New Bosch Motors Q&A

[Captain Slow]

Yeah, right. Repair a chain in the field. If 1 in 1000 even know what chain break tool looks like, let alone how to use one, it would be a stretch.

"it would be a stretch" was that meant to be double entendre? i.e. stretched chain breaking ......

Anyhow I know this is off the original topic but I disagree that it's hard to fix a chain in the field. My son broke a chain on his relatively new MTB, I got a new chain and told him to wait for me to install it. He has very little experience working on bikes and was only 12 at the time. He installed it himself and it's still working fine. Fixing a chain is pretty easy as far as bike repairs and maintenance go.

 

[TrevorB]

Been quite few new eMTBs released recently with lot running new CX motor 630wh powertube battery. Focus Jam has switch from Shimano to this Bosch combination. Looks like Bosch is onto winner, should start to crawl back market share with this new combination.

While I'd like to see 700wh battery the new 630wh with more efficient new CX motor is about equivelant to old CX with 700wh. Don't be surprised if they bring out 700wh in year or two.

On a side note Brose has just released a range of ebike systems ie motors, batteries and controls much same as Bosch, along with support centers. The big plus of this approach is bike manufacturers don't need to worry about after market support of ebike system, as suppliers have it covered. Brose still allows manufacturers option to provided customised batteries and controls unlike Bosch.

 

[smorgasbord]

Here's a link to Bosch's website with specs on all their motors, including the new ones: https://www.bosch-ebike.com/us/products/drive-units/

Click on "Technical Details" to see a comparison chart.

 

[Ken M]

I notice that some people believe the oppressively low speed ebike assist limits came from the minds of lawmakers but I think they came from the minds of beancounters and marketing managers at the mid drive companies. They are well aware that the mid drive configuration looses it's competitive edge as the assist speed goes over 25kph. What better way to keep the DD and gear hub motor companies from getting any market share than to take away their advantage at better power delivery to the rear wheel at the higher assist speeds.

I just get a kick out of the Bosch executives seeming appalled by the regulations and them being forced to have software that detects the unlocking devices when they know it's all about protecting their products. If we don't watch out the mamby-pamby will use lobbyist to have the federal assist limit set at 25kph. Then we'll never know if ebikes could have achieved their potential as truly great human scale transportation.

Note: Time is money when you are commuting so all you leisure riders that never go over 25 kph please refrain from saying it's too dangerous and not necessary. I realize you lost the effort to hold interstate and highway speeds for cars at 55mph, so just don't engage again in a speed debate. In reality we are very unlikely to see pedelec assist speeds exceed 50-55kph because cadence and wind resistance are not easily solved such that emopeds and emotorcycles will address the needs for those speeds.

 

[elainehillrider]

I notice that some people believe the oppressively low speed ebike assist limits came from the minds of lawmakers but I think they came from the minds of beancounters and marketing managers at the mid drive companies. They are well aware that the mid drive configuration looses it's competitive edge as the assist speed goes over 25kph. What better way to keep the DD and gear hub motor companies from getting any market share than to take away their advantage at better power delivery to the rear wheel at the higher assist speeds.

I just get a kick out of the Bosch executives seeming appalled by the regulations and them being forced to have software that detects the unlocking devices when they know it's all about protecting their products. If we don't watch out the mamby-pamby will use lobbyist to have the federal assist limit set at 25kph. Then we'll never know if ebikes could have achieved their potential as truly great human scale transportation.

.

I never thought this way but it make sense. I agree about safety issues too. But marketing motivation make more sense. As over 20 mph most mid-drives will lose their competitive advantage against hub motors. I won't see any mid-drive going over 28 mph easily (and even can needs like super rigid drivetrain ) .

 

[Manu]

+ 28 mph no with 250/350 w mid-drive but ........900w/1000 w yep ....the spitzing=75km/h+

 

[michwalker]

nice video manu. whats the motor there ?

 

[Manu]

TQ HPR 120S 900 watts

https://m1-spitzing-evolution.de/das-spitzing-evolution/das-spitzing-evolution-r-pedelec/

 

[elect]

Can any European riders confirm this?

I think is a little too much.

To say, the insurance here in Germany starts from 27€/year (checked yesterday). I have no idea about the check-up prices, but 400$/€ seems overestimated

 

[Sweetwater]

TQ HPR 120S 900 watts

https://m1-spitzing-evolution.de/das-spitzing-evolution/das-spitzing-evolution-r-pedelec/

Nice bike but very expensive by my standards.
I own #2 Bosch ebikes at less than half the price for both.
I suspect that dealerships and support are not available as well.

 

[elliot friedman]

As far as I'm concerned,

A class 3 ebike can go as slow as a class 1 ebike.

A human powered bicycle is capable of going faster than any class ebike.

 

[Ken M]

Good questions asked of Bosch. Interesting replies.

The throttle topic is rarely an issue where customers say they don't want one. The only time they don't want one is when they are concerned about regulations. So it's purely a regulatory issue where people who legislate decide no throttle somehow makes the ebike safer. What they don't realize is an ebike is slower in throttle only mode, as the motor is doing all the work, and it really wasnt meant for that. The motors and battery capacities on ebikes are designed for 'assisting' the human. Imagine what that actually means.

I have heard that here in the US, Bosch actually lobbies to ban throttles completely. So if that's true, don't expect them to say publicly they will ever offer a throttle. Yamaha is the same way in that they refuse to offer a throttle.

Bosch promotes the 3 ebike classes here as well to ensure they're low power European mid drives are a viable solution here in the US. They don't fight the extra costs of a speed pedelec in Europe.

Why does everyone think that when using a throttle that a rider can't pedal? A throttle in nothing else but an infinitely variable assist controller ... sure it allows not pedaling but when I use a throttle I'm pedaling 95% of the time just as I do on my Haibike with Yamaha mid drive.