Shutup and take my money!!!!! SDuro Full Fatsix

[Dmitri]

Things I'd change on this bike:

• Repaint the frame. I'm sorry but the yellow-green highlights are only suitable for kids' ebikes, not for this type of bike. Not sure what Haibike is thinking.
• Convert to 1-by. There's no reason to have a 2x on an ebike these days, even a fatbike. I'd go for 36 teeth (see next item). Will also need to fix the chainline (not easy!) I'm an idiot, it's 1x already
• Rohloff XXL instead of rear derailleur (requires A12 measurement kit), 14 teeth.
• Replace battery with at least 1000wh because this is a fatbike and Yamaha drives let you use 3rd-party batteries.

Sounds like an interesting project...

Update: just bought one! (~2 months wait before it arrives)...

 

[rich c]

I rode both the all wheel drive BB and the new model with the Brose mid drive. The Brose was better for climbing, it had more torque. I was riding it on a paved trail, but dropped off the side of the trail to test it's climbing. No snow anywhere that time of year, so can't compare snow handling.

 

[Dmitri]

And the saga continues... I ordered one of these in June and still haven't got one. Why? Well because Haibike is in such a hurry to release the 2019 model with their GX Eagle and PW-X that the production timing for the 9.0 (older, 2018 model) has slipped and is now blocked pending some part that they are awaiting from Yamaha.

Don't be surprised -- if Pedelecforum is to be believed, I'm not the only one who ordered the cheaper, older model instead of the fancy 10.0 that's coming this year. The differences? They are:

• The new model is orange. And I don't like orange. And doing a full repaint on a dual-sus is a chore.
• It's got Eagle. I have Eagle on my Salsa and have terrible issues with it. Why? Because the genius designers at SRAM decided to make the two largest cogs on the Eagle drive train narrow-wide. Which means your whole setup can go out-of-sync and you'll be shifting frantically to get it in syncIt . I don't want that.
• It has PW-X. Maybe this is the only reason to get the 2019 model, but then again that's EUR500 more for the bike. Not sure it's worth it.

So we wait and ponder upgrade options. Sad that the FFS rear can only house 4" tires because 4.8" is where all the choice is at. I can't decide whether I want a Mastodon up front or a Fox 34 Plus fork. Decisions decisions.

 

[Mike TowpathTraveler]

Great to see a thread devoted to the Full FatSix. So, for my first post, some thoughts on mine. I got mine from Crazy Lenny's in late winter, 2017. They gave me a price "I couldn't refuse"! which turned out to be a touch over 50% under that max price folks are talking about here.

5600 miles on her so far. I ride her on South New Jersey's potted, frost heaved roads. I'll take her on the nearby Delaware and Raritan feeder canal towpath or across the Delaware River and on the Delaware and Lehigh Canal towpaths system which goes on for well over 100 miles along the Delaware or Lehigh Rivers. I've ridden her on the New Jersey Pine Barren's sugar sand roads; airing the 4.0 Jumbo Jims down to 8 psi for traction.

My rides usually average 20 miles round trip, or I may go on an extended 35 miler. I've done more miles on daytrips, the most being a 95 miler from Homebase up north on both canal systems then back to Home.

I've upgraded the grips to Ergons with my favorite Cane Creek Ergo bar ends, which gives me more positions to place my hands on my trips about. There's a Portland Design Works rear seat post rack and Revelate Designs Terrapin dry bag which contains my tire patch kits, air pump and a cool Alite Designs Mayfly ultralite seat. Up front, a must-have Ortlieb Ultmate 6 Large handlebar bag for the camera, cold drinks, sun glasses and maybe a sandwich. On a long extended trip, I'll attach my Ortlieb Large Commuter Bag or Bags to the Old Man Mountain Phat Sherpa Front Rack that I installed last summer. I had the hardware for this rack powdercoated in matte black, while replacing the OMM plain steel nuts, bolts and clamps with stainless steel hardware for longevity, looks and no chance of rusting.

Current future plans are an OMM Rear Fat Sherpa rack to accomodate Ortlieb rear panniers to make this a true Go Anywhere At Anytime Touring Fat EBike. In addition, like my Specialized Fatboy, I'll outfit the Full FatSix with a Schmidt SON28 dyno hub with a high quality German dyno lighting front and rear system.

Issues with the Yamaha PW drive system: Absolutely NONE. Not one hiccup, unless if I count the time I kicked up a stick on the D&R Canal Towpath, which moved the rear sensor magnet. Just a matter of re-positioning it, tightening her up and getting back up to speed.

Other issues: Well, the JJ's have given me my fair share of flats, from roadside debris to thorns picked up on the trail. Even the MR Tuffy tire liners I installed have not faired well. I am currently trying to switch over to tubeless front and rear, including replacing the tires outright to start anew, fresh. Oh, the front tire is the original tire, running 5600 miles on her.

I cannot praise Haibike enough for the quality built into the design and build of this bike. The battery is the 400wh battery and still has 100% capacity on her. My 20 mile runs see me running her in HIGH power (I am addicted to the sweet power in HIGH and STANDARD power settings. I do not feel the need to ration power, however, that is all dictated on how many miles I plan to run. That 95 mile run saw me run exclusively in ECO, with a few times spent in HIGH to climb the various creek basins we have here that raise elevation rather sharply, all the way to shutting power off completely when I was almost home, on the return end of the trip. All told, I had 18% power remaining on that run. Not bad for a Fat Tired, 60 some odd pound Ebike with dual suspension, eh?

Since this is the first post, I've hopefully included a shot of the Full Fatsix at Milford NJ, D&R Canal, at my halfway point for the 95 mile run I pulled off that day, lotsa Pennsylvania clay dust on the bike at this point!

 

[Dmitri]

Great to see a thread devoted to the Full FatSix. So, for my first post, some thoughts on mine.

Thanks for the review! Interesting approach to the luggage issue, I just plan to make a fullsize rack and attach it to the frame (R&M Delite-style).

One thing to note is the way your tube tape sticks out in your tires... it's not supposed to stick that far out! Are you over-inflating your wheels, perchance? This could actually explain some of the flats you're getting, if you inflated it over the 30psi maximum. I could be mistaken, but things definitely look wrong on your photo.

 

[Mike TowpathTraveler]

Thanks for the review! Interesting approach to the luggage issue, I just plan to make a fullsize rack and attach it to the frame (R&M Delite-style).

One thing to note is the way your tube tape sticks out in your tires... it's not supposed to stick that far out! Are you over-inflating your wheels, perchance? This could actually explain some of the flats you're getting, if you inflated it over the 30psi maximum. I could be mistaken, but things definitely look wrong on your photo.

Hi Dmitri! I like the R&M Delite solution to having a rear rack installed on a full suspension bike. I even thought of the possibilities in having that style rack custom built for the Full FatSix. However, I just couldn't get around to the idea of the mounting points having disturb the integrity of the bike frame. I look forward to seeing what solutions you come up with your Haibike!

Old Man Mountain products Link: http://www.oldmanmountain.com/ has what is the only real solution for those of us who want a rear rack on a rear suspension bike and no hard rack mounting points. It all centers around the axle made by The Robert Axle Project (https://robertaxleproject.com/), specially made for OMM. This thru axle puts the weight of the rack centered on the rear axle, as it should be. My front rack, an OMM rack made specifically for the Rock Shox Bluto fork, features that Robert Axle Project thru axle. I've posted a few pictures of the rack installed on the FatSix to give an idea of what it looks like minus the Ortlieb pannier.

I've yet to contact OMM about that rear rack for purchasing. My concerns are not on whether this rack can work as designed, but rather will their 190mm rear axle fit the 197 rear of this bike. This one will be continued and I'll let everyone know here how it turned out.

Tire Pressures: My tire pressures run anywhere from 25 to 30 psi and I check tire pressures prior to most every ride with my 0-30 psi guage. I like to run at Schwalbe's max of 30 psi on road and hard canal trail runs in order not to expend more battery power on partially deflated tires. It very well could be that with the Mr Tuffy tire liners installed inside my tires has helped contribute to the tubes putting more pressure on the tape strip!

 

[Dmitri]

Finally got my bike today!!! Very happy, obviously. Some observations:

• You can pedal it without battery power! As a Bosch user I'm amazed that this is a thing with Yamaha. I unboxed the bike right at the post office and cycled home. Didn't expect this but now I know, if my batteries die, I'll still make it.
• Yamaha still uses a conventional motor for their fatbike build, but the spider is huge! I've never seen a spider this big. I know Bosch fatbikes offset the motor in the frame. Yamaha's solution is way better, also, no proprietary chainrings required, you can just replace it with an ordinary chainring.
• This bike has a heavy duty chainstay protector... not just a piece of fabric but a large, solid piece of plastic held with two zip ties. It looks great and is probably a lot more reliable.
• The front hub of the bike actually has some sort of extension mechanism to fit the fatbike fork. What I mean is, it's a 150mm front fork, but it isn't a 150mm hub, it looks like a smaller hub that's adapted to this fork size. I don't like this, it looks a bit exposed, I can see dust and mud and whatnot getting there. Not planning to upgrade it if it fails, but this is something to watch out for.
• Bike has a 'port' for front derailleur but it's 1x (which is good).

Altogether I don't see any particularly stupid decisions on this bike, so I'm happy. Here's the list of updates so far:

• Mastodon Pro replaces the Bluto fork. I don't like Bluto so it's going into storage.
• Serfas Rx Cruiser seat. A bit weird looking on a dropper seat post.
• Kona Wah Wah pedals. I wanted the big spikes.

And I absolutely hate the Magura MT5 brakes. I've already posted about how bad and spongy they are, and it feels like the rear brake hasn't even been bled properly so I'll have to rebleed it at some point. The MT5 brakes will be replaced soon with Shimano Saint (rotors will be replaced with Ice Tech ones).

Video review coming very soon.

 

[bob armani]

I was very close but just can't justify it with a Full Seven RX in the garage. Fat tires only "real" dif. So I went with a much cheaper Easy Motion Big Bud with 2wd to try something different. (we are FLAT, very little snow and no sand LOL)
Another GREAT deal from Crazy Lenny " Now I gotta get rid of a couple bikes.

https://www.electricbikeattack.com

AWD must be awesome to ride on any E-bike. However, I cannot help to think the battery drain would be quick considering you have to power 2 motors. Probably a nice trade off though...

 

[Dmitri]

AWD must be awesome to ride on any E-bike. However, I cannot help to think the battery drain would be quick considering you have to power 2 motors. Probably a nice trade off though...

Actually it shouldn't drain the battery any differently to a single motor. Another question is whether or not AWD really helps with anything. I suspect that it only helps in a situation where you install two rear-specific tires on both the front and the rear of the bike.

 

[Dmitri]

Some photos of the bike:

 

[bob armani]

Actually it shouldn't drain the battery any differently to a single motor. Another question is whether or not AWD really helps with anything. I suspect that it only helps in a situation where you install two rear-specific tires on both the front and the rear of the bike.

Okay interesting! Not a bad upgrade on the tire issue for improved traction, etc. Like the concept though.

 

[bob armani]

Finally got my bike today!!! Very happy, obviously. Some observations:

• You can pedal it without battery power! As a Bosch user I'm amazed that this is a thing with Yamaha. I unboxed the bike right at the post office and cycled home. Didn't expect this but now I know, if my batteries die, I'll still make it.
• Yamaha still uses a conventional motor for their fatbike build, but the spider is huge! I've never seen a spider this big. I know Bosch fatbikes offset the motor in the frame. Yamaha's solution is way better, also, no proprietary chainrings required, you can just replace it with an ordinary chainring.
• This bike has a heavy duty chainstay protector... not just a piece of fabric but a large, solid piece of plastic held with two zip ties. It looks great and is probably a lot more reliable.
• The front hub of the bike actually has some sort of extension mechanism to fit the fatbike fork. What I mean is, it's a 150mm front fork, but it isn't a 150mm hub, it looks like a smaller hub that's adapted to this fork size. I don't like this, it looks a bit exposed, I can see dust and mud and whatnot getting there. Not planning to upgrade it if it fails, but this is something to watch out for.
• Bike has a 'port' for front derailleur but it's 1x (which is good).

Altogether I don't see any particularly stupid decisions on this bike, so I'm happy. Here's the list of updates so far:

• Mastodon Pro replaces the Bluto fork. I don't like Bluto so it's going into storage.
• Serfas Rx Cruiser seat. A bit weird looking on a dropper seat post.
• Kona Wah Wah pedals. I wanted the big spikes.

And I absolutely hate the Magura MT5 brakes. I've already posted about how bad and spongy they are, and it feels like the rear brake hasn't even been bled properly so I'll have to rebleed it at some point. The MT5 brakes will be replaced soon with Shimano Saint (rotors will be replaced with Ice Tech ones).

Video review coming very soon.

Dimitri- Magura MT5 brakes: not so good ahh? Surprised to hear that. Was always under the impression that Magura was one of the more premium brands in that space. Heck, I have low end Tektro Hydro brakes on my E-bike and they are smooth and have nice stopping power. Could there be a defect somewhere in the system?

 

[Mike TowpathTraveler]

I'm with Bob Armani on this one. My Specialized Fatboy has the Tektro Gemini hydraulics. Even after putting Shimano Ice Tec rotors on the bike, there was just something in how the brakes felt that I didn't much care for. After getting the Haibike Full FatSix with the Magura's; it was a night and day difference in feel.

Go to the MTBR forum and you'll find lotsa people who complain about Magura's; but that's the internet for ya. I like mine and after a lot of miles piled up on them, they still deliver. I suppose at a bit over 5600 miles I could use some new pads and a re-bleeding of the braking system.

 

[Dmitri]

My issue with Magura is the feel of those brakes. They feel spongy and too 'progressive' for my liking. Whether you buy Shimano or SRAM brakes, you'll never get that annoying sinking feeling, there's never any 'hard point' when you know the brakes are about to bite. And then there are just incidental observations. Like the fact that the bike came from the factory and already the rear brake feels soft and probably needs to be re-bled.

Ultimately I just don't see the point of using them given we have Shimano Saint and the like. But I'll keep riding with Magura brakes for a while, we'll see how it goes, maybe I'll get used to them, but in all likelyhood I'll just get annoyed and throw give them away.

I have to give credit to Magura though for the way they snuck themselves in to other aspects of ebike infrastructure. In particular, they integrate with Bosch ABS and Supernova rear light. They also happen to make suspension forks, in particular the ill-fated Boltron inverted fork (courtesy of a company called, surprise, White Power) that makers such as Haibike and KTM, tried to use on their bikes but gave up due to too much flex as well as the fact that these forks weren't user-serviceable. Interesting that they still sell them, though, at a price of about €1000.

 

[bob armani]

I'm with Bob Armani on this one. My Specialized Fatboy has the Tektro Gemini hydraulics. Even after putting Shimano Ice Tec rotors on the bike, there was just something in how the brakes felt that I didn't much care for. After getting the Haibike Full FatSix with the Magura's; it was a night and day difference in feel.

Go to the MTBR forum and you'll find lotsa people who complain about Magura's; but that's the internet for ya. I like mine and after a lot of miles piled up on them, they still deliver. I suppose at a bit over 5600 miles I could use some new pads and a re-bleeding of the braking system.

Wow 5,600 miles in with the Magura brakes and still giving good service? That is very encouraging. Only have a little over 3000 miles on the Tektro's and they continue to have that smooth and precise stopping power. Perhaps I do not know what premium brakes feel like as I always had center pull or mechanical disks on most of my bikes moving forward. Hydros feel so much better all the ,way around. Cannot go back to the others now LOL!

 

[Mike TowpathTraveler]

Wow 5,600 miles in with the Magura brakes and still giving good service? That is very encouraging. Only have a little over 3000 miles on the TeTektro's and they continue to have that smooth and precise stopping power. Perhaps I do not know what premium brakes feel like as I always had center pull or mechanical disks on most of my bikes moving forward. Hydros feel so much better all the ,way around. Cannot go back to the others now LOL!

Bob, I went from my Trek Soho DLX with the front shimano mechanical disc brake and the rear shimano roller brake to the Tektro Gemini's on the Fatboy and what a difference I found between mechanical and hydraulic brakes. But then after the Haibike with the Magura's, there was a definite difference in feel, modulation and stopping power. I believe Dmitri when he says there is a big difference between the Magura's and the higher end Shimano's and Srams.....but I am pretty darn happy with the Maguras and just plan on getting new pads and re-bleeding the old oil out of they system.

 

[bob armani]

Great to see a thread devoted to the Full FatSix. So, for my first post, some thoughts on mine. I got mine from Crazy Lenny's in late winter, 2017. They gave me a price "I couldn't refuse"! which turned out to be a touch over 50% under that max price folks are talking about here.

5600 miles on her so far. I ride her on South New Jersey's potted, frost heaved roads. I'll take her on the nearby Delaware and Raritan feeder canal towpath or across the Delaware River and on the Delaware and Lehigh Canal towpaths system which goes on for well over 100 miles along the Delaware or Lehigh Rivers. I've ridden her on the New Jersey Pine Barren's sugar sand roads; airing the 4.0 Jumbo Jims down to 8 psi for traction.

My rides usually average 20 miles round trip, or I may go on an extended 35 miler. I've done more miles on daytrips, the most being a 95 miler from Homebase up north on both canal systems then back to Home.

I've upgraded the grips to Ergons with my favorite Cane Creek Ergo bar ends, which gives me more positions to place my hands on my trips about. There's a Portland Design Works rear seat post rack and Revelate Designs Terrapin dry bag which contains my tire patch kits, air pump and a cool Alite Designs Mayfly ultralite seat. Up front, a must-have Ortlieb Ultmate 6 Large handlebar bag for the camera, cold drinks, sun glasses and maybe a sandwich. On a long extended trip, I'll attach my Ortlieb Large Commuter Bag or Bags to the Old Man Mountain Phat Sherpa Front Rack that I installed last summer. I had the hardware for this rack powdercoated in matte black, while replacing the OMM plain steel nuts, bolts and clamps with stainless steel hardware for longevity, looks and no chance of rusting.

Current future plans are an OMM Rear Fat Sherpa rack to accomodate Ortlieb rear panniers to make this a true Go Anywhere At Anytime Touring Fat EBike. In addition, like my Specialized Fatboy, I'll outfit the Full FatSix with a Schmidt SON28 dyno hub with a high quality German dyno lighting front and rear system.

Issues with the Yamaha PW drive system: Absolutely NONE. Not one hiccup, unless if I count the time I kicked up a stick on the D&R Canal Towpath, which moved the rear sensor magnet. Just a matter of re-positioning it, tightening her up and getting back up to speed.

Other issues: Well, the JJ's have given me my fair share of flats, from roadside debris to thorns picked up on the trail. Even the MR Tuffy tire liners I installed have not faired well. I am currently trying to switch over to tubeless front and rear, including replacing the tires outright to start anew, fresh. Oh, the front tire is the original tire, running 5600 miles on her.

I cannot praise Haibike enough for the quality built into the design and build of this bike. The battery is the 400wh battery and still has 100% capacity on her. My 20 mile runs see me running her in HIGH power (I am addicted to the sweet power in HIGH and STANDARD power settings. I do not feel the need to ration power, however, that is all dictated on how many miles I plan to run. That 95 mile run saw me run exclusively in ECO, with a few times spent in HIGH to climb the various creek basins we have here that raise elevation rather sharply, all the way to shutting power off completely when I was almost home, on the return end of the trip. All told, I had 18% power remaining on that run. Not bad for a Fat Tired, 60 some odd pound Ebike with dual suspension, eh?

Since this is the first post, I've hopefully included a shot of the Full Fatsix at Milford NJ, D&R Canal, at my halfway point for the 95 mile run I pulled off that day, lotsa Pennsylvania clay dust on the bike at this point!

Mike Towpath- Awesome looking bike and not a hiccup? Now that's what I love to see. This a real piece of work for reliability and aesthetic looks. We can all thank CL for the awesome deals he has been giving many of us including the two bikes I purchased from him at a great value as well. Looks like this bike can tackle just about anything you throw at it. Never did a test ride on one of these but it looks like loads of fun. Enjoy.

 

[bob armani]

My issue with Magura is the feel of those brakes. They feel spongy and too 'progressive' for my liking. Whether you buy Shimano or SRAM brakes, you'll never get that annoying sinking feeling, there's never any 'hard point' when you know the brakes are about to bite. And then there are just incidental observations. Like the fact that the bike came from the factory and already the rear brake feels soft and probably needs to be re-bled.

Ultimately I just don't see the point of using them given we have Shimano Saint and the like. But I'll keep riding with Magura brakes for a while, we'll see how it goes, maybe I'll get used to them, but in all likelyhood I'll just get annoyed and throw give them away.

I have to give credit to Magura though for the way they snuck themselves in to other aspects of ebike infrastructure. In particular, they integrate with Bosch ABS and Supernova rear light. They also happen to make suspension forks, in particular the ill-fated Boltron inverted fork (courtesy of a company called, surprise, White Power) that makers such as Haibike and KTM, tried to use on their bikes but gave up due to too much flex as well as the fact that these forks weren't user-serviceable. Interesting that they still sell them, though, at a price of about €1000.

Dmitri- I can see now why you are not a big fan of these brakes. I myself cannot feel comfortable with a brake that does not bite when you want it to or when you expect it to do so at the right pressure point. I am not a big fan of the spongy feel. You never know when it is going to bite and gradually slow you down to a complete stopping point. Very annoying indeed.

 

[Mike TowpathTraveler]

Mike Towpath- Awesome looking bike and not a hiccup? Now that's what I love to see. This a real piece of work for reliability and aesthetic looks. We can all thank CL for the awesome deals he has been giving many of us including the two bikes I purchased from him at a great value as well. Looks like this bike can tackle just about anything you throw at it. Never did a test ride on one of these but it looks like loads of fun. Enjoy.

Hi Bob,
Short story: I bought a new Trek Soho DLX with the gates belt drive and set it up for road touring; Brooks Devon rear bags, Brooks front bag, Schmidt Dyno Hub and Edelux II light. I remember this fat tired bike in the shop where I bought the Trek, a 9 Zero 7. That bike always stayed in my mind as being more practical as to where I wanted to ride it; be it around home on asphalt, the nearby canal towpaths along the Delaware River, or the nearby NJ Pine Barrens with foot plus deep sugar sand roads. I wound up purchasing a Specialized Fatboy and set it up like I did the Trek, with Schmidt Dyno Hub, B&M light, rear tail light, front & rear racks, Ortlieb bag set up in hazel/brown. I put over 3k miles on this bike and loved every minute of it. Fatbikes really are a game changer; the ride is plush and assuring. Rutted roads are not an issue. You just aren't going to get there as fast as a narrow tired bike. Then, I discovered this site. And in particular, Court had just reviewed the Haibike FatSix and the Felt Outfitter.

The Full FatSix arrived in March, 2017 and ever since, I have put maybe 3-4 miles on the Fatboy. The Yamaha PW drive has been perfect. Only issue I ever had was when a stick kicked up into my bike wheel on one of my canal runs, moving the speed sensor magnet out of position. Easy fix. I've run this bike 12 months of the year, in snow and sub freezing temperatures as well as summer heat with road temps at about 120 degrees f. Got caught in a deluge of rain so hard, I worried for the drive system....no problem! Local daily runs of 20 miles done in HIGH power; come back with 50% power remaining. Did a 95 mile run this summer in power settings to OFF to HIGH power, mostly running in ECO and ECO+; came back home with 18% battery power left. I tend to not run after a snow fall due to my homestate applying liberal amounts of road salt down, a killer for any bike as far as corrosion and clean up goes. As we go along here, I'll document the upgrades I do. Still in the works are a dyno hub lighting system as well as a rear rack and rear panniers. I also eventually want to get a second battery, the 500wh version; to really give this bike the potential to be a 100 mile a day bike tourer.

 

[bob armani]

Hi Bob,
Short story: I bought a new Trek Soho DLX with the gates belt drive and set it up for road touring; Brooks Devon rear bags, Brooks front bag, Schmidt Dyno Hub and Edelux II light. I remember this fat tired bike in the shop where I bought the Trek, a 9 Zero 7. That bike always stayed in my mind as being more practical as to where I wanted to ride it; be it around home on asphalt, the nearby canal towpaths along the Delaware River, or the nearby NJ Pine Barrens with foot plus deep sugar sand roads. I wound up purchasing a Specialized Fatboy and set it up like I did the Trek, with Schmidt Dyno Hub, B&M light, rear tail light, front & rear racks, Ortlieb bag set up in hazel/brown. I put over 3k miles on this bike and loved every minute of it. Fatbikes really are a game changer; the ride is plush and assuring. Rutted roads are not an issue. You just aren't going to get there as fast as a narrow tired bike. Then, I discovered this site. And in particular, Court had just reviewed the Haibike FatSix and the Felt Outfitter.

The Full FatSix arrived in March, 2017 and ever since, I have put maybe 3-4 miles on the Fatboy. The Yamaha PW drive has been perfect. Only issue I ever had was when a stick kicked up into my bike wheel on one of my canal runs, moving the speed sensor magnet out of position. Easy fix. I've run this bike 12 months of the year, in snow and sub freezing temperatures as well as summer heat with road temps at about 120 degrees f. Got caught in a deluge of rain so hard, I worried for the drive system....no problem! Local daily runs of 20 miles done in HIGH power; come back with 50% power remaining. Did a 95 mile run this summer in power settings to OFF to HIGH power, mostly running in ECO and ECO+; came back home with 18% battery power left. I tend to not run after a snow fall due to my homestate applying liberal amounts of road salt down, a killer for any bike as far as corrosion and clean up goes. As we go along here, I'll document the upgrades I do. Still in the works are a dyno hub lighting system as well as a rear rack and rear panniers. I also eventually want to get a second battery, the 500wh version; to really give this bike the potential to be a 100 mile a day bike tourer.

Hello Mike Towpath-Outstanding review indeed. 95 miles with 18% left is phenomenal for any E-bike. Looks like Yamaha has really shined on this bike. Always have had good service with any products bearing the Yamaha name. From Motorcycles to stereo equipment. Certainly is a rugged machine. Court's review revealed that at the time of release, they all became in back-ordered status from US to Europe. Haibike could not make them fast enough for the sudden demand. Now we see why! Not sure how the new ones are compared to the 2016/17 models. I see Lenny's has a few models.
Thanks for sharing. Updates appreciated.