Great plan, poor execution

[PCeBiker]

Now after applying lube, I squirt what's left back into the impermeable Finish Line Polyethylene Terephthalate bottle.

I'll just squirt it back into the glass jarr after I use the dropper bottle.

Just an FYI, You can thin out silicone with naphtha as well.
I dissolved some silicone in a jar with naphtha and I put a waterproof coating on my tent with a paint roller.
Super cheap, and it lasts way longer than the silicone spray bombs where you have to do it every year.

 

[PCeBiker]

Can't hurt, can only help. But do inspect those teeth for wear. On my Shimano XT derailleur, the pulleys are made of some kind of plastic or nylon.

I shouldn't have any wear with only about 40 miles on the chain.
Mine are plastic too. I don't think I've seen metal pulleys since the 70's?

I do want them to spin freely though.

 

[spokewrench]

I've ridden my Haibike long enough, worn out enough chain rings and stretched enough chains to learn some things along the way.......

1. No matter how dedicated you are or are not in keeping your chain lubed, it means nothing when it comes to the physical stretching of a chain. And once the chain is stretched, it begins a cycle of wearing out the front chain ring, especially if it is aluminum (which is most modern bikes).

I've read that chains don't stretch. The holes for the pins become elongated through wear. Chains made to shift between sprocket wheels flex sideways, so how can one tell the difference?

In 1965 I had an experience where a bicycle chain didn't stretch operating under an estimated 432 pounds of tension. I owned an old A B Jackson, which was a Raleigh smuggled in a box classified as motorcycle parts. It had internal shift: 93, 70, and 52 gear inches. (The tallest of my Abound's 7 gears is 73 gear inches.) I lived at the bottom of a 10% grade 1,000 feet long. I guess I weighed 170 and the bike 30, so that hill required 20 pounds of thrust just to match gravity. I'd end up in low gear, where I needed a mean pedal force of 75 pounds and, as a rule of thumb, 112 pounds peak, just to meet gravity. I hated low gear because it was so slow.

One evening I got impatient. I stood up, shifted to high, and by pulling up hard on the bars like a weightlifter, put more than my weight on each power stroke. To my amazement, I accelerated sharply at 93 inch pounds on a 10% hill. My exhilaration was brief. In 5 seconds I'd torn the teeth from the rear sprocket.

If I sped up 5 mph in those 5 seconds, that would have required 9 pounds of thrust in addition to 20 pounds to match gravity. That would mean an average pedal pressure of 192 pounds and a peak of 288. Strain on a chain is about 75% higher than force on a pedal, or 432 pounds peak in this case. That explained how I'd torn the teeth off the sprocket wheel, which hadn't shown wear.

Under 432 pounds of tension, had the holes for the pins elongated? No. A chain for bikes without derailleurs was designed not to flex laterally. Like a new chainsaw chain, this one still had no flex. Had the rails stretched? No. The front sprocket had no apparent wear, and the chain still fit it perfectly. It also fit the new rear sprocket perfectly.

 

[circuitsmith]

My chain hygiene:
Take chain off bike, swish in jar of 50/50 acetone & paint thinner.
Remove and link into loop, run through cyclone cleaner with water and orange citrus cleaner.
Spray thoroughly with garden hose, dry in old toaster oven at 250F.
Fit to bike and lube with dropper bottle (old Finish Line Cross Country), one drop per link.
For lube I'm currently using Honda Manual Transmission Fluid.
Had a qt left over from my 1988 Accord.
Its a low viscosity gear oil.
Before that I used chainsaw bar oil, which lasted longer but attracted more dirt.

 

[PCeBiker]

,.. If I could find a transparent impermeable bottle with an airtight cap over the nozzle, I'd be all set.

Duhh,..
I've got transparent impermeable (I think?) bottles.
I've keep acetone, oils, alcohols, acids, soap, etc,.. in Visine bottles since forever,..

The hole in the dropper was a bit too small, so I stuck a pin through it to make it bigger.
The paint label on the bottle didn't dissolve with a acetone, so I scraped it off with a razor blade. I wanted to see inside.

Then I sucked the liquid wax into the bottle from the jar.
I caught a couple chunks of wax and had to squirt them out.

So for anyone trying to find a sealed dropper bottle, I think Visine is the way to go?

PS,.. Visine is kind of expensive, but the also have saline solution for eyes.

I bought a couple bottles for a buck a piece at Walmart just to get the dropper bottles. (about ten cents American money)

It cost me about the same and I have some left from a dozen builds and routine maintenance.

That's the typical price... Pretty much $10 for any brand 4oz chain lube

I'm sure that I could spend another $35 and get some T9 that would last me ten years, but I'd probably lose it or forget where I put it within a month.

My way is funner, and I won't forget, and if I do I'll just make more.
I've got a gallon of Camp Fuel and a pound of wax.
Ten cents a bottle.

 

[Gionnirocket]

I've read that chains don't stretch. The holes for the pins become elongated through wear. Chains made to shift between sprocket wheels flex sideways, so how can one tell the difference?

In 1965 I had an experience where a bicycle chain didn't stretch operating under an estimated 432 pounds of tension. I owned an old A B Jackson, which was a Raleigh smuggled in a box classified as motorcycle parts. It had internal shift: 93, 70, and 52 gear inches. (The tallest of my Abound's 7 gears is 73 gear inches.) I lived at the bottom of a 10% grade 1,000 feet long. I guess I weighed 170 and the bike 30, so that hill required 20 pounds of thrust just to match gravity. I'd end up in low gear, where I needed a mean pedal force of 75 pounds and, as a rule of thumb, 112 pounds peak, just to meet gravity. I hated low gear because it was so slow.

One evening I got impatient. I stood up, shifted to high, and by pulling up hard on the bars like a weightlifter, put more than my weight on each power stroke. To my amazement, I accelerated sharply at 93 inch pounds on a 10% hill. My exhilaration was brief. In 5 seconds I'd torn the teeth from the rear sprocket.

If I sped up 5 mph in those 5 seconds, that would have required 9 pounds of thrust in addition to 20 pounds to match gravity. That would mean an average pedal pressure of 192 pounds and a peak of 288. Strain on a chain is about 75% higher than force on a pedal, or 432 pounds peak in this case. That explained how I'd torn the teeth off the sprocket wheel, which hadn't shown wear.

Under 432 pounds of tension, had the holes for the pins elongated? No. A chain for bikes without derailleurs was designed not to flex laterally. Like a new chainsaw chain, this one still had no flex. Had the rails stretched? No. The front sprocket had no apparent wear, and the chain still fit it perfectly. It also fit the new rear sprocket perfectly.

You chose a fitting online handle.
You're definitely a tool.

 

[spokewrench]

I think spokewrench is missing the point.
The chains get longer and sloppyier.
Whether it's stretched metal or worn metal, the lengthening does exist.

I quoted MikeTowPathTraveler, saying lubrication means nothing when it comes to the physical stretching of the chain. In that context, stretching must mean the elongation of the rails, not the loosening of the joints. I think it's rare that a cyclist would put 430 pounds of tension on a chain. My experience indicates that service on a bicycle won't elongate rails.

Do you, too, say lubrication can't greatly slow the lengthening of a chain?

Aventon says it's not mileage but derailleur shifting that loosens joints. I think that may be correct. Forcing a chain to deflect sideways to catch a tooth of another sprocket wheel, under even light load, must put intense pressure on the affected pin joints. Back when nobody in town had a ten-speed, we used plain oil, and the continued lateral rigidity of chains, over thousands of miles, showed that the joints weren't wearing loose.

 

[Gionnirocket]

And there you have it... Contamination is far more detrimental.
Lubrication though provides some anti wear it's far more necessary to flush out contaminates and facilitate a slippery quiet shift.
It's been figured out already, no need to reinvent the wheel or should I say sprocket.

 

[mschwett]

to the semantic debate, the plates of the chain do not stretch. the rollers get worn, and as their diameter gets smaller, under tension their centers move further apart.

it’s an important difference, i suppose, since it helps one understand that reduced the friction/abrasion on the rollers would reduce “stretch.” if it was just the plates actually elongating the only answer would be reducing load. as it is, both matter, since the amount of wear is force x friction, or somesuch.

 

[spokewrench]

And there you have it... Contamination is far more detrimental.
Lubrication though provides some anti wear it's far more necessary to flush out contaminates and facilitate a slippery quiet shift.
It's been figured out already, no need to reinvent the wheel or should I say sprocket.

Crud can interfere with a chain's smooth side flexing to move to another sprocket wheel, but that not wear.

I got wagon for Christmas when I was four. When I was too old to ride it as a toy, I used it for hauling. As a teen, I made a downhill racer by mounting the axles and wheels on a board, upon which I would lie face down as I steered with ropes. Those wheels were on bushings exposed to contaminants, but in all those years, they never got wobbly or noisy. I don't think I ever regreased them.

A lawn mower has similar wheels on similar bushings. The wheels carry a light load at low speeds perhaps 20 hours a year, but they become increasingly wobbly until they are replaced. The difference is that the guy behind the mower uses the leverage of the handle to make steering corrections by forcing wheels out of alignment with axles. This concentrates pressure on the edges of the bushings. It also opens the way for contaminants to get between the bushing and the axle.

The mower wheels are like links in a chain for a bike with derailleur shifting, where cleanness and high-performance lube can reduce wear a lot. The wagon wheels were like the chains for bikes with only two sprocket wheels; they seemed to last forever, lubed with simple oil and covered with grime.

 

[Chargeride]

I don't usually oil my chain when on the beach, maybe with dry lube or a tiny bit of wd40.
The bike I'm using here in Wales has a very thickly oiled chain, it immediately collected a whole dunes worth of sand and started making crunching noises so loud it caused entire families to turn around expecting to see someone operating a cement mixer.

 

[Chargeride]

Only motorcycles have O ring chains, but the X ring chain could possibly be suitable for ebikes, I don't know if they work with derailleurs.

X-ring chain - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[spokewrench]

The bike I'm using here in Wales has a very thickly oiled chain, it immediately collected a whole dunes worth of sand and started making crunching noises so loud it caused entire families to turn around expecting to see someone operating a cement mixer.

At 8 weeks, my Aventon Abound started rubbing at one point in the pedal cycle. I couldn't reproduce the noise with the bike on its stand, so I assumed the bottom bracket torque sensor was flexing under the combination of the radial load from the chain and the radial load from the right pedal. It was getting louder, so I contacted Support for advice on Thursday. That advice amounted to "go to hell." So much for their 2-year-warranty.

I think the flexing has been getting noisy because in cooler weather the grease hasn't been keeping the grease seal greased. The next day, Friday, it was so loud that I sounded like a stream locomotive chuffing along. At one point a man who was walking his dog 100 yards ahead on the other side of the road, stopped, turned around, and stared. I'd be scared too if I heard a locomotive sneaking up on me and my dog!

 

[spokewrench]

My rear tire lost significant amount of sealant on my way home from the liquor store for some reason it's always the rear gets punctured.

That used to happen to my tractor every time I ran over a sharp stake, and it was always the rear. I discovered that the tires were hollow. I think that's why yours leaks. Robert Mitchum solved the problem in filming Thunder Road: solid tires.