsung cells and not some no-name China cells, but I am sure the bms is junk.

As usual, if I were to do it all again.. I'd buy EM3EV batteries and go with parts you have recommended.. I still think the controller situation is something of a mess in this world.

BTW, is it necessary to match the controller advertised wattage with the motor? i.e. can I use a 1000w rated controller with a 500w hub motor? I mean, I know I can't do the reverse.

I have a couple of EM3ev controllers and ebikes.ca controllers. Ebikes.ca is far superior. I like that I can run either my 36v,48v, or 52v with the same controller from Grin.

I use a 12FET 1500W controller to run 36V 500W. It needs to be programmed whereas the Grin just works, but the choices ar by Amp rating. https://www.ebikes.ca/product-info/grinfineon.html

 

[BADsDAD]

Interesting.. I ask because it looks like the controller on the BD fat bike I just ordered is also un-googleable CONTROLLER : BAFANG CR.S107.1000.SN

 

[stanmiller]

EEYUP! As I've written before, by the time I had the new wheel, MAC, Grin Controller, EM3ev battery and all the better to best quality components my build from a bare frame up is easily a $2500 bike. More sustainable and I'm happier with it than any off the shelf bike...it's not a cheap route.

But what you're describing is a bespoke electic bike. Built with premium hardware and is unique. Which is very cool. Bespoke anything carries a cost premium be that clothing, cars, etc.

My Townie and Mongoose are basic kitted bikes and perform well on a budget.

 

[stanmiller]

... but I am sure the bms is junk.

How do you know the BMS is junk? Have you opened the battery case and identified the BMS board and manufacture?

The incentive for Bluenergy/Greenergy is to provide quality budget kits. Otherwise, word will travel and they'll be out-of-business. Greenergia can just list a different vendor kit.

I would contact Bluenergy direct about the controller and bum wheel. Get in the customer service chat and ask for Ada Chang. Explain the situation. She will take care of you.

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Thomas reminds us that warranty and service are important. But you find a lot of threads here where premium bikes and premium parts need warranty repairs. I'd rather have quality parts and not have to rely on a warranty. For a vendor without a dealer network their incentive is to provide quality such that returns and repairs are the exception. A vendor with a robust dealer network doesn't have the same incentive.

Also, nice looking bike from BikesDirect.

 

[tomjasz]

How do you know the BMS is junk?

Guaranteed to be a $10-$12 featureless BMS. Likely no balance function. That's typical, in the dozen or so packs I've been inside. One well-known vendor claims premium BMS, but once opened the same $12 BMS UPP and other budget battery builders used. That's not necessarily bad, but it is a cheap BMS.

I've had/have a few.

 

[AHicks]

But what you're describing is a bespoke electic bike. Built with premium hardware and is unique. Which is very cool. Bespoke anything carries a cost premium be that clothing, cars, etc.

My Townie and Mongoose are basic kitted bikes and perform well on a budget.

BUT, if you were to use "lessons learned" from building those bikes, then riding them for awhile, would your next bike duplicate them exactly, or would you have a tendency to work on some sore spots?

This is where the MAC's I've seen used are finding traction. Same with high(er) quality batteries. Not necessarily used to build those first bikes, but much more likely to be used when pulling on experienced gained from building and riding those first bikes.

You can use high quality parts like those without breaking the bank too. Like Thomas mentioned, you can have a LOT of bike for 2500.

 

[Browneye]

The Roll is still rolling...will post some pics tomorrow...
We have been enjoying the &@@&$ out of our ebikes.

 

[Browneye]

EDIT: Oops...I thought I was posting in the other thread: Turning your bike into an electric bike: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/turn-your-bike-into-an-electric-bike.24816/

EDIT2: I weighed it... 55.4 pounds.


As promised...
We were headed out for some bike time this weekend, got a couple of updated shots of the Roll conversion.
It has about 150 -200 miles on it now and works perfectly. She's really gotten the hang of it and loves it. At her pace it looks like about 50 mile range.
I wonder what kind of cells they put in the pack - this one was part of the kit from Greenergy/Bluenergy - China.

I'm still waiting on a shimano 7sp pistol-shifter, slow-boat from China. The only downside to the integrated shifter/brake on it is the gear-shift lever is so far away, the brake lever a bit as well. Otherwise the mag switch for motor cut off works fine. The left side shifter got deleted, so the Bafang brake lever assembly works great there.











She loves her Mirrycle cycle mirror - I got one for mine too. It's too hard to turn around and look behind you.

 

[BADsDAD]

Nice build!! Here is the Greenergy info on the 48V Hailong packs:


48V 12Ah Specification:
Normal Voltage: 48V
Rated Capacity:12AH
Battery Cell: Built-in Samsung 29ET 2900mah.52PCS
Array mode:13s4p
Battery size:367.2*90.1*111mm
Battery Weight:4.1KG
Max Constant Discharge Current:30A
Peak current:60A
Charge voltage:54.6V
Discharge cut off voltage:36.4V
Way of Charge: CC/CV
Cycle Life:1000 times
Charge Temperature:-15-65℃
Discharge Temperature:-15-65℃
Protection Function: Overcharge, Over discharge, Over current, Short circuit, Balance

48V 17.5Ah Specification:
Normal Voltage: 48V
Rated Capacity:17.5AH
Battery Cell:Built-in Samsung 35ET 3500mah.65PCS
Array mode:13s5p
Battery size:367.2*90.1*111mm
Battery Weight:4.4KG
Max Constant Discharge Current:30A
Peak current:60A
Charge voltage:54.6V
Discharge cut off voltage:36.4V
Way of Charge: CC/CV
Cycle Life:1000 times
Charge Temperature:-15-65℃
Discharge Temperature:-15-65℃
Protection Function: Overcharge, Over discharge, Over current, Short circuit, Balance

 

[BADsDAD]

Also, Greenergy provided me with a link for replacement controllers for their kits because I could not find them on their store (500w/750w). I am going to buy a couple to have on hand.

We are still working on the partial refund for the wheel replacement. I told them I will remove the negative feedback (which they responded to immediately) if they pay for half of the wheel swap. More than fair, I think. They keep offering $10. That is either the cost of the rim, or they clearly don't know how little $10 is in the US.

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Variable 1T2 Cable Speed Shift Gear Sensor for Bafang eBike Mid Drive Motor Kits. Hub Motor Kits. BAFANG USB Programming Cable for BBS BBS01 BBS02 BBSHD Mid Drive Motor Kits. Bafang Mid Drive Motor. Motor Phase:Angle:120°.

www.ebay.com

 

[Browneye]

Yeah, they claim Samsung cells, so that's why I went ahead and included it on the order - was like $250 or something. If it lasts it's a steal-deal. So far so good.

Cool on the controller. For $41 I may opt for a spare.