Turbo Creo 2 Comp E5 (aluminum) is out, is a Vado SL 2 next?

[EmilyRides]

On the Turbo Creo 2 Comp E5, I see that the shifters (and brakes) are SRAM Apex mechanical. I have never used any SRAM shifters. One of my cycling buddies says that the Apex are the lowest-end shifters SRAM makes, are mushy, troublesome, and non-intuitive to use (the double tap). Has anyone used these, and do you agree? I was pretty bummed to hear this...I am spoiled having Ultegra on my current (non-e) road bike, but I'm really only riding that on the smart trainer these days; on the road I'm riding my Kona Dew-e DL. I'm not super picky about things like this normally, but if I do decide to pursue this bike, I would hate to end up with unusable shifters.

 

[direwolf]

On the Turbo Creo 2 Comp E5, I see that the shifters (and brakes) are SRAM Apex mechanical. I have never used any SRAM shifters. One of my cycling buddies says that the Apex are the lowest-end shifters SRAM makes, are mushy, troublesome, and non-intuitive to use (the double tap). Has anyone used these, and do you agree? I was pretty bummed to hear this...I am spoiled having Ultegra on my current (non-e) road bike, but I'm really only riding that on the smart trainer these days; on the road I'm riding my Kona Dew-e DL. I'm not super picky about things like this normally, but if I do decide to pursue this bike, I would hate to end up with unusable shifters.

I've never used Apex. I have SRAM Rival mechanical on my gravel bike. I don't love the double-tap system, but you get used to it very quickly. The shifts aren't nearly as smooth and crisp as the Campagnolo Chorus-12 on my road bike. The SRAM feels a lot "clunkier." Although not very elegant, it has been extremely reliable, rarely needs adjustment, and works fine. For the money, it's good stuff. I don't love the shape of the hoods though. The Campy is more comfortable for my hands.

 

[direwolf]

there are size L at many places, specialized santa monica, south bay cycle, etc. what size do you want to ride?

Thanks. Where are you getting that info? I am right on the edge of medium and large (I'm 5'10"). I went into the Specialized Santa Monica shop a couple of weeks ago. I didn't see any Turbo Vado SL's there, and I couldn't get anyone to help me (or even look at me). I walked out after 20 minutes. I've had similar experiences there in the past over a period of many, many years. I've never liked that store.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I am right on the edge of medium and large (I'm 5'10").

I'm 5'8" with short legs but a long torso and arms. My Vado SL size M had too a small cockpit for me, so I had to use a longer stem. I had the Vado SL size L for my demo ride, and I had no issues with that. I think the size L would be right for you. (Vado SL is smaller than it seems, and it helps saving the weight on that e-bike).

 

[direwolf]

Thanks. Where are you getting that info? I am right on the edge of medium and large (I'm 5'10"). I went into the Specialized Santa Monica shop a couple of weeks ago. I didn't see any Turbo Vado SL's there, and I couldn't get anyone to help me (or even look at me). I walked out after 20 minutes. I've had similar experiences there in the past over a period of many, many years. I've never liked that store.

I went back to Specialized Santa Monica today. I didn't realize they had taken over the building next door for e-bikes. I was able to ride a Vado 3.0 SL. Large is definitely the right size for me. Maybe I had unrealistic expectations, but I have to say that I was disappointed with the power. On a flat surace, my top speed was about 19mph pedaling fairly hard in top gear. On a very slight downhill, I maxed out at 23mph very briefly, but was more like 21mph. I can go around that fast on my road bike with not that much more effort. I had been under the impression that, in turbo mode, I would be able to cruise at 23-25mph with only moderate effort. That is definitely not the case. I'll keep looking around, but I'm not sure this is realistic for my commuting aspirations. It would be good if I just wanted to cruise at 14mph with very little effort, but that would take me way too long to get to my job. I may just get a slower more cargo oriented bike for shopping instead. Thanks everyone for your help.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I went back to Specialized Santa Monica today. I didn't realize they had taken over the building next door for e-bikes. I was able to ride a Vado 3.0 SL. Large is definitely the right size for me. Maybe I had unrealistic expectations, but I have to say that I was disappointed with the power. On a flat surace, my top speed was about 19mph pedaling fairly hard in top gear. On a very slight downhill, I maxed out at 23mph very briefly, but was more like 21mph. I can go around that fast on my road bike with not that much more effort. I had been under the impression that, in turbo mode, I would be able to cruise at 23-25mph with only moderate effort. That is definitely not the case. I'll keep looking around, but I'm not sure this is realistic for my commuting aspirations. It would be good if I just wanted to cruise at 14mph with very little effort, but that would take me way too long to get to my job. I may just get a slower more cargo oriented bike for shopping instead. Thanks everyone for your help.

Get yourself a Vado 4.0 (non-SL). Vado SL is a fitness, not a commuter e-bike.

 

[direwolf]

Get yourself a Vado 4.0 (non-SL). Vado SL is a fitness, not a commuter e-bike.

Yeah - I guess that's what I would need. Was hoping not to have an elephant of a bike.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Yeah - I guess that's what I would need. Was hoping not to have an elephant of a bike.

I do understand. The issue here is you want to travel at 23-25 mph. There is a formula for the air-drag that tells you the power required to overcome the air drag is in the 3rd power. Flat-bar bikes present a significant resistance to the air. The speed you mention actually requires riding a Vado 4.0 in Turbo mode, making your range, well, 30 miles?

On the positive side, the Vado 4.0 has a sturdy rear rack, making it possible to carry as much as some 60 lb panniers. You would bend your Vado SL EQ rack if you tried that. (Been there, done that)

My older full power Vado in the grocery shopping role. I also wear a backpack for more goods carried on my 10 mile round-trip ride.

 

[mfgrep]

There is no such thing as a Vado 3.0 SL

 

[mfgrep]

Yeah - I guess that's what I would need. Was hoping not to have an elephant of a bike.

We can't have 'it all' in one bike. At least not yet. For now compromises are necessary.... Or you need two bikes

Yup the Vado is big, heavy, but powerful.
The Vado SL is light, nimble, and has great assistance for fitness purposes.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Or you need two bikes

As you already know Exactly my situation, too!

 

[mfgrep]

As you already know Exactly my situation, too!

Exactly!

Btw.... Adjusted my seatpost dampener 1/2 turn tonight. I couldn't find any credible information or a manual about adjustment so I am just testing it 1/2 turn at a time.

 

[direwolf]

There is no such thing as a Vado 3.0 SL

LOL - you're right! Another example of sales people giving out mis-information. Happens all the time. It was probably a 4.0 SL. It looked exactly like this one: https://www.specialized.com/us/en/turbo-vado-sl-40-step-through/p/216534?color=367280-216534 They took the tag off to prep it for me to test ride before I could look at it, but they said it was a 3.0 SL. If not, what the hell was I riding!

 

[direwolf]

As you already know Exactly my situation, too!

I already have 3 -- and that's after selling my old MTB. My wife is not enthralled at this point

 

[mschwett]

I went back to Specialized Santa Monica today. I didn't realize they had taken over the building next door for e-bikes. I was able to ride a Vado 3.0 SL. Large is definitely the right size for me. Maybe I had unrealistic expectations, but I have to say that I was disappointed with the power. On a flat surace, my top speed was about 19mph pedaling fairly hard in top gear. On a very slight downhill, I maxed out at 23mph very briefly, but was more like 21mph. I can go around that fast on my road bike with not that much more effort. I had been under the impression that, in turbo mode, I would be able to cruise at 23-25mph with only moderate effort. That is definitely not the case. I'll keep looking around, but I'm not sure this is realistic for my commuting aspirations. It would be good if I just wanted to cruise at 14mph with very little effort, but that would take me way too long to get to my job. I may just get a slower more cargo oriented bike for shopping instead. Thanks everyone for your help.

Vado SL is too upright, bars too wide, tires too big, etc etc for the relatively low power motor to give you 28mph. since you have a real road bike you know what the secrets to efficiently going fast are

 

[EmilyRides]

I've never used Apex. I have SRAM Rival mechanical on my gravel bike. I don't love the double-tap system, but you get used to it very quickly. The shifts aren't nearly as smooth and crisp as the Campagnolo Chorus-12 on my road bike. The SRAM feels a lot "clunkier." Although not very elegant, it has been extremely reliable, rarely needs adjustment, and works fine. For the money, it's good stuff. I don't love the shape of the hoods though. The Campy is more comfortable for my hands.

Thanks for your reply! Rival is a step up from the entry-level Apex, so I'm not sure I can apply your experience exactly. Too bad Specialized spec'd out the entry-level componentry for this bike (the Creo 2 Comp E5).

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Thanks for your reply! Rival is a step up from the entry-level Apex, so I'm not sure I can apply your experience exactly. Too bad Specialized spec'd out the entry-level componentry for this bike (the Creo 2 Comp E5).

Just pay $1,500 more

 

[thixie]

Just pay $1,500 more

It's actually 2,000 USD difference between the Comp E5 and the Comp (4,500 vs 6,500).

For us in Europe 1,100 EUR difference (4,900 vs 6,000). Super strange choice again...

Why couldn't we just have a Comp E5 for 4,150 EUR or 4,200 EUR?

I'm choosing an e-bike that I can lease through my employer, and a carbon bike compared to an aluminium one is about 12% more expensive at the same price point. So I'm leaning a lot more towards aluminium.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Why couldn't we just have a Comp E5 for 4,150 EUR or 4,200 EUR?

VAT. The US prices are given before taxes.

 

[thixie]

VAT. The US prices are given before taxes.

Well but that doesn't explain the relative difference between the two.

Maybe the real question is, why is the Creo 2 Comp (carbon) in Europe 'cheap' at 6,000 EUR (incl. VAT) compared to 6,500 USD (excl. sales tax)?

Edit: Across the board the price in $ is higher than in EUR. 9k vs 8.5 for the Expert; 14k vs 13 for the S-Works. But then for the E5 the roles are reversed... So seems like bad value for us Europoors. I find it interesting.