Mid drive TSDZ2 with torque sensor - thoughts and question(s)

[TakO]

Hey folks,

I finished (or almost finished) my TSDZ2 conversion of a Giant Talon hardtail bike. I actually picked up the Talon used specifically for this conversion, so I didn't have time to get to attached to it in its non-electric state. I gotta say, I'm diggin' it.

I really love the torque sensor. I've ridden some hub motor bikes with cadence sensors and I thought they felt kinda strange and a bit jerky. I'm sure many of you have read that before. I mean they're fun, don't get me wrong. They just didn't feel like bikes to me. The motor was doing most of the work and the pedals were moving, but not really doing anything. By contrast, the mid drive, torque sensing bikes I've ridden felt/feel like bikes, but I also feel like I have super strength and stamina. Pretty awesome.

I also approached the whole e-bike idea from the standpoint of wanting to get my father (in his later years) to get some exercise and for it to be simple and safe. I kinda feel like these zippy hub motor bikes with a throttle may be a little confusing to him and he'd either end up only using the throttle or end up getting in a wreck. So I've focused on mid drive torque sensor bikes. And due to costs and the limited options for torque sensing kits, I ended up trying out the TongSheng TSDZ2. So far, I'm very happy with it.

There are a couple of things that I wish I had thought about a bit more before I started.

First, the Talon came with a terrible SR Suntour XCT fork that barely works. I mean it almost doesn't move at all. I guess I'll be looking for a replacement fork, but I may try to open this one up and clean it first.

Second, I bought the 500W 48V version. I'm definitely happy with it, but I see that there's a 750W version. I'd consider that one, if I were to do it again. There are also versions that come with a pre-loaded open-source firmware update and different controller that have all kinds of nice bells and whistles. I might consider that one too.

I had a question about trying to identify the hanger bolt type/size/threading, etc. On my Talon, the 50mm length was too short and popped out. My local hardware store surprised me. They had the exact bolt and the next size up. For reference, the standard bolt is M8 x 1.25 pitch (standard thread) 50mm. I got one that's 60mm and it seems to have solved by problem. Woo-hoo! I think I'm actually done now...

So one question for anyone who has installed any mid drive kit... What do people do with the electric cable management? I see some people wrap it around the frame (as I did) but what about any extra protection or organizational hints? I kinda feel like the battery cable coupling, at least, should maybe get some electrical tape protection. Or duct tape? I don't want it to look ugly, but it seems that the cables that come up right in front of the rear tire should have a little extra protection, especially if I were to take this off-road. (This is perhaps the biggest reason I would consider a purpose-built electric bike. The hidden cable management makes it feel nicer. But the DIY kit is soooo much cheaper and still a lot of fun.)

Thanks.

 

[dalrun]

I'm pretty sure your battery has an aluminum tray that screws to the battery base. I trimmed the motor wire down enough so that I could fit some excess wire and the connector inside the tray, i.e. the battery wire is a straight run to the bottom of the battery. I'm not sure how the lighting wires will work (the unused yellow plug). I agree, some additional protection on potential wear spots would be a good idea.

 

[TakO]

I ended up running the power cable up the side of the battery and keeping the control cable around the seat tube. I also put a neoprene cable management cover over it. I think I'm pretty satisfied with it now.

 

[TakO]

Another thought about the whole kit experience...
I bought the 48V 13Ah battery. It's a pretty standard battery case. For some bikes (mine included) there can be a problem fitting it into the standard water bottle mounts. For some reason, they made it so that the holes are way up high. I had to get an adapter to bring the holes up higher on the downtube. However, the other kind of battery (sometimes called "kettle" battery) has much more versatile holes. I think that would work for just about any bike. The downside is that they usually don't come in a capacity higher than 10Ah. I think there are a few exceptions. I think 10Ah is probably good for most people. If I convert another, like my wife's bike, I'll probably get the other style battery.

 

[TakO]

One thing I wanted to do with this conversion project was to see if my father (in his 80's, but pretty healthy) would enjoy riding something like this. Maybe I could get his butt off the couch and on a bike more often. Well, my family and I took him on a ride and he rode the e-bike. He was very impressed! In fact, he was zooming ahead of us the whole way. He had to wait for us every couple blocks. So, from that standpoint, this project is a success.

The other person I wanted to introduce to e-bikes was my wife. She likes going on rides, but she's always been opposed to riding up hills. Before we had kids, I used to say, "But hills are the best part!" Then, I just got used to taking easy, flat stuff with her (and later, my kids). But I got her to try out this bike too. She had very little interest in it, but she gave it shot. Instantly, she loved it. With a big grin on her face, she said it was so fast and easy.

It looks like I got two family members interested in this thing. I think I may have to do a couple more conversions. I had thought I could just give this first one to my dad, but I'm not ready to let it go yet. Maybe I'll set one up for him. And I'm pretty sure, my wife will be happy to have hers converted sometime as well.

 

[harryS]

I'm glad the family likes it.

 

[stanmiller]

For some bikes (mine included) there can be a problem fitting it into the standard water bottle mounts. For some reason, they made it so that the holes are way up high.

Same for my Electra Townie. The bottle mounts are lower on the frame. To workaround, (assuming you don't mount the controller in the battery case) you can drill holes through the base plate and attach to the bottle mounts. And you actually get a more secure mount. Mine is solid.



See this video from Luna for more specifics.

Youtube: Tip for hard mounting shark pack to bicycle frame Ebike

 

[Deleted member 4210]

One thing I wanted to do with this conversion project was to see if my father (in his 80's, but pretty healthy) would enjoy riding something like this. Maybe I could get his butt off the couch and on a bike more often. Well, my family and I took him on a ride and he rode the e-bike. He was very impressed! In fact, he was zooming ahead of us the whole way. He had to wait for us every couple blocks. So, from that standpoint, this project is a success.

The other person I wanted to introduce to e-bikes was my wife. She likes going on rides, but she's always been opposed to riding up hills. Before we had kids, I used to say, "But hills are the best part!" Then, I just got used to taking easy, flat stuff with her (and later, my kids). But I got her to try out this bike too. She had very little interest in it, but she gave it shot. Instantly, she loved it. With a big grin on her face, she said it was so fast and easy.

It looks like I got two family members interested in this thing. I think I may have to do a couple more conversions. I had thought I could just give this first one to my dad, but I'm not ready to let it go yet. Maybe I'll set one up for him. And I'm pretty sure, my wife will be happy to have hers converted sometime as well.

Major success ! Congrats to you, and your family!

 

[TakO]

To workaround, (assuming you don't mount the controller in the battery case) you can drill holes through the base plate and attach to the bottle mounts. And you actually get a more secure mount.


See this video from Luna for more specifics.

Youtube: Tip for hard mounting shark pack to bicycle frame Ebike

I was able to do it with an adapter piece, but it added some separation between the downtube and the battery. Your suggestion looks way more sturdy. I think I'll have to try that.

Thanks!

 

[dalrun]

you can drill holes through the base plate and attach to the bottle mounts

Note that the 3 - M3 screws holding the plastic to the aluminum tray are not very long, i.e. a weak point. I tapped the holes deeper and used longer screws. I still wouldn't (don't) rely on that tray as the sole mounting point, there's too much leverage/weight in front of the mounts.

 

[Dewey]

For some bikes (mine included) there can be a problem fitting it into the standard water bottle mounts.

Yes I had trouble fitting a bottle battery on the downtube of my first BBS01 conversion and used a hose clamp around a piece of inner tube to secure the top, the Grin Tech Bottle Bob does this function and two would work to fit a battery to a downtube with no bottle cage holes.

 

[harryS]

I have a couple of downtube batteries on our ebike kits. I don'tlike the two 5mm bottle mount screws, even on a steel frame, and supplement them with metal clamps withe rubber to protect the frame. Lately, I've found plastic clamps available for add-on water bottle mounds, but they're not as sturdy. I've used them for a second attach for my true bottle battires. which are round,

 

[yungleen]

I was able to run the wires between the motor and bottom bracket, then zip ties. You can see it here.

 

[weldinpatt]

I have a couple of downtube batteries on our ebike kits. I don'tlike the two 5mm bottle mount screws, even on a steel frame, and supplement them with metal clamps withe rubber to protect the frame. Lately, I've found plastic clamps available for add-on water bottle mounds, but they're not as sturdy. I've used them for a second attach for my true bottle battires. which are round,

I like rivnuts , steel nuts , steel frame I put one in the middle of the battery and have one at each end of the oval holes. Solid as a rock now. I used the aluminium rivnuts first, they kept going slack. Ended up spinning, got rid.