Turbo Vado 5.0 IGH - The Nightmare Continues

[JJ Lad]

I've been dealing with an intermittent 'creak' from the bottom bracket of my Turbo Vado 5.0 with IGH.

My local Specialized dealer got approval from Specialized head office to perform the warranty work. Why they needed 'approval' to work on a bike that is clearly under warranty is beyond me?

Regardless, I brought my bike to their shop, along with a written report describing when the creak appears (After riding for at least 10-minutes).

Today the bike shop calls me to tell me they can't hear the creaking. I asked them if they rode the bike for a while before bearing down on the crank. Nope!!!!

They then asked me why I modified the rear wheel by adding another motor to the hub?

WHAT?!!!!!

For the life of me I had no idea what they were talking about. And then I realized they had never seen a Specialized bike with a IGH with Gates belt drive.

Oh crap!!!! I'm dealing with an authorized Specialized bike shop that has never seen a Specialized bike equipped with an IGH.

I am so HOOPED!!

 

[mschwett]

...

They then asked me why I modified the rear wheel by adding another motor to the hub?

WHAT?!!!!!

For the life of me I had no idea what they were talking about. And then I realized they had never seen a Specialized bike with a IGH with Gates belt drive.

...

OMG

not only that, but never seen an IGH? was the belt drive not a give away? find a new LBS, stat!

 

[JJ Lad]

OMG

not only that, but never seen an IGH? was the belt drive not a give away? find a new LBS, stat!

Only two shops in my area. My local shop 10-minutes away, and another shop 1-hour away. My experience with both has been less than stellar. These shops do not appear to be equipped to deal with high-tech ebikes.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

What a shame!

My local Specialized dealer got approval from Specialized head office to perform the warranty work. Why they needed 'approval' to work on a bike that is clearly under warranty is beyond me?

Regardless how hopeless your LBS is, that is the usual procedure. The Specialized distributor has to accept the warranty claim and assign a budget for the repair. In my case (damaged motor and cracked frame on a far older Vado) the distributor accepted the warranty claim for "lifetime frame warranty" and authorized a budget for a new frameset, a new front wheel, and even for a new Kinekt 2.1 seatpost (not a Specialized product). I had to pay for a new motor as it was one year past the warranty though. However, my LBS is excellent, and making miracles took them only 3 months.

Sorry to hear about your incompetent LBS.

 

[JJ Lad]

I see a future of grief and aggravation. My local Specialized shop are ill-trained to service the bikes they sell, and the next approved shop is over 1-hour away.

In anticipation of ongoing misery, I've started to evaluate my options:

1. Cut bait, sell the bike and run
2. Ride the bike till it self-destructs
3. Mod the bike with aftermarket e-bike components that I can service myself. i.e.; no longer beholden to SPL service network.

 

[dynamic]

1. Cut bait, sell the bike and run
2. Ride the bike till it self-destructs

These two are probably the same exact timeframe. (Mine lasted 600 miles) ;P

The specialized service network is not properly trained for the IGH models at this time. It really sucks as the bike is amazing when not having issues. Any chance of return/exchange?

 

[JJ Lad]

These two are probably the same exact timeframe. (Mine lasted 600 miles) ;P

The specialized service network is not properly trained for the IGH models at this time. It really sucks as the bike is amazing when not having issues. Any chance of return/exchange?

600 miles!!! That's disappointing.

I picked up my bike in December so any chance of a return/exchange at this time is unlikely.

My bike found its way back to the shop at 50-miles when it refused to go faster than 10-mph. The shop reflashed the motor with the latest software. Which is something they told me they did when they prepped the bike for delivery (their first lie).

Now at 100-miles the bike is in my local shop with an irregular bottom bracket creak. It sounds like the sprag bearing. Of course when I mentioned my suspicions to their tech, he had a dumb look on his face suggesting he had no idea what I was talking about.

With only 100-miles on the bike in 3-months, I'm really upset I didn't listen to my inner-self and stick with low-tech bikes that I can service myself.

I hate being beholden to the SPL dealer network who appear to be ill equipped to deal with the products they sell.

 

[dynamic]

I picked up my bike in December so any chance of a return/exchange at this time is unlikely.

If you bought directly through specialized, you may be able to. My return was well beyond the 30 days they officially offer. But my bike had several reported issues with varying states of fix through a specialized dealer.

It doesn't hurt to ask. Specialized surprised me in taking my return. I asked once they decided to throw parts at it for the 3rd issue. I had also had a number of other poor experiences with them as a company up to that point.

I am now also considering a specialized chain electric model. It doesn't completely alleviate the complexity, but it is at least largely well understood by most LBS.

If you truly want to cut the connection and maintain yourself, definitely don't buy electric. You are stuck with *something* no matter what electric model you buy.

I will say, of all the bikes I have tried, specialized was easily the bike with the most luxurious experience. And they will be at the top of the list if I end up justifying a chain. Tero X is very high on my list currently. The vado simply wasn't quite tough enough for around here.

I have a rohloff/bafang flx blade 2.0 bike I would happily sell if you want something that is a rocketship.

 

[JJ Lad]

If you bought directly through specialized, you may be able to. My return was well beyond the 30 days they officially offer. But my bike had several reported issues with varying states of fix through a specialized dealer.

It doesn't hurt to ask. Specialized surprised me in taking my return. I asked once they decided to throw parts at it for the 3rd issue. I had also had a number of other poor experiences with them as a company up to that point.

I am now also considering a specialized chain electric model. It doesn't completely alleviate the complexity, but it is at least largely well understood by most LBS.

If you truly want to cut the connection and maintain yourself, definitely don't buy electric. You are stuck with *something* no matter what electric model you buy.

I will say, of all the bikes I have tried, specialized was easily the bike with the most luxurious experience. And they will be at the top of the list if I end up justifying a chain. Tero X is very high on my list currently. The vado simply wasn't quite tough enough for around here.

I have a rohloff/bafang flx blade 2.0 bike I would happily sell if you want something that is a rocketship.

Unfortunately, I purchased from a Specialized bike shop who had the bike in stock. They wont take it back or replace.

I purchased the TV 5.0 to compliment my Rad Wagon4.

I can service and rebuild the RW4 in my sleep. The Turbo Vado is a closed system where I'm tied to the dealer for life.

Once the warranty expires, I'll be tempted to pull the motor and IGH, and replace with a Bafang hub motor, chain drive, and derailleur.

 

[Deacon Blues]

Try taking the bike to the shop again, but ride it around for ten minutes first, then let them look at the bike and hear the creaking sound.
Once you get the bike fixed you can sell it. You'll take a financial hit, but then you can purchase something you can work on yourself.
It sucks, but chalk it up to a lesson learned.

 

[fooferdoggie]

Unfortunately, I purchased from a Specialized bike shop who had the bike in stock. They wont take it back or replace.

I purchased the TV 5.0 to compliment my Rad Wagon4.

I can service and rebuild the RW4 in my sleep. The Turbo Vado is a closed system where I'm tied to the dealer for life.

Once the warranty expires, I'll be tempted to pull the motor and IGH, and replace with a Bafang hub motor, chain drive, and derailleur.

how would that work exactly since the motor is the bottom bracket? plus where would you put a battery you cant use the one that comes with the bike.

 

[JJ Lad]

how would that work exactly since the motor is the bottom bracket? plus where would you put a battery you cant use the one that comes with the bike.

Been giving it some thought, and I have a preliminary plan:

1. Pull motor housing. Remove motor, belt, idler and planetary gears. Basically keep the axle.
2. Replace belt chainring for a chain chainring.
3. Replace rear wheel with hub motor wheel, cassette, and derailleur
4. Battery.... this will take some research. Ideally I would raise voltage to 48V by replacing existing battery pack. This may be tricky to fit into the frame. May have to relocate to top of frame.
5. Aftermarket speed controller and display

Cost estimate is about $1200-$1500.

Is it worth it... probably not.

 

[JJ Lad]

Following a few days with radio-silence from the bike shop, I called them today for a progress report.

The shop owner told me they rode the bike but didn't hear any creaking and asked if I could pass by to demonstrate the problem.

Fine.... so I just returned from the shop, and satisfactorily demonstrated the 'creaking'.

The shop owner agreed, apologized, then agreed to replace the motor with a spare he had in stock.

Let's hope this resolves the annoying creaking!!!

 

[mschwett]

Been giving it some thought, and I have a preliminary plan:

1. Pull motor housing. Remove motor, belt, idler and planetary gears. Basically keep the axle.
2. Replace belt chainring for a chain chainring.
3. Replace rear wheel with hub motor wheel, cassette, and derailleur
4. Battery.... this will take some research. Ideally I would raise voltage to 48V by replacing existing battery pack. This may be tricky to fit into the frame. May have to relocate to top of frame.
5. Aftermarket speed controller and display

Cost estimate is about $1200-$1500.

Is it worth it... probably not.

i haven’t looked at it in great detail, but isn’t the pedal axle integrated into the motor assembly in such a way that without the motor, you’d have to fabricate some kind of attachment for a bottom bracket (like a traditional bike) to mate with the super weirdly shaped frame?

definitely better to sell it and buy a bike that wasn’t designed for a mid-drive, frame integrated battery, and IGH.

the conversion from belt/IGH to chain/derailleur is probably pretty simple though, setting aside the decent chance that the specialized electronics would freak out from the change..

 

[Onimaru]

600 miles!!! That's disappointing.

I picked up my bike in December so any chance of a return/exchange at this time is unlikely.

My bike found its way back to the shop at 50-miles when it refused to go faster than 10-mph. The shop reflashed the motor with the latest software. Which is something they told me they did when they prepped the bike for delivery (their first lie).

Now at 100-miles the bike is in my local shop with an irregular bottom bracket creak. It sounds like the sprag bearing. Of course when I mentioned my suspicions to their tech, he had a dumb look on his face suggesting he had no idea what I was talking about.

With only 100-miles on the bike in 3-months, I'm really upset I didn't listen to my inner-self and stick with low-tech bikes that I can service myself.

I hate being beholden to the SPL dealer network who appear to be ill equipped to deal with the products they sell.

They replaced my bike at 1000 miles last year. The hub seized and they (Specialized) couldn’t figure out how to pair the replacement to the bike. It wouldn’t talk to the computer. It’s not the dealer networks. Even the tech service people for Specialized weren’t ready.

I got it in April, it died in September. Got the replacement mid October. Then immediately parked it for the winter. Looking forward to pulling it out soon. If it craters again since it’s still under warrant, I’m demanding a refund and going Bosch. But I will say, the replacement pedaled smoother than the original did from day 1. So it was likely defective from the factory.

 

[JJ Lad]

i haven’t looked at it in great detail, but isn’t the pedal axle integrated into the motor assembly in such a way that without the motor, you’d have to fabricate some kind of attachment for a bottom bracket (like a traditional bike) to mate with the super weirdly shaped frame?

definitely better to sell it and buy a bike that wasn’t designed for a mid-drive, frame integrated battery, and IGH.

the conversion from belt/IGH to chain/derailleur is probably pretty simple though, setting aside the decent chance that the specialized electronics would freak out from the change..

You're quite correct. To effect the conversion, one would have to gut the drive housing, remove the motor rotor and windings, planetary gears, belt and idler. Basically only the crank axle assembly remains.

The Specialized electronics would get tossed as well and replaced with an aftermarket controller.

Hardly worth the cost, but if your Specialized bike gets bricked out of warranty, it's likely cheaper to convert than replace.

 

[JJ Lad]

They replaced my bike at 1000 miles last year. The hub seized and they (Specialized) couldn’t figure out how to pair the replacement to the bike. It wouldn’t talk to the computer. It’s not the dealer networks. Even the tech service people for Specialized weren’t ready.

I got it in April, it died in September. Got the replacement mid October. Then immediately parked it for the winter. Looking forward to pulling it out soon. If it craters again since it’s still under warrant, I’m demanding a refund and going Bosch. But I will say, the replacement pedaled smoother than the original did from day 1. So it was likely defective from the factory.

Sad state when we have to treat our ebikes like disposable appliances.

 

[mschwett]

You're quite correct. To effect the conversion, one would have to gut the drive housing, remove the motor rotor and windings, planetary gears, belt and idler. Basically only the crank axle assembly remains.

The Specialized electronics would get tossed as well and replaced with an aftermarket controller.

Hardly worth the cost, but if your Specialized bike gets bricked out of warranty, it's likely cheaper to convert than replace.

probably not. cost of a motor, batteries, groupset, is bound to be more than specialized will charge you to fix it. just because it's out of warranty doesn't mean it's not fixable!

in any case, the level of support (and problems with) the new IGH versions of this bike are totally unacceptable. specialized had better get their act together soon or a fair amount of bad PR will spread.

by comparison, my creo has been completely trouble free for thousands and thousands of hard miles.

 

[JJ Lad]

probably not. cost of a motor, batteries, groupset, is bound to be more than specialized will charge you to fix it. just because it's out of warranty doesn't mean it's not fixable!

in any case, the level of support (and problems with) the new IGH versions of this bike are totally unacceptable. specialized had better get their act together soon or a fair amount of bad PR will spread.

by comparison, my creo has been completely trouble free for thousands and thousands of hard miles.

The economics of the conversion largely depends on how long a Specialized repair lasts. If I had to replace the motor every 1000-miles, then I suggest conversion is the way to go.

 

[Onimaru]

probably not. cost of a motor, batteries, groupset, is bound to be more than specialized will charge you to fix it. just because it's out of warranty doesn't mean it's not fixable!

in any case, the level of support (and problems with) the new IGH versions of this bike are totally unacceptable. specialized had better get their act together soon or a fair amount of bad PR will spread.

by comparison, my creo has been completely trouble free for thousands and thousands of hard miles.

I have sworn off buying any more new bikes from them. The only reason I’m looking at picking up a Stumpjumper Comp is because it’s a 1 year old, lightly used one from someone I trust for a killer deal.