Will EBikeshare Replace EBike Ownership For Most People in Cities?

[J.R.]

Helbiz introduce their new mid-drive to the DC area, taken in Arlington, VA
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Looks really well designed. Do you know the life expectancy of share ebikes? I've seen sales of used share bikes and wondered how long they'd been in service.

 

[Dewey]

In 2018 JUMP declared their ebikes had a service life of 3-5 years, but Uber ditched the entire 20,000 JUMP US fleet just 2 years later declaring the firmware as incompatible with their systems. While the frames were recycled for the aluminum, the JUMP bike Bafang front hub motors live on with 3rd party retailers selling them for under $100 making for the least expensive way to DIY convert a pedal bike to an e-bike. This new Helbiz model follows the largest US e-bike fleet bikeshare operator Motivate by fitting a Roller Brake to the front which works provided the front brake is also equipped with the required Shimano brake power modulators (see PR disaster when corners are cut). Here in DC the Capital Bikeshare Plus ebikes are more frequently used than their pedal bike siblings so they rack up the mileage quickly.

 

[tomjasz]

Crazy expensive IMO.

 

[mschwett]

i ride the lyft bike share bikes here from time to time. i find them much less useful than scooters for times that i don’t have my own bike - extremely heavy, sluggish, difficult to ride up steep hills (who deployed these in san francisco lol) and not nearly as flexible as the scooters which can be locked up to any city bike rack.

nice idea but hobbled by the nature of the equipment and parking requirements. also a bit mote expensive than one would hope - not much cheaper than actually taking a lyft and more expensive than a scooter, iirc.

 

[Dewey]

In Washington, DC today Mayor Bowser announced the Capital Bikeshare fleet will receive another 700 new generation CaBi+ e-bikes. These are the same design as the new e-bikes introduced by Lyft in New York City for the Citi bikeshare fleet.

 

[mschwett]

In Washington, DC today Mayor Bowser announced the Capital Bikeshare fleet will receive another 700 new generation CaBi+ e-bikes. These are the same design as the new e-bikes introduced by Lyft in New York City for the Citi bikeshare fleet.

nice. would be very interesting to hear how the reliability on the enviolo hubs has been, since we’ve heard mixed things from users on the site!

 

[indianajo]

I had MTB's & cruisers dump me on my chin 5 times in 8 years. Diamondback MTB twice, Pacific Quantum MTB twice, Huffy Savannah cruiser once. I don't know why rental cruisers wouldn't do the same. The stretch frame cargo bike that solved the problem, you can't rent those. Bring on more of that quick steering!!!!!!!!!! Mother's 1946 Firestone cruiser wouldn't do that. Same tires wheels & posture. Different caster.
I'd like to tour California on a rental bike, but instead I'll just stay home.

 

[Dave Rocks]

What is happening for a bike to dump you on your chin so many times?

 

[Dewey]

I rode one of the new-to-DC 2nd gen Lyft/Motivate e-bikeshare bikes today. Very impressive for a single speed. Well tuned and responsive torque sensor. Rear hub motor by TDCM. 52v battery and 7A controller producing 350w. Some nice upgrades over the 1st gen e-bikes include: bigger battery, a range read-out on the display, better bungee tie over the basket, better seat post handle, hydraulic disk brake on the rear. Things that need to be changed include the location of the headlight which is blocked by anything in the basket.

Capital Bikeshare currently charges 10c per minute to members, 15c for non-members, there is controversy over the pricing of these e-bikes in NYC.

 

[Taylor57]

I rode one of the new-to-DC 2nd gen Lyft/Motivate e-bikeshare bikes today. Very impressive for a single speed. Well tuned and responsive torque sensor. Rear hub motor by TDCM. 52v battery and 7A controller producing 350w. Some nice upgrades over the 1st gen e-bikes include: bigger battery, a range read-out on the display, better bungee tie over the basket, better seat post handle, hydraulic disk brake on the rear. Things that need to be changed include the location of the headlight which is blocked by anything in the basket.

Capital Bikeshare currently charges 10c per minute to members, 15c for non-members, there is controversy over the pricing of these e-bikes in NYC.

6 bucks an hour seems very reasonable...

 

[Dewey]

6 bucks an hour seems very reasonable...

Yes for DC, particularly as many local employers subsidize annual memberships for staff. But the price rises for the same model bike by Lyft in NYC are unwarranted.

 

[indianajo]

What is happening for a bike to dump you on your chin so many times?

Stupid design. "Quick steering" was designed for mountain bike racers & mounted policemen. I checked 180 26" frames on a website, they all had the same inadequate caster. I tried to buy a custom cruiser frame with sufficient caster. 2 vendors wouldn't quote on anything but "standard" caster. My Mother's 1946 Firestone bike was different; stable as a rock. Same 26"x2" tires as today.
I hit a ridge of gravel (twice), 1 1/2" high pavement separator, speed bump, stick, the front wheel snapped sideways, grabbed, seat rose up, threw me over the handlebars on the chin.
I won't be renting any bikes with this feature. Like, all of them. You can't rent a helmet with chin guard, either.

 

[mschwett]

Stupid design. "Quick steering" was designed for mountain bike racers & mounted policemen. I checked 180 26" frames on a website, they all had the same inadequate caster. I tried to buy a custom cruiser frame with sufficient caster. 2 vendors wouldn't quote on anything but "standard" caster. My Mother's 1946 Firestone bike was different; stable as a rock. Same 26"x2" tires as today.
I hit a ridge of gravel (twice), 1 1/2" high pavement separator, speed bump, stick, the front wheel snapped sideways, grabbed, seat rose up, threw me over the handlebars on the chin.
I won't be renting any bikes with this feature. Like, all of them. You can't rent a helmet with chin guard, either.

you know, you have related this story so many times that a casual visitor to the site would think that there are huge numbers of bikes out there "throwing" huge numbers of riders "on their chins."

this is really not a common problem. it may well be unique to your personal needs/use/experience. if 180 26" frames have similar design, the rational conclusion is that it works just fine. if it didn't, some enterprising manufacturer would make something better and take over the "chin-safe" market for bicycles.

 

[Asher]

Yes for DC, particularly as many local employers subsidize annual memberships for staff. But the price rises for the same model bike by Lyft in NYC are unwarranted.

The NYC system has been ordered by the local government to subsidize passes for the poor as well as coverage in outlying areas where ridership is lower and thus the service has higher costs per ride. The more such mandates the service has to comply with, the more it has to charge.

While those coverage goals have some merit, making other cyclist users pay for them is the problem - public transit certainly does not operate that way.

IMO NYC is a special case because personal bike theft is high and so is density, but in most other places Bikeshare is simply not a cost effective metropolitan solution, nor is it all that popular compared to just using your own bike. It may be a cheap way to augment public transit for a few and occasional users.

 

[PedalUma]

Wow. This tread has been going for five years. The ride share bikes are not all that great. I think people want something nicer and more personal.

 

[Dewey]

The ride share bikes are not all that great...

They haven't been in the past, the 1st gen Lyft e-bikes were underpowered with a basic cadence sensor that was laggy and a controller that provided no additional power up hills, even with Enviolo gearing it's hard work pedalling those bikes up hill. These 2nd gen Lyft e-bikes by contrast are much better, with performance I imagine similar to an Electric Bike Company single speed with the torque sensor upgrade. On my ride home today on the CaBi+ gen 2 e-bike I stopped facing up hill and the torque sensor was immediately responsive providing adequate power as soon as I stepped on the pedal. That being said I don't ride CaBi very often, though I do use it to commute to work when my bike is in the shop for service.

 

[Asher]

Wow. This tread has been going for five years. The ride share bikes are not all that great. I think people want something nicer and more personal.

I started it when the share companies claimed they could make money charging $2 for a 30 minute ride. This was a flagrant falsehood. Probably a lie. Now it would cost $15 or so.

Also, outside of NYC, personal bikes are vastly more popular. Notice how the bike boom outside NY was exclusively a personal bike phenomenon, not a shared one. I lived next to a popular bike route with one of the best Bikeshare systems with stations at each end of the block. Shared bikes were still only ~10-15% of bikes on the road.

But if you want a pedal bike that's 20-30 lbs heavier with 10-20 minutes of walking for each trip, Bikeshare has you covered!

 

[PedalUma]

I have just started renting bikes to tourists in my town. These are higher end custom art bikes. Yacht clubs have reciprocal memberships. So when they arrive they dock at the local club but do not have transportation to see the sights. The same with private plane owners or even day trippers arriving by train. There are many hotels here also. With my partner, we are the only ones doing it. In Petaluma, CA. This is the state of ride share in San Francisco right now.

 

[PCeBiker]

I had MTB's & cruisers dump me on my chin 5 times in 8 years. Diamondback MTB twice, Pacific Quantum MTB twice, Huffy Savannah cruiser once. I don't know why rental cruisers wouldn't do the same. The stretch frame cargo bike that solved the problem, you can't rent those. Bring on more of that quick steering!!!!!!!!!! Mother's 1946 Firestone cruiser wouldn't do that. Same tires wheels & posture. Different caster.
I'd like to tour California on a rental bike, but instead I'll just stay home.

I had your post in mind for months and finally bought these,..

I know that it won't protect me from a broken jaw, but it should help if I scrub down the road on my chin.
It hooks under my chin instead of under my jaw.

I've noticed that it pulls my mouth shut so that I don't drool nearly as much while I'm riding.

Stupid design. "Quick steering" was designed for mountain bike racers & mounted policemen. I checked 180 26" frames on a website, they all had the same inadequate caster. I tried to buy a custom cruiser frame with sufficient caster. 2 vendors wouldn't quote on anything but "standard" caster. My Mother's 1946 Firestone bike was different; stable as a rock. Same 26"x2" tires as today.
I hit a ridge of gravel (twice), 1 1/2" high pavement separator, speed bump, stick, the front wheel snapped sideways, grabbed, seat rose up, threw me over the handlebars on the chin.
I won't be renting any bikes with this feature. Like, all of them. You can't rent a helmet with chin guard, either.