Folding eBike Suggestions for a Technomadic RV Garage?

[technomadia - chris]

Greetings -

I just discovered this forum and community today, and I am thrilled.

We are two full-time traveling technomads that live in a very geeked out solar-powered vintage 1961 bus that has been converted to an RV. We have been bike-less for several years, but we are intending our next life upgrade to be adding two bikes to our tech arsenal.

Ideally - I'd love an eBike, so that we can explore areas we are near without turing a commute into town into a sweaty workout.

The key requirement is that whatever we get needs to fit into our "garage" bay:
28" tall, 32" wide, 36+" deep

I've been surprised and disappointed to discover that many folding bikes do not publish folded dimensions other than "fits in the back of an SUV", and it has been hard for me to narrow down a shopping list of options.

Are there and 24" or 26" wheel bikes that will fit in the space we have? Are there any 20" bikes that actually are too tall even once folded?

What bikes should be on our short list to track down and try?

Since we are constantly traveling - we want something that is rock-solid and reliable, and which will not need much support from a "local" dealer that we will never be near.

We also want something practical - with support for lights and baskets and kick-stands and all the other goodies that make running errands and exploring places fun and easy.

One other requirement... I'm 5'11" and 250lbs, so I need to make sure the bike can handle my weight. Pedal assist is great, but needing to push up hills or running out of juice after less than 10 miles will be no fun at all.

Anyway, I look forward to getting some ideas!

- Chris (and Cherie) // www.technomadia.com

PS: We are currently traveling near Santa Fe, New Mexico - and will be heading through Arizona towards SoCal next month. Are there any eBike dealers we should visit that might have folding bikes to test drive?

 

[Deleted member 803]

I have no idea of the dimensions but check out the A2B folding electric bike.

 

[David1]

Welcome to the illustrious forum. I recently joined the ebike crowd, and hope you get what will please you as much as mine has. There is an ebike demo tour traveling to many cities in America in 2016. I plan on attending the Houston Texas stop on March 11 th. Sorry don't remember the link. I hear some folding bikes may be there. I hope to find the mtb - ebike for me . Not sure if they make ebikes, but check out Brompton folding bikes. I'm sure they can help .There is a vast array of folding bikes. I've seen many of them on the net. since discovering e bikes about a year ago. That's how I found my St2 ebike . Hope this helped . Like your travel rig,and website. Way cool. There is a good ebike shop in Santa Monica called Bike Attack, and another in Fullerton can't remember the name though. Also a super one in Santa Barbara called Ebikezzz. Don't miss that one. Have fun in So.Cal. I'm jealous.

 

[technomadia - chris]

I have no idea of the dimensions but check out the A2B folding electric bike.

Is there anything special about the A2B? From skimming over the review here, it doesn't seem well suited to a 250lb rider.

And... I can't find the folded dimensions for it listed anywhere!?!?

It boggles my mind that so few folding bikes actually seem to give folded dimensions. Is there any reason for this?

I'd love for folded dimensions to be included in the reviews here - is there any reason they have not been?

Back to watching bike review videos.... *grin*

- Chris

 

[technomadia - chris]

There is an ebike demo tour traveling to many cities in America in 2016. I plan on attending the Houston Texas stop on March 11 th. Sorry don't remember the link. I hear some folding bikes may be there.

Waiting to check out models in 2016 isn't going to work- I think I'd like to have bikes on board no later than Christmas, and ideally much sooner.

I just found out that there is an eBike shop (Eco Motion) in Santa Fe that stocks some folding models, and even has rentals. Maybe we'll go check them out tomorrow.

Cheers!

- Chris

 

[George S.]

Chris/Cherie

Here are some Dahon specs.

Specs

• Folded Size: 31.5"H x 26"W x 11.8"D.
• Weight: 27 lb. 10 oz.
• Fits Rider: 4'8" to 6'4'.
• Capacity: 230 lb.

I've followed your blog for several years, so I have a pretty good idea of where you go. A folding bike works well on pavement, especially a powered ebike. But I rode a folder at Quartzsite and Bouse, and it was very shaky on the rock and sand.

Basically, an ebike is any regular bike where a motor is woven into either the front or rear wheel. There are center drives that replace the pedal area, the bottom bracket, but it's not common on folders. There is a battery that has some mass and weight, so it has to be mounted somewhere. On folders, they often hang the battery off the back (not great for balance) or slide it somewhere like along the seat tube. If you look at the Brompton ebikes, they can be very refined and very expensive.

Most folders are cheap, mostly because they are basic bikes with basic batteries and motors. Some have throttles, some have an automatic pedal assist that increases the power as you turn the pedals. Either works very well when you get used to it.

Court has done a lot of reviews of folders recently, generally around $1500. There may be more similarities than differences.

For the kinds of places you go, a more rugged ebike with large wheels and off road tires would have more capability, but you may not want to do that.

Warranties should not be much of a problem, if you can do basic maintenance. Vendors often just send parts along for local replacement. Simpler designs are easier to troubleshoot and repair. Most folders are simple.

Have fun. You have a popular blog, maybe you can make a deal to test one for one of the vendors.

(Edit: This bike would just fit in your space, and has larger wheels.

http://www.nycewheels.com
http://www.nycewheels.com

 

[technomadia - chris]

George -

Thanks for the great feedback!

We have no way to transport a full-size bike - that is why we have been bike-less for the past four years that we've been living in a bus conversion.

We've cleared out a storage bay though - and are eager to put it to use as a bike garage.

The biggest limitation I think will be the bay's height - it is only 28" tall. Interestingly - even a lot of the folding bikes that do give dimensions do not make it clear what is height, and what is length, when folded.

If the bike is taller than it is long - is it practical to stack two folding bikes on their sides on top of each other? That sounds like an awkward mess, prone to damage and difficult to stow and remove.

But we are very open to ideas.

We went to the Eco Motive Electric Bike Shop in Santa Fe today and test drove a Prodeco Mariner 500 and a Sierra Cycles Synergy. Now we are looking for more great options to try.

Thanks everyone for the feedback,

- Chris (and Cherie) // www.technomadia.com

 

[Ravi Kempaiah]

- Chris (and Cherie) // www.technomadia.com

Amazing story!

Add a rack to this bike and you should be good.

 

[George S.]

They are easier to stow if you get the bag, or a bag. I used a bag. It was a pain getting the bike in the bag, of course. Dahon seems to rate their frames for 230#.

 

[vincent]

i looked at a lot of folding bikes too

did the prodeco mariner look like it is going to fit?

seems like maybe the ejoe bikes was slightly smaller than my mariner7 but not much
not sure what the weight limit is on those

there is a place in tucson that sells those, it is on speedway probably 15-20 minutes off I-10

i have the cemoto electric mountain bike but i feel it is going to be too big to fit

are you coming through tucson? i might could meet you somewhere on ten if work permits and show you the cemoto if that helps

 

[technomadia - chris]

i looked at a lot of folding bikes too
are you coming through tucson? i might could meet you somewhere on ten if work permits and show you the cemoto if that helps

We haven't planned our route across Arizona yet - but Tucson is a possibility. What bikes are carried by local dealers that we might get a chance to check out?

The Cemoto looks interesting - but we aren't really after a mountain-bike style ride.

Thanks for the reply,

- Chris

 

[technomadia - chris]

The feedback from this group has been great - thank you all!

I've been doing some work to distill down further what we are looking for, and I've started to put together a short list of contenders.

Here is what we are looking for:

Size Constraints:

• RV Bike “Garage” is 28” tall, 32” wide, and 36+” deep. Storing bikes upright in this space is desired.
• When away from our RV, we will want to transport both of our bikes in the rear (seat folded down) of a Mini Cooper.

Style of Riding / Terrain:

• Primarily leisurely exploration around-towns, campgrounds, state parks, and desert areas. We also hope to use the bikes for local errand running - such as trips to the market. We are not out to commute anywhere fast.
• Outings of 15-20 miles will be a typical max range, though further on occasion is possible.
• Comfort is key. Comfortable seat and riding position, and a relatively smooth ride desired.
• We’ll ride a mix of paved and dirt / gravel roads, as well as mild trails.
• Hills are likely - gears to get up them comfortably (if slowly) are a must.
• Rider #1 is 5’11” and 250lbs, and needs a bike that can handle his weight.
• Rider #2 is 5’5” and needs a bike that can handle her height.
• Electric assist is great - but the bike still needs to be enjoyable to ride without. Being able to shed the weight of the battery to leave it behind is ideal.

Desired Features:

• Simple & Reliable - We are constantly traveling and will not have a “home” bike shop to return to regularly for maintenance. We want bikes we can count on, and which will be able to put up with regular use and getting knocked around.
• Cargo rack or basket - we need a way get things home from farmer’s markets, etc.
• Fenders - we want to be able to go down a wet dirt road without ending up wearing it.
• Kick Stand - It boggles my mind that some bikes lack this??
• Lights - Easy enough to add, but nice if they are built in.
• Wheels - Hybrid-style tires suitable for both on and off pavement. 20” wheels minimum, potentially larger if possible.
• Easy Folding - If it takes more than a few minutes to pack the bikes down to fit into the garage storage space, we will not use them nearly as often as we should.

Desired eBike Features:

• Ideally Both Pedal Assist & Throttle - If only one, he would pick pedal assist. She would prefer a throttle.
• Regenerative Braking is exciting to us. We are geeks like that.
• Removable Battery.
• Nice bike computer display.
• Bonus geek points for anything that can talk to an iPhone.

Are there other key features that we should be looking for?

Current Short List:
We are just starting our research, and are trying to find the bikes that best fit our requirements. We are open to dedicated eBikes, or traditional folding bikes upgraded with BionX or other add-on systems.

Here are some of the contenders that we are researching, and we are looking for other options we should consider:

• e-Joe Epik SE
• Enzo eBike
• EZ Pedaler X350
• Easy Motion Neo Volt — Too tall when folded?
• Dayak New Yorker
• A2B Kuo
• iZip E3 — Single speed, no gear. May be limiting?
• Energie Cycles Excursion 2.0 — Single speed, no gears. May be too limiting.
• Tern Node D8 with BionX
• Montague Paratrooper with BionX — Full size wheels.
• Montague Crosstown with BionX — Full size wheels.

We’ve had a chance to test drive a Prodeco Mariner 500 and a Sierra Cycles Synergy, and both were impressive in their own ways - but not a great overall match for our target feature list.

What else should be on this list? What isn’t worth looking deeper at?

A matched pair of bikes is nice, but not necessary. We are open to two different designs.

Our goal is to have bikes picked out and purchased no later than the end of the year - and sooner is better.

Thanks!

- Chris // www.technomadia.com

 

[Nirmala]

It is kind of an oddball, but I like the idea of a fat tire folding bike:
http://electricbikereview.com/ssr-motorsports/trail-viper/

It should definitely give you the comfort factor with those big tires. And unlike most of the other folding bikes out there, it could handle a mild trail. Not sure if it folds down small enough for your needs though.

I would not worry about regenerative braking as it is not very efficient on a lightweight bicycle.

 

[technomadia - chris]

It is kind of an oddball, but I like the idea of a fat tire folding bike:
http://electricbikereview.com/ssr-motorsports/trail-viper/

It should definitely give you the comfort factor with those big tires. And unlike most of the other folding bikes out there, it could handle a mild trail. Not sure if it folds down small enough for your needs though.

I've never ridden a fat tire bike before (of any sort), but that does look intriguing and I've added it to our potentials list.

I do notice a lack of fenders or a cargo rack. Being able to cary groceries home is important, as is being able to drive down a wet dirt road without ending up wearing it.

SSR is a great example of a company that does not share "folded" specs -- their website actually only gives the unfolded dimensions?!!?

I wish all the video reviews here included taking measurements - that would really help people with size constraints who are on the hunt.

I would not worry about regenerative braking as it is not very efficient on a lightweight bicycle.

Any bike with me on it is not a "lightweight" bicycle. *grin*

Thanks for the awesome suggestion,

- Chris

 

[Nirmala]

A car with regenerative braking still weighs a lot more than you on a bike

The systems for bikes have a very low efficiency and generally only recapture 1-15 % of the energy available. Here is a thorough analysis:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7891

It is not a bad feature, but I would not make it the deciding factor. There are much fewer folding ebikes available with regen as it does require a direct drive motor. And remember that direct drive motors have some cogging that slows you down any time you are not pedaling. They do not coast as well as geared motors.

 

[RavingRoo]

I've owned the e-Joe Epik SE for a few weeks now, so I'll try to address some of your requirements as they relate to this model. I can't speak to the folded dimensions at the moment (but I can get them later when I get home), but I can tell you I feel perfectly comfortable on this bike at 6' and 270lbs. The weight limit on this bike is 300. In fact, I have the seat post a good 5" below it's maximum height line. The last time I road a bike with anything less than 26" wheels was when I was a kid (30 years ago) and I thought it would be odd, but I really don't notice. Another concern was the long stem, but again, I really don't notice. All road/paved path riding so far. The only thing that feels different, but I got used to it quick, is the handle bars are closer, which of course is expected on a small bike, but I don't feel cramped at all, and it keeps me in a more upright position which I find preferable for visibility. The Epik SE doesn't have an LCD display (just basic LED status), but I use my iPhone (with handle bar mount) and the RunKeeper app. The tires that come on the Epik SE are probably not well suited for any off road use. They have very minimum tread. I haven't tried it on a gravel/crushed stone path yet, but I'm expecting it to be a less than confident ride with the stock tires. Of course that's easily rectified for cheap. As for traversing hills, the Epik SE makes quite easy work of them actually. And I have some experience in comparing other ebikes (I also own an e-Joe Anggun and another bike with the Hill Topper kit). It just seems the Epik traverses those hills with less effort on my part (not to say a fair amount of effort is not required for steep/long hills). It seems the Epik is geared for hills, not speed, which is fine with me. It will get up to 20mph, but it requires a high cadence to pedal at that speed on this bike. As for range, it really depends on the terrain and how much pedaling you do. When I know I will need more range, I try to not use assist if I don't really need it on a flat section of road/path. With that, I was able to get about 27 miles with at least 3 or 4 uninterrupted miles without assist entirely, and a few other miles where I set it to the lowest assist level. But, if I was using medium or high assist the whole time, it probably would have been more like 20. That falls right into e-Joe's estimate of 20-30 miles. But again, it's hard to gauge range because there are so many variables. The good news is that the Epik SE is not too heavy at 42lbs, so it's reasonable to ride even if the juice runs out. The only negative so far with the Epik SE is that I've had to adjust the stem a couple of times now to stop it from rocking/wobbling at the connection point where it folds. It's not going anywhere when it's locked into place, but when the stem/handle bars wobble it's a bit disconcerting. It's hard to explain how that adjustment works, but it's very easy to do. I expect it's simply something that will have to be done every ride or every other ride due to the vibrations from transporting the bike and folding/unfolding it. It takes like 5-10 seconds (with a small adjustable wrench) to do the adjustment, so it's no big deal. I've never had it come loose while riding, only after folding/unfolding and transport, which makes sense given the way it works (again, hard to explain).

 

[George S.]

Don't know if you tested anything at that shop in Santa Fe. That helps, if you can ride a bike. Rentals are better.

I like building bikes. That means adding a motor and adding a battery, more or less. It's not rocket science. You find a bike you like and make it an ebike. Then you understand at least some of what you have.

The Montague Paratrooper and the Tern Joe series are both 26 inch folders. I believe they both remove the front wheel to fold. With a 2 inch knobby tire, you could get around pretty well in dirt and rock. My brother has one. It's just a nice comfortable ride in most non-trail conditions.

Converting a folder requires more care with routing wires and such. You might be able to do a Bafang BBS02 or HD, and that would really climb well. A basic 750 watt hub would work pretty well. I like the Mac motors, and use a front hub. That might be complicated if you need to remove the front wheel for storage.

Given the prices of the two 26 inch bikes, the total kit cost would be reasonable, hopefully $1500. You have done very intense research for your projects, very creative, so this might be a pretty simple thing to work out. Endless Sphere is a great resource.

Maybe you can set a new standard and get some of those pesky RV--ATV'ers on something quieter and less dusty.

 

[Uplink]

I like the looks of that SSR Trail Viper, it's rated to 280 lbs, it's priced well, and there is a dealer in Albuquerque near where you are. I would't discard the fat bike idea for lack of needing off-road capability; the balloon tires work as suspension as well.
LOBO SCOOTERS
Approximately 54.5 Miles from 87503
500 Yale Blvd. SE
Albuquerque, NM87106
(505) 804-7713

 

[vincent]

there is a big bike shop 5 minutes off ten when you come through tucson

it is ajo bikes
they should have quite a few to look at
they carry e-zip and a few others, i was only looking at folders and ended up getting something else but they did have quite a few electric bikes...

 

[technomadia - chris]

Converting a folder requires more care with routing wires and such. ...

Given the prices of the two 26 inch bikes, the total kit cost would be reasonable, hopefully $1500. You have done very intense research for your projects, very creative, so this might be a pretty simple thing to work out. Endless Sphere is a great resource.

Maybe you can set a new standard and get some of those pesky RV--ATV'ers on something quieter and less dusty.

I am starting to look into conversion options - but I am a bit wary having never done any "bike mechanic" work, and I don't want to take on a big project that gets between us and being able to enjoy our bikes.

Given enough time I'm sure I'd be able, and would enjoy the process. But instant gratification is very appealing too, and spare time is lacking.

As for the ATV's.... It is true that a LOT of RVers seem to copy what we do and buy what we buy.... But I don't think a lot of the ATV crowd are typically our audience. But, hmmm, maybe. Fewer loud ATV's around would be great!

- Chris