Michigan sends bill to Governor limiting only Class I on trails, unless

[rich c]

Michigan HB 4782 has been sent to the Governor.

It states;
Allow an individual to operate a class 1 electric bicycle on a linear trail with an asphalt, crushed limestone, or similar surface, or a rail trail.

-- Allow an individual to operate a class 2 or class 3 electric bicycle on a linear trail with an asphalt, crushed limestone, or similar surface, or a rail trail, if authorized by the local authority or State agency having jurisdiction over the trail.

So local or State agencies will have to approve access and I assume post if Class II or III will be allowed. Dangerous territory for us!

 

[James Kohls]

Michigan has passed HB 4781, HB 4782, and HB4783.

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(jn....aspx?page=BillStatus&objectname=2017-HB-4781

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(jn....aspx?page=BillStatus&objectname=2017-HB-4782

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(jn....aspx?page=BillStatus&objectname=2017-HB-4783

 

[Ken M]

Why not require all riders to put training wheels on their bikes? These regulations are achieving nothing but confusion and reducing the likelihood of eBikes becoming effective urban commute alternatives to autos. I understand the need for speed limits on the trails and paths (just like speed limits on streets) but they don't specify the max speed an auto can be manufactured to achieve. I'm not sure the people we elect to government have enough intellect to understand the potential of this technology - I think they are listening to DMV and insurance companies that just want to create new revenue from eBikes and a great way to do that is via apply speed Classes.

 

[itsaulgoodman]

Yeah, couldn't agree more. We don't even have the option in Canada, we're stuck with 32km/h only. And even if we did have a 45km/h option, getting limited to where you can ride it would make it almost useless. I mean, who really wants a bike that your not allowed to ride on a bike path.. Why can't we have a 45km/h option, which may require registration or something, but with a low speed mode. Maybe mandate that the high speed mode has a flashing traffic light to easily identify as in 45km/h.

 

[Ken M]

Yeah, couldn't agree more. We don't even have the option in Canada, we're stuck with 32km/h only. And even if we did have a 45km/h option, getting limited to where you can ride it would make it almost useless. I mean, who really wants a bike that your not allowed to ride on a bike path.. Why can't we have a 45km/h option, which may require registration or something, but with a low speed mode. Maybe mandate that the high speed mode has a flashing traffic light to easily identify as in 45km/h.

The eBike regulations in Canada make no sense whatsoever. As soon as an eBike can go over 32kph or is over 500W (a limit that doesn't even make sense without including the rest of the drive system and how it is tested) it's essentially considered a motorcycle based on my understanding of the law. Canada would be better served by adopting a law that lawmakers have to complete a high school education to be allowed to establish laws in hopes of preventing meritless legislation like this.

Here's the bottom line. I think a lot of development money went into mid drive motors and those companies want to sell the same bike worldwide. Europe was by far the biggest market and they established these slow speeds and low power regulations which are being promoted everywhere else. Haibike essentially pushed Class 3 legislation thru in Colorado (where I live) in 2 months as a condition to move their US headquarters to Colorado. I called a couple insurance companies last month to ask if they provided Class 3 pedelec insurance and they were not even aware of the legislation requiring it. Of coarse they said if/when they could provide rates they would likely mimic motorcycle rates (essentially killing the chances of getting people out of their cars occasionally because eBikes do not entirely replace a car).

Regulating the bikes is not the way to make them safe...it will only limit the merits of their use. Allow an eBike that is say no more than 50kg to assist up to a speed of at least 50kph so they can become viable commuting products and not just weekend fun rides. Another problem is mountain bikers that want the entire industry regulated because they think eBikes do more trail damage (when most of issue is ego damage because they hate when an eBike passes them on a climb).

 

[itsaulgoodman]

I do feel they need to draw the line somewhere though. 32km/h is just too slow imo, especially when I'm getting past by regular road cyclists.. I think the 45km/h would be about right, with no restrictions to where they can be used. If government wants to enforce speed limits on pathways, then enforce them.. for everyone, not just ebikes.

There are some ebikes out there that not only blur the line between it and a motorcycle, but goes so far into that territory that it really fuels the argument against them.

 

[Ken M]

Set and enforce speed limits. Makes no sense to limit the speed of what is considered an ebike when pro cyclists are hitting 100+kph on some descents and even avid weekend riders can hit 70kph on some descents on road rides. These riders are as concerned about safety as possible because they know if they have a crash they are going to suffer the consequences. If there people abusing speed limits on hyper powerful eBikes then ticket them for speeding...you don't impact all the eBikers that want to commute to work on a bike that provides assist to 35mph/50kph yet they only use that speed where it's permitted.

I would prefer to see restrictions set on the size/weight of the bike and limit them to roads with posted speed limits of 70-75 kph/45-50mph or less. Anything that is capable of traveling on highways and interstates needs to be considered full powered scooters and motorcycles that meet DOT safety standards with separate registration and insurance requirements. I don't think a 50kg or less weight eBike that in only used on slower speed limit roads and paths needs to achieve DOT status but they must adhere to the posted/established speed limits. Allow the technology a chance to succeed. In the US the value of time requires that eBike commuters are going to hope to achieve nearly the same commute times as they can in an car or there is no realized savings.

What really drives me nuts is that law makers are claiming the 20mph Class 1 or 28mph Class 3 speeds were established for safety reasons. That is total BS because I would simply ask them to provide the data then. There is none because very very bikers are causing accidents that are harming pedestrians or drivers - the vast majority of accidents involving bikes are caused by pedestrians and drivers that are not paying attention. That is FACT but I do want anyone that disaggrees to share and relevant data they may have to justify limiting the assist speed of an eBike to 20mph or 28mph depending on class.

 

[itsaulgoodman]

You got my vote!

 

[MLB]

Set and enforce speed limits. Makes no sense to limit the speed of what is considered an ebike when pro cyclists are hitting 100+kph on some descents and even avid weekend riders can hit 70kph on some descents on road rides. These riders are as concerned about safety as possible because they know if they have a crash they are going to suffer the consequences. If there people abusing speed limits on hyper powerful eBikes then ticket them for speeding...you don't impact all the eBikers that want to commute to work on a bike that provides assist to 35mph/50kph yet they only use that speed where it's permitted.

I would prefer to see restrictions set on the size/weight of the bike and limit them to roads with posted speed limits of 70-75 kph/45-50mph or less. Anything that is capable of traveling on highways and interstates needs to be considered full powered scooters and motorcycles that meet DOT safety standards with separate registration and insurance requirements. I don't think a 50kg or less weight eBike that in only used on slower speed limit roads and paths needs to achieve DOT status but they must adhere to the posted/established speed limits. Allow the technology a chance to succeed. In the US the value of time requires that eBike commuters are going to hope to achieve nearly the same commute times as they can in an car or there is no realized savings.

What really drives me nuts is that law makers are claiming the 20mph Class 1 or 28mph Class 3 speeds were established for safety reasons. That is total BS because I would simply ask them to provide the data then. There is none because very very bikers are causing accidents that are harming pedestrians or drivers - the vast majority of accidents involving bikes are caused by pedestrians and drivers that are not paying attention. That is FACT but I do want anyone that disaggrees to share and relevant data they may have to justify limiting the assist speed of an eBike to 20mph or 28mph depending on class.

Ahh, so your opinion is FACT, and if anyone disagrees they need to share actually data that supports their opinion.
Sure, sounds fair to me......

 

[Ken M]

Ahh, so your opinion is FACT, and if anyone disagrees they need to share actually data that supports their opinion.
Sure, sounds fair to me......

I don't want to sound like my opinion is fact but it is a fact that non-eBikes achieve speeds much higher than 20mph so it seem solidly rational and objective that the assist speed limit of an ebike should be set by law at 20mph. We need viable solutions to reduce automobile congestion (unless your income is entirely dependent on that industry...you probably agree with that statement) so why not seriously consider regulations that encourage the growth of options.

The implication that data should be an essential part of this debate is common sense. There are people claiming the 20mph class 1 limit is for "safety" reasons but I've seen no data presented. Remember the 55mph speed limit for automobiles....some tried to argue we should not raise it because higher limits cost lives. That may be true but if every life were truly priceless we'd have 5mph speed limits and the economy would slow to the speed you seem to think eBikes should travel at.