Undertaking legal actions against Watt Wagons

WW Another victim of Covid. Waiting 3 months for a new Toyota. Maybe I should threaten to start a class action.:rolleyes:
 
I'm not sure that's a fair comparison, maybe if you had been waiting 2 years for a new model and they told you if you wanted a refund you would have to wait for liquidity to resolve, but no point sawing the sawdust, just wanted to clarify those opting for refund got their money back. There's still a few of us holding out for Helios 2.0. Hopefully the company can turn it around.
 
TomD said:
There's still a few of us holding out for Helios 2.0. Hopefully the company can turn it around.
Click to expand...
I recently texted Pushkar asking about a shipping date for my Hydra and also asked for any updates on the Helios. Never got an answer on the Helios.
 
RMK! said:
Well it's good to know that sometimes, the squeaky wheel does get the oil ...
Click to expand...
A lot of metaphors here. 'Some'd cry if hung with a new rope' and 'Every picture tells a story' too
The 'replacement for the WW' shown indicates the customer changed his mind, so he needed his $$$ back.
Perhaps reduced income, belt-tightening, or 'buying on credit' explains the change of intentions.
Why else would you buy 'that' to replace a Hydra order? It's like 'they took too long for my McLaren, so I bought this beautiful BMW M3'.
Like contracting for a home to be wired, then changing ones mind and demanding $$$ back - AFTER the Electrician bought all the materials that were available and now you keep making endless excuses that lead to your $$$ back.
Like what rental horses do. 'No matter which way you point them they always end up right back at the barn'.
Perhaps he simply gave up on the idea of a big power machine.
I'm certainly not implying he's lying. I'm saying the impetus is gone, so we 'flip the script' to 'jump ship'.
In any event, that bike's not Hydra's class and less expensive.
-
To help us all make thoughtful decisions from the outset, Pushkar should consider initiating a 're-stocking fee' clause for all custom orders, and yes, assign more efforts to organizing such matters.
An employee that knows enough, to babysit customers requires wages.
Buyer's remorse should have a penalty, just as it does when a few customers are pestering the shop with endless calls by any means or number they can obtain on this forum.
It deprives other customers of contact time availability. It cost the shop money to take time off from 'working' for such matters.
They have a lot of orders.
I call every few months - 3 = few (unless I was told to do differently) and I can't get through because of people calling every couple days, trying to talk about whatever. Can you imagine the normal call flow, the contacts to answer, in-house business calls and five people that call 75 times a month spurring others to do the same?
I'm not complaining either. I know some people are, neurotically addicted to uh, really into to their phones., just saying I see a different victim.
 
TomD said:
FWIW all founders requesting refunds have been paid as of a couple weeks ago.
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🍿
Ah Ha Ha Ha,
Congratulations! It Was Worth two years reading all these ridiculous claims that your club was anything but a crowdfunding pitch protected by contract.
Legal action indeed and lots of, puffery, posing , whining, and frail indignity over a few bucks you sent to fund a new toy.
 
You can congratulate me when I get my bike, I'm one of the few founders that chose to hold out. I think it will happen eventually, but if it doesn't, I've made worse investments.

I realize you are just trolling as always but I don't have a problem with anyone that did what they felt they needed to do to force the issue. They got refunded sooner than other founders. Also I may have mis-spoken as there still may be a founder or two waiting for a refund, but most requesting refunds were paid back after the gates refund check(s) finally arrived.
 
Mike_V said:
🍿
Ah Ha Ha Ha,
Congratulations! It Was Worth two years reading all these ridiculous claims that your club was anything but a crowdfunding pitch protected by contract.
Legal action indeed and lots of, puffery, posing , whining, and frail indignity over a few bucks you sent to fund a new toy.
Click to expand...
Nice one “Richard”. :rolleyes: Once again all bluster and no substance.
 
I open up my mouth, it comes rushin' out
Nothin', doin' nadda, never, how you like me now?

Some folks they got money an' some folks lives are sweet
Some folks make decisions an' some folks sweep the streets

Imagine what it feels like, imagine how it sounds
Imagine life is perfect an' everything works out !

Imagine there's a girlfriend, imagine there's a job
Imagine there's an answer, imagine there's a God

Imagine I'm a Devil, imagine I'm a Saint
Lazy money, lazy sexy, lazy outta space!

David Byrne: Lazy
 
Considering Mass adopted the central provision of the FAA, which makes both pre and post dispute agreements to arbitrate “valid, enforceable and irrevocable,” except on the grounds for the revocation of other contracts, I moseyed on down to the WW "TERMS AND CONDITIONS" page to see what it says:
Pretty much, "IF YOU USE THIS SITE THESE ARE THE CONDITIONS"
"If the Parties are unable to resolve a Dispute through informal negotiations, the Dispute (except those Disputes expressly excluded below) will be finally and exclusively resolved by binding arbitration. YOU UNDERSTAND THAT WITHOUT THIS PROVISION, YOU WOULD HAVE THE RIGHT TO SUE IN COURT AND HAVE A JURY TRIAL ... the arbitration will take place in Middlesex, Massachusetts.
If for any reason, a Dispute proceeds in court rather than arbitration, the Dispute shall be commenced or prosecuted in the state and federal courts located in Middlesex, Massachusetts, and the Parties hereby consent to, and waive all defenses of lack of personal jurisdiction ...
These Terms of Use and any policies or operating rules posted by us on the Site or in respect to the Site constitute the entire agreement and understanding between you and us.
We may assign any or all of our rights and obligations to others at any time.
We shall not be responsible or liable for any loss, damage, delay, or failure to act caused by any cause beyond our reasonable control.
You hereby waive any and all defenses you may have based on the electronic form of these Terms of Use and the lack of signing by the parties hereto to execute these Terms of Use.

It's pretty much boilerplate, template stuff, customized by a Local Attorney.
Plain language to me.
Fn'F
 
tomjasz said:
WW Another victim of Covid. Waiting 3 months for a new Toyota. Maybe I should threaten to start a class action.:rolleyes:
Click to expand...
You'd have to attend arbitration in Fukushima Japan and there's a ten-day quarantine, but no worries.
The place they house you is a resort on the water !!! The Sea glows brilliantly at night (stay a week so will your teeth) !!!
Only place for 100 miles.
Property was cheap, so Toyota built an 'Automated Claims Venue Headquarters' and registered it in their Corporate papers.
No live personnel required - just like the resort !!!
 
Rome said:
At first I thought you were quoting Jon Lenon.
I listen to Rolling Stones while riding sometimes.
Sympathy for the devil gets me Rolling
Click to expand...
That has a nice pace to it.
Definitely 'sooths the soul of the savage beast'.
 
onlineaddy said:
The following are actions I've taken (and will take) against Watt Wagons (@pushkar) for failure to deliver a Helios bike and to refund me the remaining amount ($2799) of my preorder payment made on 9 April 2020:
  • Sent 30-day demand letter, which WW received on 22 April. [18 April 2022]
  • Filed a consumer complaint with the Massachusetts Attorney General's Office. [23 May 2022]
  • Will seek legal counsel if WW continues to not respond, seeking triple damages, attorney's fees, interests, and costs.
Click to expand...
Did you ever get your bike or money back?
 
Well TomD, I for one appreciate your relief.
Trading in derivatives, an analogy is buying futures - except WW refunded the full amount, no? While it's sad not to see the manifestation of our anticipations, breaking even is not losing.
It's safe for you to say 'they could not produce', not 'they were acting nefariously'.
You posted starting May '22 and by then I'd been waiting almost a year for my machine.
Five months later in October '22 WW produced the bike of my dreams.
It's superb we both achieved satisfaction.

So Happy Holidays and a Grand New Year from Myself and Mz. Gumbo d' Bodacious !

20221207_141914[1].jpg


Fn'F
 
I was speaking on behalf of founders that requested refunds. They have been refunded. I personally am still waiting for the mythical Helios as are a few other founders.
 
I received a WW Rita frame with studded tires to review as a winter ice bike. Unfortunately at the same time I had serious eye problems and needed surgery and 8-12 weeks of no physical stress recovery. So an $8000 bike sat in my shop for months before I had to finally and sadly return the bike. Of course this in no way gives any investor any real relief, but in my experience the founder is a straight up honest fellow completely victimized by a civic nightmare. Anyone a reseller during the last 3 year knows what a nightmare this has been for a startup. FFS look at Ravi and Zen. Years behind their hope for viable products. If you lay on the bleeding edge, expect to bleed.
 
I understand. Having no standing in their redress, it's to you I wish closure - for want of a better term.
I was an FS guy, I'd ride a (60lb) Hydra. WW is excellent about trade-in's for 'compromises made' to get us rolling.
A (70lb) Helios lands, you're at head of the line for the 'upgrade' - should you want it.
An elegant rack solution for <$20 that fits any FS bike - w/ no more or less max weight limitations than a Helios' ???
Rubber gasketed clamp parts at Auto Zone and an axiom. lol
 
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