First Battery Use: Drain It Entirely?
- Thread starter Riversurf
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MisterBritcom
Active Member
One vote up for Mikey's answer.
Lithium ion batteries don't have the memory effect of older tech batteries. Avoid deep discharging, it's stressful on the cells.
Lithium ion batteries don't have the memory effect of older tech batteries. Avoid deep discharging, it's stressful on the cells.
False..Maybe. From memory I believe my Stromer manual says either the 1st or the 1st 3 times to run to empty but this is by memeory . The real answer for me is to read the owners' manual followed by ask the manaufacure (the one that says y or n to warranty claims) and then the dealer...this would be a good thing to know before the purchase
All of the above, and here's why.
True - Some systems require the battery to be run down low ( as in lower than you ever want to go in your normal use) because your "fuel gauge" or battery level indicator has to calibrate itself to the correct voltages to be accurate.
False - I'm not sure that all systems need this, but think it may be a good idea.
Not that simple - It MAY be a good idea, and some people think it helps condition the battery, like stretching before you workout.
Ravi Kempaiah
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It is true that Li-ion batteries don't have the memory problem like the old lead acid systems.
Some newer battery systems like the BionX, Yamaha, BH bikes have what people refer to as "deep sleep" or "hibernation" mode. This mode prevents the battery from undergoing irreversible changes. This helps in maintaining the capacity when not used for long time (6 months of winter in Scandinavian countries or 4 months of travel from the manufacturing factory in Asia to distributor to retailer to end customers).
When you bring the pack out of hibernation, it can be beneficial to run 0 to 100% once or twice. This way, you can detect any issues and recondition the pack. Ideally, this shouldn't matter but practically, it doesn't hurt to cycle it once or twice.
Some newer battery systems like the BionX, Yamaha, BH bikes have what people refer to as "deep sleep" or "hibernation" mode. This mode prevents the battery from undergoing irreversible changes. This helps in maintaining the capacity when not used for long time (6 months of winter in Scandinavian countries or 4 months of travel from the manufacturing factory in Asia to distributor to retailer to end customers).
When you bring the pack out of hibernation, it can be beneficial to run 0 to 100% once or twice. This way, you can detect any issues and recondition the pack. Ideally, this shouldn't matter but practically, it doesn't hurt to cycle it once or twice.
It's about the passivation layer or Interfacial protective film and trying to limit or reduce plating. That's why i mentioned "some people think". It's a hot debate.
Also what I mentioned has nothing to do with memory in regards to NiCd.
I read about it on the Battery university site.
P
p0ppyman
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Ravi Kempaiah
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Written by marketing folks or managers who are not well versed in the battery technology. You call up any E-bike company and ask them to explain how exactly a torque sensor works or what is a hall sensor? or what are the electrodes in an E-bike battery? they would not know (except for someone like Justin @ Grin Tech). This was the most appalling thing I experienced when I started my E-bike journey in 2013 i.e., lack of clarity or knowledge.
To prevent charge from dropping too low on your next trip. It's easier this way.
Note that you said "charge", not "fully charge" - don't know whether your manual uses exactly this wording, but this is how you should do it, to prolong the battery life. There is a balancing act here, you can fully charge and deeply discharge, and to shorten its life - or you can charge to 90% and take chances to discharge it way too deep or completely run out of juice on a long trip because you didn't have enough energy stored in there.
Full disclosure, more-less, should've been like this:
Don't discharge below 20%,
Charge no more than 90% if you will be using it soon,
Charge to 40-60% if you're going to put it in storage for several weeks.
This is - according to Justin "Grin" and other guys in the know.
If some manufacturer manual had all this, - especially the line about 20-90% - the reaction of an average consumer would've been like "Whaa? you told me the battery was 600 WH and now telling me that I can only use 600*70%= 420W". And then, such an honest guy would've been in disadvantage because many other wouldn't do this, unless such a disclosure was strictly enforced by the law.
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E-Wheels
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PaD
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Hi
What do mean by soon?
Immediate take off on you e-bike? 15 minutes? 1 hour?
If I charge to 100% how soon should start riding my bike to start discharge?
Gator
Well-Known Member
I am no expert but you will be okay for a couple of days, just don't store the battery long term (several months with a full charge or completely discharged.) Batteries are expensive and require care, but they are not as fragile as some would have you believe. If you know your bike is not going to be used for a few months (Swedish Winters) then store the battery indoors with about 50% charge. I recently went on vacation and my ebike battery was at 100% so I rode it for about an hour and got it down to 90%.
Ravi Kempaiah
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http://www.ebikes.ca/product-info/cycle-satiator.html
A very neat article by Micah Toll: https://electrek.co/2018/05/04/are-you-killing-your-lithium-batteries/
Q. 1. Few days, up to (maybe) one week. Nobody would tell you exact number, they are still learning and gathering data.
Q. 2. Better don't charge it to 100%, but - the sooner you start discharging, the better. High charging, low discharging, hot ambient, discharge current/power too high, charging current too high - everything contributes to the big picture. If you won't use it at all, it will still die
PaD
Well-Known Member
So all this means I should never charge to 100% if I really care about battery longevity?Q. 1. Few days, up to (maybe) one week. Nobody would tell you exact number, they are still learning and gathering data.
Q. 2. Better don't charge it to 100%, but - the sooner you start discharging, the better. High charging, low discharging, hot ambient, discharge current/power too high, charging current too high - everything contributes to the big picture. If you won't use it at all, it will still die
Most of e-bike owners probably don’t have a charger showing %. By reading the 5 leds on my battery I can probably tell I’ve reached 80% but during the time the 5th led is flashing I don’t really know when I’m close to 100%.
Settling for just over 80% would save me a lot of charging time though as the last 20 seems to take unproportionally long time
