Is anyone trying to solve charging on the road?

[Gionnirocket]

I can understand wanting to stay all electric since it's the "green" way to go but at what cost?? It's made worse by the fact that DC to DC conversion and inverter technology are not very efficient.

We have friends with an RV whom we meet occasionally to ride our e-bikes. Their RV has a built in generator and like you, they are loathe to run it all night to charge batteries. On one trip, I loaned them our tiny Honda 750W portable generator which we use occasionally to power our OEM bike battery chargers. It's so quiet, you can put it on a picnic table while eating and hold a normal conversation. They put it on the ground next to the RV and it could barely be heard inside.

Even though it seems stupid to have two generators in an RV, they bought one anyway just to charge batteries overnight. The Honda also has a 12V output which they use to top off the RV batteries at the same time.

If you spend on a good high frequency sine wave AC inverter they can be very efficient >90%
For me the the downside of a generator is having to deal with gasoline as much as the noise. But I definitely agree with you on the small Honda generators... They are amazingly quiet.
@Art Deco ...also keep in mind with the DC - DC converter is that you lose the safety feature of your charger in that it shuts down at full charge. There are ways to manage that like my DIY solar charger hack... But it's definitely more hands on with every charge

 

[Art Deco]

Keep in mind that in addition to installing and setting up the wiring... It's the setup of the output on the converter that needs to be understood and adjusted properly before charging. You don't want to overvolt the output and a 12v battery isn't the most stable input source either.

The old converter is an issue. Newer units use an inverter that is supposed to be more efficient. Other than the AC and microwave ( and the ebike chargers ) everything is 12 volt or propane.

 

[Art Deco]

If you spend on a good high frequency sine wave AC inverter they can be very efficient >90%
For me the the downside of a generator is having to deal with gasoline as much as the noise. But I definitely agree with you on the small Honda generators... They are amazingly quiet.
@Art Deco ...also keep in mind with the DC - DC converter is that you lose the safety feature of your charger in that it shuts down at full charge. There are ways to manage that like my DIY solar charger hack... But it's definitely more hands on with every charge

The auto shutoff is very important to me. I am easily distracted, and would probably cook the batteries if I have to remember to unplug them.

 

[Gionnirocket]

The auto shutoff is very important to me. I am easily distracted, and would probably cook the batteries if I have to remember to unplug them.

Honestly the current draw of an ebike charger is so minimal... Efficiency is not a big concern. For the AC and other appliances you may want to look into upgrading the inverter.
Another suggestion is... is your generator propane? They're typically quieter and dealing with one fuel source can make things easier as well.
Again.. DC to DC is doable and though the settings typically stay static once set.. It'll definitely be a more involved venture. And since you need a generator and inverter anyway... Why add another that is potentially not as safe and more hands on. And I may be wrong but my understanding of DC to DC in order to work correctly and efficiently it requires a stable input power source. If you're running the AC while charging your camper battery voltage will be bouncing.
I still use my hack for every charge, but it's an added safety device as if it fails the worst that can happen is that it'll default to the charger and BMS for shutting down. With the DC to DC your relying only on the BMS unless you add something like my hack or a timer.

edit: Talk with the guy doing the solar add on as they might know of solutions. I'm not very well versed in camper electrical options

 

[Art Deco]

Thanks. Although the rv is barely used (under 50,000 miles and only a few hours of run time on the genny) all the electronics are 12 years old, so not state of the art.
The genny like everything else is propane, and the engine is a turbo diesel, so no gasoline for anything.

 

[Art Deco]

Honestly the current draw of an ebike charger is so minimal... Efficiency is not a big concern. For the AC and other appliances you may want to look into upgrading the inverter.
Another suggestion is... is your generator propane? They're typically quieter and dealing with one fuel source can make things easier as well.
Again.. DC to DC is doable and though the settings typically stay static once set.. It'll definitely be a more involved venture. And since you need a generator and inverter anyway... Why add another that is potentially not as safe and more hands on. And I may be wrong but my understanding of DC to DC in order to work correctly and efficiently it requires a stable input power source. If you're running the AC while charging your camper battery voltage will be bouncing.
I still use my hack for every charge, but it's an added safety device as if it fails the worst that can happen is that it'll default to the charger and BMS for shutting down. With the DC to DC your relying only on the BMS unless you add something like my hack or a timer.

edit: Talk with the guy doing the solar add on as they might know of solutions. I'm not very well versed in camper electrical options

TBH even the guys doing solar and backup generators for houses don't know much about the components for campers. Suitcase style panels, low power inverters, etc. are unknowns.

 

[Art Deco]

I can understand wanting to stay all electric since it's the "green" way to go but at what cost?? It's made worse by the fact that DC to DC conversion and inverter technology are not very efficient.

We have friends with an RV whom we meet occasionally to ride our e-bikes. Their RV has a built in generator and like you, they are loathe to run it all night to charge batteries. On one trip, I loaned them our tiny Honda 750W portable generator which we use occasionally to power our OEM bike battery chargers. It's so quiet, you can put it on a picnic table while eating and hold a normal conversation. They put it on the ground next to the RV and it could barely be heard inside.

Even though it seems stupid to have two generators in an RV, they bought one anyway just to charge batteries overnight. The Honda also has a 12V output which they use to top off the RV batteries at the same time.

I assume this is a gasoline generator, correct? My van runs on diesel, and my appliances on propane . Not the end of the world, but one more thing for an aging mind to forget...

 

[shiruba2020]

By the way, I have been traveling will beyond the range of my battery this last week, with dinner if it basically being mountain climbing. For the most part, I have gone 20-40km at a time and speed at an internet cafe to use the bathroom, rest, and get something to drink while I charge my battery and other gadgets. If you're in Japan, Kaikatsu club is pretty good for this purpose. In the super country side where they don't have locations, I have used cafes or love hotels.

 

[autobike543]

I'm going to build a 800w gas generator box after I finished a complete chassis order work
800w generator

 

[tomjasz]

First off a gas generator is the wrong direction for many. We ride eBikes to reduce dependence on fossil fuel. I get what you want to achieve but for some your choice is just not sustainable. Buy a Vespa. A Satiator mounted on your bike. Capable of higher amp charging as long as the battery has a BMS that can take a fast charge is a sustainable solution. Sadly budget ebike buyers freak on the cost compared to their cheap seat bike.

I’m all in supporting your choice but do see it as sensible.

Have fun!

 

[autobike543]

OK! I just forgot to mention: Despite its reasonable or not! its the way to travel a long distance journey in remote country side

And I develop the type for business if possible, the box is not only for a generator, the tilting trike fully equipped with Front & Rear box more balance

Even with a motor scooter, you can't ride like this- -
go over curbs

 

[tomjasz]

Counter intuitive. Sorry.

 

[6zfshdb]

This is an interesting concept that's been discussed here before.

I assume you want to charge one battery while using the other and I'm not sure of the laws where you are. Here in the US, a bike rolling along with a gas generator putting away would be construed as a motor vehicle, not an e-bike. There is a subtle distinction which wouldn't be evident to a law enforcement officer.

Unless you plan to ride 24/7, you should be able to carry several batteries in your box which would last all day, or at least until you get to a place where you can recharge. The cost and weight would be slightly higher than a generator & gas can but here in the US at least, it would be legal.

 

[autobike543]

I develop an e cargo bike for all purpose- shopping /touring/adventuring- -people got more choice what they need
1 day riding 200 km, then charge 2 batteries night time is legal at least

 

[shiruba]

Wow it's funny this appeared in my inbox today. I just traveled from Tokyo to Shin-Yokohama, which ate 40 percent of my battery. Tomorrow morning I will continue further south to Kamakura, and there is a lot of elevation change so I'm sure it will eat my battery more.

I'm taking a nap at a net cafe now while I charge my battery here.

 

[m@Robertson]

Just power the bike with gasoline. Why introduce a middleman? See: the Laws (not Suggestions ) of Thermodynamics. You cannot help but waste energy and be inefficient. All that extra weight you now have to push down the road just makes the problem worse. The only thing you are gaining is the ability to refill your rolling bomb at a gas station which, I assume, is more convenient than finding a power plug hence the reason for the Rube Goldberg contraption.

Don't get me started on the steering issues being introduced.

 

[m@Robertson]

Since I posted up about the Mean Wells last year in this thread, I decided to spring for a truly fast one of these chargers.

I changed from an HLG-320H-54A to an HLG-480H-54A. The former is a 320w unit that is good for a 100% 58.8v charge at 5 amps. I found no problems with this charger, but curiosity and the fact I upgraded a bike to a 32ah pack tipped me over and I decided to give it a try. The best pic I have of it on the bike is below. It is its own rack deck. And yes its a heavy sucker. However, it can be dialed to 8 amps and 58.0v, which is 464 watts and within its power rating. Strictly speaking, it is only rated to 56.7v but it will dial up to 58.1. Also it can be dialed up to 9.9a but thats outside where I am comfortable charging any battery never mind the fact I'd be exceeding the specs. The reality is, if I am somewhere trying to charge I have a time factor I am willing to wait, and I won't sit still to reach the full 58.0v most likely.

It doesn't get hot doing this. And speaking of which...

I missed some comments above about adding heat sinks. About that: If you buy the bigger units - the 320w unit or this 480w one - they don't get hot even if you dial them up. The 185's on the other hand do get nice and toasty, but I have never found heat sinks to be able to do much to them... and besides why bother? They were designed to do this and - in the case of the 185w units - deliver a MTBF in excess of 192,000 hours. Thats is 22 years of *continuous* use. I do sympathize with the idea of always minimizing the heat an electrical device has to suffer thru but in this case they were literally made for it. Plus, the only truly flat surface - assuming you don't want to slather on a flat layer of thermal paste on top to eliminate the already useful ridged surface - is the unit's bottom, and heat rises. the one I put sinks on, those sinks don't heat up.

 

[john peck]

With all the E-auto charging stations emerging nation wide, It would be nice if they added
charging boxes similar to bus station lockers, drop in some coin, remove the key, & come
back when it´s cooked. Apart from that, my solution is adding an extremely efficient 40cc
gas belt drive to an ebike which in concert will give me a 300 mile range for long distant
touring. Fingers crossed, I will be ready for a shake-down cruise next week. Actually I´ve
added a 48v 500w front wheel to a gas bike that already gets 200 mpg. I have the option
2-whi drive, along with ultra-low gearing to pedal without any power if needs be. A mid-drive
is also a viable option. The engine kit weighs about the same as my 21 Ah battery. I hope
to find a way for the engine to charge the battery while in motion thus to have a 2 wheel
Prius. It will weigh about the same as an e-mtn fat bike.

 

[tomjasz]

Well not being able a long distance ride just isn’t in the cards for me. That said I think I’d lean towards a trailer and. Ping LiFePO4 trailered battery pack. Or maybe a home built Headway pack. I do find my bike to be pretty efficient pulling a trailer. My $100 trailer has pleasantly surprised me. I’m usually the guy that researched and often picks the more expensive solution if I think it’ll pay a return on the dollars spent. Happily the Schwinn trailer has decent wheel bearing and a pretty stout square tube steel frame. Tow hitch is a the rear axel and seems tough enough for years of use. The fork mount fixture can make it a bike tow truck as long as the rear wheel of towed bike is functionally turning. Tube steel is repairable and could be strengthened still costing far less than say a Burley (sp?) trailer.

 

[m@Robertson]

... I think I’d lean towards a trailer and. Ping LiFePO4 trailered battery pack. ...

That is a really interesting idea.

Funny thing is, I have a 3072wh LifePO4 pack with no job. I bought a home solar system via Bluetti which includes three 3072wh LifePO4 battery units (the B300). My first one arrived but was damaged in shipping - an unfortunately common occurrence that happened to many of their first production run units. They suspended manufacture pending a redesign and are shipping new ones to everyone affected. So the one I have that has the battery busted off its mounts inside... I was planning on at least trying to resurrect it (they told me to dispose of it safely). If I can't (many also have busted circuit boards inside) I think I am going to try a Burley 1-whl trailer, maybe. I already know of others who have quietly repurposed the packs they harvested from theirs.