Intrigue—a Bosch System diagnostic report

[Sparky731]

Today we had an opportunity to perform a diagnostic., et.al., evaluation of my newest bike at 1k miles.
The Bosch Kiox (which I love) displayed “maintenance required” with every Start starting after 998 miles..

The diagnostic report included an anomaly that we — my LBS tech, and me — cannot decipher.

Bosch: Please weigh-in!

Details:
Purchased: Nov. 2023.
1,212 miles on a Performance Line motor. Kiox ver.2.
Trek installed the Kiox ver 2 controller replacing the Bosch Smartphone adapter when the bike was delivered new.
No error codes recorded In the report — Yay! Bosch. My bike is an animal!
31 Service Log entries as “OK” vs. “Not Ok, or requires service.” None noted.
Configuration includes a Kiox, ver 2, a Performance Line motor, a Powertube 625, and a Bosch 500 Extended Range battery, although the Extended Range battery was not included in the service evaluation.

Here is the unexplained:

If anyone knows me in this EBS Forum, I am a rabid Turbo rider. >15,000 miles in turbo on my ebikes.

However, this diagnostic report indicates 40+% of my mileage is “Distance without assistance.”

No motor assistance is practically impossible on my e-bikes. I am a slave to EV electrons.

How did the Bosch Kiox controller record 40% of my ride time without assist? Impossible!!

So, I must declare the Bosch Diagnostic Report as invalid unless Bosch can explain what happened?!?!

My LBS Tech is likewise surprised and searching for an explanation as well. We agreed to share what we find.

Any comments?
Keep the rubber side down and keep peddling.
Retrac

 

[fooferdoggie]

one wacky error I get once in awhile with my nyon is it does not show my power. usually I have to reboot it take its off the bike hold my fingers and it will work again. but if it does not show your power it does not actually record the ride. the assist seems the same it shows my HR my cadence but no trip I recorded no calories burned nothing. so it could have been that if you never kept track of your trips. it would be easy to see if you can check the bosch app for total miles and the kiox see if they match.

 

[BlackHand]

Presumably you coast downhill. Also, I think you've mentioned that you do/lead a lot of group rides. I would imagine in Turbo mode you are frequently pausing your pedaling (or maybe even unconsciously ghost pedaling) because otherwise you would constantly be outrunning your group.

What does your cadence graph for a typical rode look like in eBike Connect? I would estimate my commutes are 20-30% not pedaling(which would therefore mean no assist) just from downhills and coasting to intersections. 40 seems high, but not impossible.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Different brands do this differently

 

[wildtrak]

How did the Bosch Kiox controller record 40% of my ride time without assist? Impossible!!

First, it is not the Kiox that records it. It is the drive unit.
So you never ever coast or stop? Or even shift gears? You riding constantly uphill? How is that possible?

My LBS Tech is likewise surprised and searching for an explanation as well.

Well... I have the same experience with LBS in the USA.
That's why people who know me come to me before even considering going to a bike shop. Especially if they have anything going on with the Bosch system

 

[Sparky731]

This is a new bike for me. 4months. And the bulk of the rides are with groups vs. solo. Average speeds 12-16mph with groups. 22-28mph solo.

More detail from the Diagnostic Report:
Odometer: 1,212mi
Total operating time: 268 hrs
Total active operating time (with assistance): 68 hrs
Energy Consumption: 9.5wh/mi
Distance in Turbo: 270mi
Sport: 259mi
Tour: 271mi
Eco: 15mi
Distance without assistance: 448 mi.

Maybe I am coasting a lot. I will need to pay attention to how much. Maybe 40% is true.

 

[Sparky731]

Presumably you coast downhill. Also, I think you've mentioned that you do/lead a lot of group rides. I would imagine in Turbo mode you are frequently pausing your pedaling (or maybe even unconsciously ghost pedaling) because otherwise you would constantly be outrunning your group.

What does your cadence graph for a typical rode look like in eBike Connect? I would estimate my commutes are 20-30% not pedaling(which would therefore mean no assist) just from downhills and coasting to intersections. 40 seems high, but not impossible.

I have not seen any cadence graphing or logging data. Maybe I don’t know where to find it.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Distance without assistance: 448 mi.

Maybe I am coasting a lot.

Very very strange. An e-bike should only report the percentage of the ride with a specific Assist Mode on. If Bosch treats coasting as being off then it would be the weirdest thing I have ever seen with e-bikes.

 

[wildtrak]

Even though it was always in SPORT mode, there was no assistance. Thus, the distance without assistance is the most.
And as it states in the brackets, it is only counting (with assistance). Not counting the distance when there is no assistance.
I think that is pretty clear.

 

[Sparky731]

It is true! I am as lazy as my wife claims that I am.
I am coasting! And, very likely 40% of the time.

The terrain around my AZ home is relatively flat. And the few hills provide invigorating high speed downhill coasts. (I don’t do off-road desert mountain biking any more. Too many flat tires. And aging-out of that sport at 73.)

So for now, I am going with “coasting” as the explanation for the 40% non-assist numbers.

i did find the Cadence data. On a 44 mile ride: Avg cadence: 37rpm. Max cadence: 86rpm. 0 Ascent/decent. Avg. user power 61w. Avg speed: 11.2mph. Max speed: 30.8mph. Looks like I have to up-my-game!