Peak Considerations

[Rusty]

Court and I tend to agree on the somewhat hidden merits of the Izip Peak electric mid drive mountain bike. Consider the following:

1. The Peak is the only mountain bike that is classed as a high-speed pedelec in EBR's tests.
2. It is rated (and warrantied) by Currie as a condition 3 hardtail - rated for true off-road usage "for cross country, marathon riding and racing over roots, rocks, etc." (from the owner's manual)!!
3. The transx mid drive unit powering the Peak has not suffered from reliability problems. (no bad batches like the some of the Currie hub drives)
4. The mid drive in the Peak is rated at 73nm of torque. Bosch standard drive is rated at 50. Even the Bosch performance line is rated at 60nm. Is the Peak the most powerful mid- drive production bike you can buy right now? And the cheapest?
5. Even if you can de-restrict the Bosch's speed cut-off, you still won't give the Bosch motor any more torque than what it is rated at - it remains at 60 nm which is still about 20% less max torque than the Peak. And de-restriction may cause warranty and other problems. Not so with the Peak!
6. The Peak is beefy, with a massive tapered head tube and top and down tubing. Compare the build and front fork to the Neo line of mountain type bikes like the Neo 650B Jumper from Easy Motion for example - you will see the difference.
7. The Peak has a 48 volt system, like the Dash. Almost everyone else, (including Bosch) are still using 36 volt systems.
8. If you just slightly pause before you shift, it does shift smoothly. SRAM units in general kind of "clunk" anyway under load on all bikes . The Bosch units actually reduce the motor's torque under when shifting, but you can just do it yourself on the Peak ( like a clutch vs an automatic). No big deal once you get the hang of it.
9. The Peak has a throttle (though limited to 6 mph by design). It enables and assists restarts and rough going in single track conditions. It is a great aid when starting off and when plonking around trails.
10. The Peak is not overly heavy (around 49 lbs) and is actually easy and fun to drive without any electric assist. It offers a 27.5 wheel diameter as standard fitment.

Well, all for now, not against other bike lines at all, just pointing out some aspects of this somewhat "hidden gem" of an e-bike for comparison and educational purposes within the e-bike community.

Like many of us, I really like the looks and specs of some of the new mid-drives coming out of Europe, but the Peak is available (backed with an apparently responsive company) and is so reasonably priced, that it may prove a great alternative to consider. It is also a hot rod, kinda like a Corvette, vs the Haibike which is more like a Porsche, which is more exclusive and refined apparently, but not as fast!

P.S. Included a foto of me educating a bunch of co-workers on ebikes, with my Peak being the demonstration vehicle. If you haven't figured out by now, Yes, I really like it!! .



Cheers,
Rusty

 

[Vern]

ok I'm sold. But I think I will wait for the full suspension version. I wonder what Larry P. would say about Peak vs Haibike comparisons

 

[DashRiprock]

Since we haven't had time to ride even our new Dash much let alone get my wife down to look at an ebike for her... your points seem to hit home and make me somewhat wish that she adopts the Dash as her own. I would like a true off road ebike to use as a 'backup back to camp' for our side-by-side and the Peak uses the same battery which we could obviously carry along also. You may have convinced me to make certain that she definitely doesn't prefer the PathPlus over the Dash.

I also wanted to point out that a lot of folks seem to talk Currie bikes on here yet I haven't seen evidence (at least so far) that any of us are at the least bit 'fan boys' for the brand. "I" for one am seeing (and remember, this is an 'older' newb to bikes 'period' talking) decent value and service in these particular bikes at the moment given a market sector that is by no means bulletproof by design (lightweight/electronics/often day to day abuse).

And if TransX is indeed making a run at even the Bosch second generation drives with this introductory model... then I believe this is worthy of discussion regarding this particular model (thanks for starting it, Rusty).

 

[DashRiprock]

"..Is the Peak the most powerful mid- drive production bike you can buy right now? And the cheapest?.."

I'm assuming that Rusty is asking this question (yet pretty sure of the answer) rather than declaring it so...are there any detractors out there?

 

[Charly Banana]

Rusty,

Every time I read your reviews about the Peak, I start wishing I would have bought the Peak instead of the Dash. Mid-drive seems to be the future. With the Dash there are some extreme hills where I live that I just can't make it to the top without stopping and resting. I'm thinking the Peak might have been a better choice considering I'm surrounded by hills.

 

[DashRiprock]

Rusty,

"...With the Dash there are some extreme hills where I live that I just can't make it to the top without stopping and resting. I'm thinking the Peak might have been a better choice considering I'm surrounded by hills..."

Alright...I'll bite.

What will the Peak's mid drive (geared) motor 'do' to get you up that (I'm assuming paved) hills...that your direct drive Dash (with hybrid tires) won't? Is it a gearing issue rather than a motor design or placement of same? I understand the benefits of a mid-drive over other designs (off road) yet am obviously ignorant otherwise in terms of what the Peak can do on the street (again, I'm assuming) as well.

 

[Charly Banana]

Alright...I'll bite.

What will the Peak's mid drive (geared) motor 'do' to get you up that (I'm assuming paved) hills...that your direct drive Dash (with hybrid tires) won't? Is it a gearing issue rather than a motor design or placement of same? I understand the benefits of a mid-drive over other designs (off road) yet am obviously ignorant otherwise in terms of what the peak can do on the street (again, I'm assuming) as well.

From what I've read and also what I'm somewhat guessing is that the gears allow the motor to run at it's best torque range. I think that the hub motor at low rpms does not have as much torque as it does when it is rotating faster. That's my uneducated understanding. Hopefully, someone smarter like Ravi can explain this better.

 

[DashRiprock]

....with the followup question obviously being...how much battery power is lost on the pavement (as well as increased pedaling effort per charge) when using aggressive vs non-agressive treads? Does the smaller motor (at least in terms of battery life per charge) make up for this..or is tire tread design the equalizer?

 

[DashRiprock]

From what I've read and also what I'm somewhat guessing is that the gears allow the motor to run at it's best torque range. I think that the hub motor at low rpms does not have as much torque as it does when it is rotating faster. That's my uneducated understanding. Hopefully, someone smarter like Ravi can explain this better.

Increased torque at low range in terms of keeping momentum would explain a lot, thanks for the insight!

 

[Charly Banana]

Increased torque at low range in terms of keeping momentum would explain a lot, thanks for the insight!

Here's an explanation I just finished reading
http://www.bikeebike.com

 

[Rusty]

Hi guys, now that I have convinced some of you perhaps to look at the Peak, let me give you the other side. Yes, the Peak will easily out-climb and out accelerate the Dash. My son and I proved that on a back-to-back test ride.

And yes, the Peak will climb any hill. If you "gas it" it a low gear it will try to buck you off! And yes, I decided on the Peak because I ride almost two miles of hills to work (up to around 12% grade) and also live in an area of hills. I read many reviews that state that mid-drive is the future. It may be, but there is still something to be said for hub drives too.

Like I have stated, I like all kinds of e-bikes, but selected the Peak because of its incredible attributes and price. With a mid drive, you have to work, you have to ride it like a bicycle. A hub drive can kind of ignore the bicycle gear shifting mindset entirely, especially with a full range throttle. Hub-drives are fun!

Mid-drives are more, well, "cerebral". You don't feel like you are free and zipping along like on a scooter, instead you are riding a bike, you need to pedal, you need to shift. Of course, on a mid-drive, this is a bicycle with greatly expanded capabilities, and that is where the "fun" comes from, from the mental part of increasing your abilities, not the sheer joy of free motion. Hope that makes some sense.

I liken the Peak as having a "350" (you car guys will know what I mean) with a 9 speed transmission. The Dash has a 500 big block with a powerglide with only top gear working. See what I mean?

The big block will move out once it gets rolling but is really weak off the line and will lug up hills poorly. The "little" 350 will blow it away off the line and uphills, but once up to max speed, it may fall behind the big block. But in the case of the Peak it has even more torque than the Dash, so its really hard to beat. But it takes more effort to drive. The big block is lazy but fun. Hope this helps a bit.

Yes, I think that the Peak with 73nm of torque is the most powerful production e-bike you can buy right now. It is certainly a great value.

As far as tread design goes, I noted that the Dash went about 3mph faster than the Peak on the top end 33 vs 30 mph on our test ride, and that could be in large part because of the difference in tread and tread width between the two.

Cheers,
Rusty

 

[Charly Banana]

Like I have stated, I like all kinds of e-bikes, but selected the Peak because of its incredible attributes and price. With a mid drive, you have to work, you have to ride it like a bicycle. A hub drive can kind of ignore the bicycle gear shifting mindset entirely, especially with a full range throttle. Hub-drives are fun!

Mid-drives are more, well, "cerebral". You don't feel like you are free and zipping along like on a scooter, instead you are riding a bike, you need to pedal, you need to shift. Of course, on a mid-drive, this is a bicycle with greatly expanded capabilities, and that is where the "fun" comes from, from the mental part of increasing your abilities, not the sheer joy of free motion. Hope that makes some sense.

Rusty,

I just love reading your reviews of the Peak! You were very smart in your research and test riding of bikes in the beginning. And although I really like my Dash (except for the motor magnets), it sounds more and more like the Peak would have been a better choice for me.

First of all, I never use the throttle or the cruise control. It's the pedaling and shifting that I like. The idea of shifting not only for your legs, but shifting for the best motor response sounds like a lot of fun! It's almost like shifting on a motorcycle for optimum rpms. If my love for electric bikes continues through next year, maybe I'll get the 2015 version of the Peak. Thanks for your great Peak reports!

 

[Vern]

Rusty,

Being a car guy I love your Peak vs Dash comparison. I totally get your analogy. My sister in law just got a pair of Pedegos. Great bikes for those who want the scooter experience with a bit of pedaling thrown in, but not my style at all. I enjoy driving a manual car, even though I presently drive a boring automatic, and I really like the "bike" experience that my Neo Carbon offers. I must try out that Peak ASAP!

 

[Admin]

Great writeup @Rusty, I agree that the Peak is an awesome value and offers superior climbing ability and battery range (if used properly) than the Dash. Your car analogy is great, sometimes it's hard to communicate the difference between each drive type. If you and your son do another head to head comparison it would make for an awesome video! You could talk about how each bike offers XYZ benefits and then actually demonstrate them for the camera and race

 

[DashRiprock]

What is interesting to me is that I can go from a dead stop on the Dash (speed bump at the bottom of a steep drive that immediately slopes 9 feet up in 40 some odd feet)...either pedal in #1 assist/1st gear or use throttle/pedal...and never take my butt off the seat or expend much energy doing it.
Keep in mind that this is with a fully loaded bike (double panniers; all kinds of crap in them) and toting a guy closer to 300 than 200 pounds.
Will a Peak do this much easier and what would it be like(?)....two strokes of the pedal and you're coasting up to the top having to lean forward all the way to keep the front end down?
Gosh, I love my Dash's 20 mph throttle..it wouldn't be easy to give it up!

 

[Rusty]

The throttle is what makes the Dash so much fun!

What would happen on the Peak is that you would be able to take that same steep drive in 4th, 5th, or maybe even 6th gear - on throttle alone. (At least up to 6 mph, where it cuts off)
Rusty

 

[Rusty]

Great writeup @Rusty, I agree that the Peak is an awesome value and offers superior climbing ability and battery range (if used properly) than the Dash. Your car analogy is great, sometimes it's hard to communicate the difference between each drive type. If you and your son do another head to head comparison it would make for an awesome video! You could talk about how each bike offers XYZ benefits and then actually demonstrate them for the camera and race

Thanks for the suggestions! I think that I might wear out my welcome at that same bike shop (the only one that had both bikes in stock) if I returned for a third extended test ride! The Dash would eventually pass the Peak once it caught up!

 

[DashRiprock]

We've decided to go with the Peak sight unseen and (thankfully) given Rusty's review above. I'm hoping that we pick the right size and wondered just how tall any owners up here were and what size they chose (thanks in advance).

 

[Ravi Kempaiah]

A month ago, I took a 40 min test ride on E3 peak ( on a beautiful Washington and old dominion trail). I liked it. The PAS 2 was enough to take me to 19 or 20mph on a flat road. In PAS 3 , I was able to cruise at 27mph. I'm 6ft and large fit me well.

I liked peak better than the dash because it felt nimble and much lighter than the dash.

 

[DashRiprock]

Thanks, Ravi...I'm hoping that Larry chimes in with a full suspension update as well...

ok I'm sold. But I think I will wait for the full suspension version. I wonder what Larry P. would say about Peak vs Haibike comparisons