Front motor for xp 2.0?

[Xp2.0_rider]

Hello,
I notice alot of youtube videos of xp 1.0s using 20"x4 front hub motor, but these DONT fit the xp 2.0 without specialized modification.


I was wondering if anyone has ever just added a small motor like the rear, to the front ? I haven't seen any videos on it and not sure if it's possible.

(Picture is of a standard motor found on ebikes rear. But on the front, didn't know if it's possible to do this?)

 

[Xp2.0_rider]

Anyone ?

 

[Johny Rocket]

Hmmm, I have a 1.0 and it has 3500 miles on it, added a second battery to my 1.0, built a mid-drive motor bike with 5000 miles on it. So fairly experienced with ebikes. Trying to figure out what results/motivation you are hoping for by adding a front motor. There are a number of factors to consider depending on the results you're hoping for.

 

[tomjasz]

Hello,
I notice alot of youtube videos of xp 1.0s using 20"x4 front hub motor, but these DONT fit the xp 2.0 without specialized modification.


I was wondering if anyone has ever just added a small motor like the rear, to the front ? I haven't seen any videos on it and not sure if it's possible.

(Picture is of a standard motor found on ebikes rear. But on the front, didn't know if it's possible to do this?)

Contrary to many RUMORS front drives are nice. Some like the small gear drives from greenbikekit are actually not much bigger than a drum brake and quite stealthy.

 

[Xp2.0_rider]

Hmmm, I have a 1.0 and it has 3500 miles on it, added a second battery to my 1.0, built a mid-drive motor bike with 5000 miles on it. So fairly experienced with ebikes. Trying to figure out what results/motivation you are hoping for by adding a front motor. There are a number of factors to consider depending on the results you're hoping for.

I would feel more comfortable about driving longer ranges. The bike I'd quite heavy, and I've loaded it down with my spare battery and repair tools, and spare tube.


I just don't want it to overheat or die on me if I'm 25 miles away from my launch point. I could start the second motor and get back.

 

[Johny Rocket]

Ok, so I would replace your bottom bracket with a bafang BBS mid drive motor since it is an all in one controller & motor. Then you wouldn't need to mount a second controller that is needed for the front motor. Use the bafang as your primary motor since it is twice the efficiency and max speed of 30mph if using the 52 tooth chainring. You will end up not using the brake cutoff for the current motor but not a real issue and instead use the brake cutoff with the bafang motor.

I don't really think there is a reliability issue with the motor though. There are "Hall sensors" checking the temp and power draw on the motor to prevent motor damage. When hub motors go it's usually the gears start sounding nasty (on geared hub drive like Lectric uses) and usually will still go for a while before total fail. Just replace the motor & wheel assembly when the gears get way noisy. Maybe around 7-8000 miles could be even more.

Your more likely to fry your controller anyway and that's not so easily replaced in the field.

The bike is foldable so fits in an Uber trunk too.

 

[Xp2.0_rider]

T

Ok, so I would replace your bottom bracket with a bafang BBS mid drive motor since it is an all in one controller & motor. Then you wouldn't need to mount a second controller that is needed for the front motor. Use the bafang as your primary motor since it is twice the efficiency and max speed of 30mph if using the 52 tooth chainring. You will end up not using the brake cutoff for the current motor but not a real issue and instead use the brake cutoff with the bafang motor.

I don't really think there is a reliability issue with the motor though. There are "Hall sensors" checking the temp and power draw on the motor to prevent motor damage. When hub motors go it's usually the gears start sounding nasty (on geared hub drive like Lectric uses) and usually will still go for a while before total fail. Just replace the motor & wheel assembly when the gears get way noisy. Maybe around 7-8000 miles could be even more.

Your more likely to fry your controller anyway and that's not so easily replaced in the field.

The bike is foldable so fits in an Uber trunk too.

The only issue with mid drives is that if there's no power, you can't pedal it. Right? Defeats the purpose lol.
That's why there's no mid drive combos/I've seen, it's front/rear drive,
Correct ?

 

[Johny Rocket]

No, you can pedal just fine with no power. The bike I built is only 43lbs (20lb bike + 16lbs batteries+ 7lb motor. using dual Lectric batteries and I ride about 25-75 miles a day 5 days a week. About 1/3 under no power so I can keep in shape.

 

[Johny Rocket]

Of course the XP being 60+ lbs is no fun at all pedaling without power...

 

[Xp2.0_rider]

Of course the XP being 60+ lbs is no fun at all pedaling without power...

I thought with middrives, you couldn't pedal without power, it locked up the pedals?

That's why I went for the xp 2.0, and glad I did after the xp premium.

 

[Johny Rocket]

Mid-drive pedals do not lock up. Rider can pedal anytime, can "freewheel" or coast without pedaling. If there is a throttle, then pedaling is optional under throttle as well. Everything works the same from the riders perspective. Motor assistance when PAS is set to 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,8,10 but not at PAS 0 or with power turned off.

Tha main difference is that the mid-drive uses the gearing so as an example if I'm on PAS 1, and shift in first gear the bike is slow but will climb any hill like a billy goat, shift into 2nd and the bike goes from 4mph to 6mph, 3rd about 8mph, 4th about 10mph, 5th 13mph, 6th 15mph, 7th 18 mph, 8th 20mph. If I'm using PAS 2 then it's about 3mph faster in every gear. Because using the gears is more efficient, a mid-drive can run at 20mph in PAS 1 using the same energy that only gets about 9mph max speed on the Lectric when maxed out on PAS 1. So double the speed and double the range.

The down sides of the mid-drive is more wear on the front chain ring, rear cigs and the chain. The other down side is if the chain breaks then you'll be walking the bike home unless you carry a cain breaker and master link (I carry both but have yet to need them)

Hub drive will get you home under throttle even with a broke chain.

 

[Xp2.0_rider]

Mid-drive pedals do not lock up. Rider can pedal anytime, can "freewheel" or coast without pedaling. If there is a throttle, then pedaling is optional under throttle as well. Everything works the same from the riders perspective. Motor assistance when PAS is set to 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,8,10 but not at PAS 0 or with power turned off.

Tha main difference is that the mid-drive uses the gearing so as an example if I'm on PAS 1, and shift in first gear the bike is slow but will climb any hill like a billy goat, shift into 2nd and the bike goes from 4mph to 6mph, 3rd about 8mph, 4th about 10mph, 5th 13mph, 6th 15mph, 7th 18 mph, 8th 20mph. If I'm using PAS 2 then it's about 3mph faster in every gear. Because using the gears is more efficient, a mid-drive can run at 20mph in PAS 1 using the same energy that only gets about 9mph max speed on the Lectric when maxed out on PAS 1. So double the speed and double the range.

The down sides of the mid-drive is more wear on the front chain ring, rear cigs and the chain. The other down side is if the chain breaks then you'll be walking the bike home unless you carry a cain breaker and master link (I carry both but have yet to need them)

Hub drive will get you home under throttle even with a broke chain.

Thank you for that detailed post.


What size of middrive would fit a xp 2.0?
I'm not sure how to measure for one, I'm only familiar with the tire sizes for hub motors.


So I would have 2 controllers, how would the PAS work if I kept the original xp set up installed, and added the new middrive ?

 

[Johny Rocket]

Search YouTube for "bafang BBS installation" and watch a few videos on how to do it. There is a few versions of the BBS, bbs01, bbs02 and bbshd. The BBShd is a little more expensive and can handle higher amps but in my opinion the 01 or 02 are plenty reliable and the HD only needed if you want to hotrod custom settings and go way too fast than anyone should on an ebike.

You would end up with 2 displays, 2 keyboards, and 2 throttles. Bafang makes a little mini display and keyboard combo that would be helpful but all that handlebar mounted stuff may require a new and wider handlebar since the Lectric stock handlebar has very little space to mount anything.
You'll need some type of switch to change battery power from one system to the other. I would look at the boating or RV industry for that type of switch or maybe car audio/preamp equipment has something that would work better.

 

[tomjasz]

A BBS01B and BBS02B are best ridden like an acoustic bike. Both can get overheated and have issues if the rider doesn’t use gearing as on would without a drive.

I’m guessing your bike is a 68mm or 73mm. If a fat bike the only motor that will fit all 4, 68-73mm, 100-120mm, is the BBSHD. It’s definitely more forgiving and is often used on pedicabs.

I ride 36v BBS01 350w and BBS02B 36v 500w. First on two bikes since 2014. The BBS01B is a 2022 version.

Reliable if ridden with gears used effectively.

I tried 2WD with geared hubs, MAC 10T. A real “beast of burden.” Massive over kill for my riding style.

No need for 2 displays.