Turbo Vado SL 4.0 Wheel Durability

[ckendall]

I got my wife a Turbo Vado SL 4.0 Step thru. At $2500 its by far the best I’ve seen and my skittish wife liked the assist levels and control and the bike is not so heavy. She’s 5 ft or a bit less and I had to get riser bars and a steerer extension which all worked without having to redo any cabling. It is a stiff ride so I mounted a TranzX elastomer shock post. A Redshift should be better and has less setback. But this bike handles, is much lighter than and other e-bikes we tried and she loves it. We can now ride together faster and longer with me on my cross country non e-bike and her on the Vado.

My only disappointment on this bike aside from the non-flashable built in lights is the rear wheel. It got a bit wavy after first ride. My wife is a lightweight and we only road a paved trail and she rarely uses any assistance level over sport mode. I have built and trued wheels before and have a truing stand, so it was no problem to true it up. It looks like Specialized didn't destress the wheels and there was some spoke windup even though the spoke tension was even all around. I will probably check the wheel true again after more riding but I can see it might need just a bit more adjustment. Has anyone else seen this?

My recommendation is before you take delivery, grab and squeeze those spokes all around and check the true in case you need the shop to adjust.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Bad luck. Both my Vado SL wheels have held true since the purchase on June 23rd, 2021 after more than 5,000 miles ridden. I am a heavy person, put a lot of cargo in the panniers and do not spare my Fearless hard terrain

 

[JayUK]

I asked my LBS to check the spokes on my Vado 5.0 and they said they found no issues. It could be your wheels got a knock in transit.

 

[ckendall]

I asked my LBS to check the spokes on my Vado 5.0 and they said they found no issues. It could be your wheels got a knock in transit.

Don’t think the true issue was due to a knock in transit because I could tell the wheels weren’t de-stressed and there was some windup in a few spokes. Glad to hear this may not be a wide spread issue. We are getting another one for a different home and will do more unpaved riding as well so we’ll see on that one.

 

[JayUK]

This is an interesting subject.

I noticed when my LBS was checking the wheels he was squeezing the spokes in pairs and then went around with a tool.

Can an end user tighten spokes without using/needing a truing stand? I am a heavy rider so keeping my spokes in good order is important.

Any tips appreciated!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Can an end user tighten spokes without using/needing a truing stand

Not

 

[PDoz]

This is an interesting subject.

I noticed when my LBS was checking the wheels he was squeezing the spokes in pairs and then went around with a tool.

Can an end user tighten spokes without using/needing a truing stand? I am a heavy rider so keeping my spokes in good order is important.

Any tips appreciated!

It's not as accurate, but turn the bike upside down , put zip ties on something solid eg a chainstay - so you can see just how bent everything is ( trim to almost touch the rim) . Then try and work out IF you can tweak the mess into something resembling an even shape that produces a suitable musical tune next time you spring off a rock.

It'll get you home if you have had a major impact out on the trail, but unless you are the type of perfectionist who has a clean workshop stocked with exactly to right tool - don't tell anyone this is what you did.

Oh, it also helps to chant a mystical verse , because mastery of the magic involved in turning those factory roundish things into instruments of delight ....lets just say not everyone can master it. If you ever find an lbs with an old guy meditating at the wheel stand and ignoring a shop full of customers - I'd suggest you watch quietly. DO NOT disturb him. A subtly " nice" when he finishes will suffice. Then place your wheels in the line and come back on the designated day.

 

[PDoz]

Ps specialized wheels are called rOVAL for a reason. Or at least, I think that's what my wheel guy meant when he shook his head and put his hand in the way of me leaving mine on the line.

That was a year ago, I changed a tyre yesterday and noticed some promising dings, so it might be time to go have a chat about what will be replacing it

 

[ckendall]

This is an interesting subject.

I noticed when my LBS was checking the wheels he was squeezing the spokes in pairs and then went around with a tool.

Can an end user tighten spokes without using/needing a truing stand? I am a heavy rider so keeping my spokes in good order is important.

Any tips appreciated!

Yep he was de-stressing and trying to relieve woundup or twisted spokes with that process. The wheel I posted about had spot on even tension according to my TM-1 gauge on every spoke on each side but some of the spokes were a bit twisted so the tension wasn’t really even after de-stressing with a ride or squeezing spokes. Also if a rim isn’t really perfectly round and straight before building its harder to get even tension to compensate.

One can make some adjustments without a truing stand IF IF IF IF you know the process but best only for an expeditious reason to prevent lateral rubs. Also its not just tightening. To much tightening on on side has an impact on the opposite and one can cause a wheel to taco with too much tension. There are books and much info videos etc. on line. The wheels I have built myself have never needed adjustment, but I started with really good rims and materials and used spoke prep and spoke nipple lube etc.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Let me tell you something guys.
My brother can repair anything, e-bike, bicycle, a car, just name it. He has built a new wheelset for his Giant Trance E+ recently. He even installed the spokes, making the wheels complete.
When it came to the spoke tensioning, wheel dishing and trueing, he simply said 'I'm too stupid to do it' and he brought the wheels to a professional MTB shop for the service.

 

[JayUK]

Yep he was de-stressing and trying to relieve woundup or twisted spokes with that process. The wheel I posted about had spot on even tension according to my TM-1 gauge on every spoke on each side but some of the spokes were a bit twisted so the tension wasn’t really even after de-stressing with a ride or squeezing spokes. Also if a rim isn’t really perfectly round and straight before building its harder to get even tension to compensate.

One can make some adjustments without a truing stand IF IF IF IF you know the process but best only for an expeditious reason to prevent lateral rubs. Also its not just tightening. To much tightening on on side has an impact on the opposite and one can cause a wheel to taco with too much tension. There are books and much info videos etc. on line. The wheels I have built myself have never needed adjustment, but I started with really good rims and materials and used spoke prep and spoke nipple lube etc.

Thanks for the reply, I think I will leave it to the experts.

Currently I have my wheels checked and trued by my LBS once a year, it only costs $15 per wheel so not bad.

 

[hankj]

I've built bicycle wheels. Just two sets, but I rode both of them for probably 20,000 mi on each. They were the most trouble free wheels I've ever had, but now I just buy wheelsets because it's so much easier.

The stock wheels that come with the Vado SL are fine. But I'll point to two factors that can influence how true they are going to stay.

First off, there's luck of the draw in how fastidious the purchase shop is in tension checking and squaring up the wheels that come on new bikes. Like you suggest at the end of your original post, when I bought my wife's Vado, i squeezed every pair of spokes for tension and took a close look at true, radially as well as laterally. They were very good, and I thanked the shop mechanics for good work.

It is much much better to have a wheel that is properly tensioned and properly true from the very start than to try to get the wheel properly tensioned and trued after it goes well out of true.

Secondly, the OEM tires in Vado SL's are rock hard rim bangers. They're really stiff and according to the sidewall need to be run at quite high pressures. Get a set of more subtle tires with more volume. 45mm fits front and rear. If you don't mount them, tubeless get some better quality inner tubes. It is surprising how much more compliant better inner tubes are than cheap ones. RideNow TPU are not so expensive, more puncture resistant than standard tubes, much lighter, much better rolling resistance, and they are pink which is kind of fun.

Once you get more supple larger volume tires set up, you can run them at less pressure. Say 30 or 35lb for your lightweight wife - she will not pinch flat at 30 lb. The bike will feel dreamy and smooth, it will grip the tarmac and brake significantly better, and it will be much easier on the rims. Suspension stems are great, but they're not going to stop the shock that's coming through into the wheels. Larger volume. More supple tires will.

 

[ckendall]

Thanks much for the tire recommendations. Are the Turbo Vado SL 4.0 rims tubeless ready? I’ve read conflicting things on that. I did put on a TranzX QL antishock post but yep better tires are a good idea. I do wish there was a shorter dropper shock post that would fit length-wise on her step thru frame. It would simplify getting on an off the bike for the old lady.

We ordered another identical bike for the 2nd home up north. Its a great bike for the wife and we can ride together now her on her E-bike and me “au-naturale” unassisted, We can even consider more bike centered trips as she get more and more comfortable. Game changer. She loves it and still gets a workout, more so than she did on her regular bike because she goes further and does hills instead of avoiding.

 

[sanyata]

The Specialized support page states, "All models of the Vado SL come with tubeless compatible rims. Note that Vado SL 4.0 models use a tubeless ready rim strip even though not called out specifically on rim tape by manufacturer."
I tried it with my 4.0 rims and it worked OK after letting the rims sit sideways overnight, one night each side. It leaked like a sieve out of the spoke holes during that time but sealed up afterward. I wasn't too happy with that so I stripped the wheels down and used MugOff tape and it was much better right off the bat. I do lose pressure over the week, but I don't mind as I check that before every ride anyway. Same as my Levo.

 

[hankj]

tried it with my 4.0 rims and it worked OK after letting the rims sit sideways overnight, one night each side. It leaked like a sieve out of the spoke holes during that time but sealed up afterward. I wasn't too happy with that so I stripped the wheels down and used MugOff tape and it was much better right off the bat. I do lose pressure over the week, but I don't mind as I check that before every ride anyway. Same as my Levo.

Interesting, what color was the OE tape? Mine is black and covers the entire rim bed. It seems very much to be tubeless tape, not a rim strip. Stans sealant, tubeless ready tires and once blown on immediately sealed. No bubbles at all with dunk in hot tub test. They hold air like champs for tubeless too. Not lossless but very good. Maybe a model year thing? I'd say tures except you got lots of leaking at the spokes.

I hate tubeless leaks at the spokes. If they seal it screws up ability to turn the nipples. Plus the hollow rim is pressurized in some cases. If carbon rims they can blow up.

 

[hankj]

We ordered another identical bike for the 2nd home up north. Its a great bike for the wife and we can ride together now her on her E-bike and me “au-naturale” unassisted, We can even consider more bike centered trips as she get more and more comfortable. Game changer. She loves it and still gets a workout, more so than she did on her regular bike because she goes further and does hills instead of avoiding.

Me too, exactly! We both like bikes but she works more and I ride a lot. This bike equalized while not making her, a decent cyclist but not as strong as me, feel like she's on a motorcycle. Often she doesn't even have it turned on.

And if I feel bonked into a headwind, she can turn up the power and pull me home in her draft.

Vado SL is an ideal solution for slightly mis-matched cyclist couples!

 

[sanyata]

Tape was black and used Stans as well. It's a new bike purchased just this March.
Never thought about the nipples being stuck due to the sealant. Learn 'sumptin' every day!

 

[ckendall]

I've built bicycle wheels. Just two sets, but I rode both of them for probably 20,000 mi on each. They were the most trouble free wheels I've ever had, but now I just buy wheelsets because it's so much easier.

The stock wheels that come with the Vado SL are fine. But I'll point to two factors that can influence how true they are going to stay.

First off, there's luck of the draw in how fastidious the purchase shop is in tension checking and squaring up the wheels that come on new bikes. Like you suggest at the end of your original post, when I bought my wife's Vado, i squeezed every pair of spokes for tension and took a close look at true, radially as well as laterally. They were very good, and I thanked the shop mechanics for good work.

It is much much better to have a wheel that is properly tensioned and properly true from the very start than to try to get the wheel properly tensioned and trued after it goes well out of true.

Secondly, the OEM tires in Vado SL's are rock hard rim bangers. They're really stiff and according to the sidewall need to be run at quite high pressures. Get a set of more subtle tires with more volume. 45mm fits front and rear. If you don't mount them, tubeless get some better quality inner tubes. It is surprising how much more compliant better inner tubes are than cheap ones. RideNow TPU are not so expensive, more puncture resistant than standard tubes, much lighter, much better rolling resistance, and they are pink which is kind of fun.

Once you get more supple larger volume tires set up, you can run them at less pressure. Say 30 or 35lb for your lightweight wife - she will not pinch flat at 30 lb. The bike will feel dreamy and smooth, it will grip the tarmac and brake significantly better, and it will be much easier on the rims. Suspension stems are great, but they're not going to stop the shock that's coming through into the wheels. Larger volume. More supple tires will.

So how tough was it to stretch on mount the 45 width Schwalbe G-One Allrounds in 45 on the stock Vado SL rim? I have always done my own bike work including building wheels in the past. But by far the hardest PITA thing lately especially on my tubeless ready carbon rim mtn bike is talking off and putting on tires. I have all the tools and know the tricks but even the shop had trouble. I want to be able to repair a tire in the field. I found some acceptable not too tough road tires for my tubeless road bikes rims and its hit and miss depending on tire and rims, But I haven’t found the right combo for my mtn bike yet. Just wondering if I put bigger tubeless tires on the wife’s Vado SL to soften the ride a bit off road.

​

 

[hankj]

So how tough was it to stretch on mount the 45 width Schwalbe G-One Allrounds in 45 on the stock Vado SL rim? I have always done my own bike work including building wheels in the past. But by far the hardest PITA thing lately especially on my tubeless ready carbon rim mtn bike is talking off and putting on tires. I have all the tools and know the tricks but even the shop had trouble. I want to be able to repair a tire in the field. I found some acceptable not too tough road tires for my tubeless road bikes rims and its hit and miss depending on tire and rims, But I haven’t found the right combo for my mtn bike yet. Just wondering if I put bigger tubeless tires on the wife’s Vado SL to soften the ride a bit off road.

​

Mount difficulty as far as tightness goes was average for tubeless. I used one tire lever for each bead. Two lever lifts per bead to mount. A shop mechanic probably would have rolled it on all hands no tool, but I am not that good. If you don't do a lot of tires it could take a little patience.

The G-one Speeds in my experience are looser, either that or they are thinner and stretchier. They are good tires - very fast rolling, light and supple. Easier mount than Allround, which are thicker and better grip on gravel.

So many other tires out there in the same general category. Some easier to mount, some harder. Avoid Challenge tires - some are unbelievably hard to mount. Also avoid Panaracer - some mount too loose and tend to burp or even blow off if you inflate too much.

Also don't overlook TPU tubes instead of Stans and tubeless mounting. TPU tubes weigh the same as tubeless fluid, are quite tough, and are nearly as supple as tubeless too. Not messy, no struggle to seat the bead when inflating, etc. The RideNow's perform indistinguishably from the expensive TPU's, and cost like 6 bucks a pop on AliExpress. Spares are good to have too.

 

[mschwett]

So how tough was it to stretch on mount the 45 width Schwalbe G-One Allrounds in 45 on the stock Vado SL rim? I have always done my own bike work including building wheels in the past. But by far the hardest PITA thing lately especially on my tubeless ready carbon rim mtn bike is talking off and putting on tires. I have all the tools and know the tricks but even the shop had trouble. I want to be able to repair a tire in the field. I found some acceptable not too tough road tires for my tubeless road bikes rims and its hit and miss depending on tire and rims, But I haven’t found the right combo for my mtn bike yet. Just wondering if I put bigger tubeless tires on the wife’s Vado SL to soften the ride a bit off road.

​

my somewhat limited experience (four different types of rims) with tubeless is that the rims which are explicitly and recently designed for tubeless are a lot easier, and even more so when paired with recently designed tires designed specifically to be tubeless. i’m a reasonably strong guy, and found it totally impossible to mount reneherse 42mm knobbies on my DT Swiss R470 rims. like not even close.

GP5000 Pre-tubeless on those rims, possible, but very very hard.

GP 5000 TL S (the most recent ones) and the alpinist II (redesigned for tubeless, allegedly) rims on my specialized not electric road bike, those I can get on with my bare hands. no soapy water no tire irons just the “make space“ technique combined with the “rolling palms” technique.