First 1000 km on my Turbo S – a review from Stockholm, Sweden
- Thread starter Jan Hermanson
- Start date
Taipan
Member
Indeed, 25kph is rather low for any rider in decent shape on a decent bike on a decent road.
Riders using a a speed display are used to see 30+ figures and I'd be super happy if we had the same legal limit here in EU than in the States (20mph = 32 kph).
But for me, moving from peaks above 25kph to an average speed of 25kph on my daily commutes in Stockholm is impossible without proper cardio, due to the elevation delta mainly and the different stop & go.
Then the resulting sweat on my upper body demands that I carry an extra shirt and spend some time to (1) cool down and (2) find a bathroom to change and clean off the body fluids.
Because there is no way I can start a meeting or join friends for a drink in such state.
So the 5-10 minutes saved in commute time translate into a 15 minutes pit-stop + cooldown.
And that's in decent weather conditions with summer tires and light clothes
Now "Winter is Coming"TM and I'm switching my Schwalbe Marathon Greenguard with superb rolling resistance to Marathon Winter 240 spikes.
And my light Goretex setup to a combo of moped/snowboarding gears (gloves/helmet/pants/jackets) to handle the regular -10°c (14°F) conditions.
Achieving an average 25kph without sweating on the snow/icy paths -with winter tires and clothes-: impossible for an old slightly overweight fart like me, I admit.
But I hope a pedelec, even limited at 25kph, will help.
If I can find better, while reasonnable, sure !
T.
PS: just took some pictures of the bike path down my flat this afternoon so you can see the local conditions.
If it looks like it's night-time, it's because it is ^!^: the sun goes down at 15:30 this week (14:45 on Dec 21)
Though the lens on the Moto X accentuates the effect due to light posts, the sky is not THAT black.
Riders using a a speed display are used to see 30+ figures and I'd be super happy if we had the same legal limit here in EU than in the States (20mph = 32 kph).
But for me, moving from peaks above 25kph to an average speed of 25kph on my daily commutes in Stockholm is impossible without proper cardio, due to the elevation delta mainly and the different stop & go.
Then the resulting sweat on my upper body demands that I carry an extra shirt and spend some time to (1) cool down and (2) find a bathroom to change and clean off the body fluids.
Because there is no way I can start a meeting or join friends for a drink in such state.
So the 5-10 minutes saved in commute time translate into a 15 minutes pit-stop + cooldown.
And that's in decent weather conditions with summer tires and light clothes
Now "Winter is Coming"TM and I'm switching my Schwalbe Marathon Greenguard with superb rolling resistance to Marathon Winter 240 spikes.
And my light Goretex setup to a combo of moped/snowboarding gears (gloves/helmet/pants/jackets) to handle the regular -10°c (14°F) conditions.
Achieving an average 25kph without sweating on the snow/icy paths -with winter tires and clothes-: impossible for an old slightly overweight fart like me, I admit.
But I hope a pedelec, even limited at 25kph, will help.
If I can find better, while reasonnable, sure !
T.
PS: just took some pictures of the bike path down my flat this afternoon so you can see the local conditions.
If it looks like it's night-time, it's because it is ^!^: the sun goes down at 15:30 this week (14:45 on Dec 21)
Though the lens on the Moto X accentuates the effect due to light posts, the sky is not THAT black.
Last edited:
eagamer80
Active Member
Indeed, 25kph is rather low for any rider in decent shape on a decent bike on a decent road.
Riders using a a speed display are used to see 30+ figures and I'd be super happy if we had the same legal limit here in EU than in the States (20mph = 32 kph).
But for me, moving from peaks above 25kph to an average speed of 25kph on my daily commutes in Stockholm is impossible without proper cardio, due to the elevation delta mainly and the different stop & go.
Then the resulting sweat on my upper body demands that I carry an extra shirt and spend some time to (1) cool down and (2) find a bathroom to change and clean off the body fluids.
Because there is no way I can start a meeting or join friends for a drink in such state.
So the 5-10 minutes saved in commute time translate into a 15 minutes pit-stop + cooldown.
And that's in decent weather conditions with summer tires and light clothes
Now "Winter is Coming"TM and I'm switching my Schwalbe Marathon Greenguard with superb rolling resistance to Marathon Winter 240 spikes.
And my light Goretex setup to a combo of moped/snowboarding gears (gloves/helmet/pants/jackets) to handle the regular -10°c (14°F) conditions.
Achieving an average 25kph without sweating on the snow/icy paths -with winter tires and clothes-: impossible for an old slightly overweight fart like me, I admit.
But I hope a pedelec, even limited at 25kph, will help.
If I can find better, while reasonnable, sure !
T.
PS: just took some pictures of the bike path down my flat this afternoon so you can see the local conditions.
If it looks like it's night-time, it's because it is ^!^: the sun goes down at 15:30 this week (14:45 on Dec 21)
Though the lens on the Moto X accentuates the effect due to light posts, the sky is not THAT black.
View attachment 11852 View attachment 11855
I have similar clothing setup as you do. I was wearing a snowboarding goggles and helmet when the cold stroke last week, It felt much nicer overall and had lees trouble with the moisture inside the goggles compared to the regular bike glasses I own. A small trick here: you can apply a thin layer of hand detergent over the surface of your goggles/glasses if you want to avoid moisture.
By the way, I am using the Schwalbe Maraton Winter tyres, but the thinnest I could find (30-622) and I am regretting of having them (I actually bought them for a racer bike I have) and they are not very suitable on the heavier Turbo bike, when I hit soft snow everything becomes very unstable, I fear for my life =), but it grasps well on ice though). We still have several months of winter ahead, we'll see if I get wider 40 or 50-622 winter tyres.
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Taipan
Member
Hi eagamer80,
Are you sure you have the "Marathon" Winter version with 240 spikes ? I thought the 30-622 was only available in basic Winter with 120 spikes.
https://www.schwalbe.com/en/spikes.html
In any case, you'd probably feel safer with the 42-622 Marathon Winter riding it at lowest pressure like 30 psi.
The 50-622 might be too large for your fenders and you'll need some extra space anyway as snow & gravels will stick a bit on tires.
Another option is to go for more MTB type if your commute takes you through soft snow parts often.
The Continental Nordic Spike 42-622 are more aggressive than the Marathon Winter and since you're capped at 25km/h, the extra rolling resistance won't matter much.
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
I have them in 54-559 on my MTB, big difference in melted/soft snow because of the size of the lugs.
For comparison, here are those three winter tires.
Schwalbe Winter 120 spikes below, nice for straight handling as spikes only in center/flat area.
Schwalbe Marathon Winter 240 spikes below, better for angled/turn handling as extra spikes on the curved/round area.
Continental MTB Nordic Spike 240 spikes below, same as Marathon Winter but deep/large lugs to bite the mud and deeper snow.
BTW, here's a picture from last week after the snow storm in Stockholm with my new BH Easy Motion Nitro City speedelec 45 km/h, Marathon Winter 42-622.
I highly recommend the Tourer STX motorcycle jacket from Hein Gericke, second one I own, exceptional quality and very technical.
I just bought it for 115€ + 20€ shipping from their outlet, that jacket should sell for 400-500€.
One unique feature is their "Storm Collar", it's like a permanent neck warmer, no need to wear a scarf.
See the picture below and understand that it comes ON TOP of the regular collar which uses basic velcro.
So you can have three setups according to heat/sweat: (1) keep regular collar loose (2) close regular collar (3) close Storm Collar.
Plus it has integrated elbows/shoulders protectors so good stuff in case of fall.
I'm 186cm 90kg and bought the size UK 46 - EU 56. The size EU 54 was too short on the sleeves and buttocks.
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
The rest is:
- Indestructible heavy duty carpenter trousers X-1500 420g/m² canvas from Blåkläder brand (translates as "Blue-Collar" in English, call-it-like-it-is Swedish at its best :-D), 100€/105$.
Also have them in Softshell wind- and waterproof version, the pants are insane in winter, 125€/130$
In all of them you can add protection pads on the knees.
https://www.blaklader.uk/en/search-results?q=x1500
- Kamik Alborg boots (like Sorel but better quality/price according to reviews) from Amazon.fr/uk 75€/80$
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
- Decathlon (french sport retail chain, stores in 38 countries) snowboard H300 helmet with critical warm ear-cushions, 30€/33$.
http://www.decathlon.co.uk/h300-adult-ski-helmet-black-id_8374252.html
- Decathlon Arenberg cycling glasses, super cheap at 5€/6$ a pair, great protection against insects/rain/snow/wind.
Available in colorless, yellow (great for fog/snow) and brown/grey for sunny days.
Buy half-a-dozen mixed and place one pair everywhere (backpacks, jackets, car, bike carrier, drawer) and forget about worrying to lose them like precious Oakley's & co.
http://www.decathlon.co.uk/arenberg-cycling-sunglasses-category-1-yellow-id_8118519.html
T.
PS: updated post with pictures and links due to cross-sharing with other threads on winter clothing.
Are you sure you have the "Marathon" Winter version with 240 spikes ? I thought the 30-622 was only available in basic Winter with 120 spikes.
https://www.schwalbe.com/en/spikes.html
In any case, you'd probably feel safer with the 42-622 Marathon Winter riding it at lowest pressure like 30 psi.
The 50-622 might be too large for your fenders and you'll need some extra space anyway as snow & gravels will stick a bit on tires.
Another option is to go for more MTB type if your commute takes you through soft snow parts often.
The Continental Nordic Spike 42-622 are more aggressive than the Marathon Winter and since you're capped at 25km/h, the extra rolling resistance won't matter much.
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
I have them in 54-559 on my MTB, big difference in melted/soft snow because of the size of the lugs.
For comparison, here are those three winter tires.
Schwalbe Winter 120 spikes below, nice for straight handling as spikes only in center/flat area.
Schwalbe Marathon Winter 240 spikes below, better for angled/turn handling as extra spikes on the curved/round area.
Continental MTB Nordic Spike 240 spikes below, same as Marathon Winter but deep/large lugs to bite the mud and deeper snow.
BTW, here's a picture from last week after the snow storm in Stockholm with my new BH Easy Motion Nitro City speedelec 45 km/h, Marathon Winter 42-622.
I highly recommend the Tourer STX motorcycle jacket from Hein Gericke, second one I own, exceptional quality and very technical.
I just bought it for 115€ + 20€ shipping from their outlet, that jacket should sell for 400-500€.
One unique feature is their "Storm Collar", it's like a permanent neck warmer, no need to wear a scarf.
See the picture below and understand that it comes ON TOP of the regular collar which uses basic velcro.
So you can have three setups according to heat/sweat: (1) keep regular collar loose (2) close regular collar (3) close Storm Collar.
Plus it has integrated elbows/shoulders protectors so good stuff in case of fall.
I'm 186cm 90kg and bought the size UK 46 - EU 56. The size EU 54 was too short on the sleeves and buttocks.
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
The rest is:
- Indestructible heavy duty carpenter trousers X-1500 420g/m² canvas from Blåkläder brand (translates as "Blue-Collar" in English, call-it-like-it-is Swedish at its best :-D), 100€/105$.
Also have them in Softshell wind- and waterproof version, the pants are insane in winter, 125€/130$
In all of them you can add protection pads on the knees.
https://www.blaklader.uk/en/search-results?q=x1500
- Kamik Alborg boots (like Sorel but better quality/price according to reviews) from Amazon.fr/uk 75€/80$
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
- Decathlon (french sport retail chain, stores in 38 countries) snowboard H300 helmet with critical warm ear-cushions, 30€/33$.
http://www.decathlon.co.uk/h300-adult-ski-helmet-black-id_8374252.html
- Decathlon Arenberg cycling glasses, super cheap at 5€/6$ a pair, great protection against insects/rain/snow/wind.
Available in colorless, yellow (great for fog/snow) and brown/grey for sunny days.
Buy half-a-dozen mixed and place one pair everywhere (backpacks, jackets, car, bike carrier, drawer) and forget about worrying to lose them like precious Oakley's & co.
http://www.decathlon.co.uk/arenberg-cycling-sunglasses-category-1-yellow-id_8118519.html
T.
PS: updated post with pictures and links due to cross-sharing with other threads on winter clothing.
Last edited:
eagamer80
Active Member
Hi @Taipan,
nice pictures. Thanks for the recommendations of your equipment. I definitely liked the jacket, especially the option that has protection in shoulders and elbow. I have the same size as you, but it was sold out, I'll keep checking regularly. I travel frequently to Spain, and they have very good bike and motorbike stores there (cycling in Spain has many followers, especially because they can practice it all year round, like Italians) and usually have many deals in winter clothing (in particular for extreme weather). I've seen many good discounts when I traveled last year. I am traveling soon so I'll see what I can find.
Regarding the tires, you are right, mine are plain "winter", no "marathon winter", but I think I would definitely go for the Continental with 240 spikes 42" (I don't want to buy bigger and having the trouble that won't fit properly with the fenders. Actually, my summer tires are 42-622 and the space between the tires and the fenders is very narrow. I wouldn't risk buying bigger.
@ROJA, you're right, everybody complains according to what we experience, I guess if I would be in California anything below 30 would be cold. We have a saying here "there's no bad weather but bad clothing". I still remember last year seeing people riding at -15c/-20 (5F/-4F) snowing and with heavy wind, so I want to try that myself too.
nice pictures. Thanks for the recommendations of your equipment. I definitely liked the jacket, especially the option that has protection in shoulders and elbow. I have the same size as you, but it was sold out, I'll keep checking regularly. I travel frequently to Spain, and they have very good bike and motorbike stores there (cycling in Spain has many followers, especially because they can practice it all year round, like Italians) and usually have many deals in winter clothing (in particular for extreme weather). I've seen many good discounts when I traveled last year. I am traveling soon so I'll see what I can find.
Regarding the tires, you are right, mine are plain "winter", no "marathon winter", but I think I would definitely go for the Continental with 240 spikes 42" (I don't want to buy bigger and having the trouble that won't fit properly with the fenders. Actually, my summer tires are 42-622 and the space between the tires and the fenders is very narrow. I wouldn't risk buying bigger.
@ROJA, you're right, everybody complains according to what we experience, I guess if I would be in California anything below 30 would be cold. We have a saying here "there's no bad weather but bad clothing". I still remember last year seeing people riding at -15c/-20 (5F/-4F) snowing and with heavy wind, so I want to try that myself too.
Marc V
Member
Thanks for the tip for the hand detergent over the surface of your goggles! I was having issues with my goggles going into work today as it was a misty rain, they were unusable and I had to remove them! lol I will try that trick on my eBike ride home! haha
Take care, ride safe!
Marc V
Taipan
Member
@eagamer80
Size availability at Hein-Gericke EU outlet can be a pain indeed, I remember that my Size 56 went out of stock right after I bought my piece. Looks like it's truly an outlet getting rid of rare surviving pieces.
I don't know your budget but there's an upgrade jacket, with better specs but twice the price, in size 56 available.
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
Note: I'm not commissioned ;-) , just think their stuff is fantastic for the price.
And as the French say, again ;-), "Le prix s'oublie, la qualité reste" =
"The price you'll forget, but the quality will remain"
@Marc V
Following the cross-exchange on your own thread, I updated my previous post with more detailled pictures and links.
T.
Size availability at Hein-Gericke EU outlet can be a pain indeed, I remember that my Size 56 went out of stock right after I bought my piece. Looks like it's truly an outlet getting rid of rare surviving pieces.
I don't know your budget but there's an upgrade jacket, with better specs but twice the price, in size 56 available.
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
Note: I'm not commissioned ;-) , just think their stuff is fantastic for the price.
And as the French say, again ;-), "Le prix s'oublie, la qualité reste" =
"The price you'll forget, but the quality will remain"
@Marc V
Following the cross-exchange on your own thread, I updated my previous post with more detailled pictures and links.
T.
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Marc V
Member
Since this is a big Sweden thread, in my circle of friends we are aware of and have a lot of respect for Alexander Gustafson! I thought he defeated Jon Jones and should have been champion! haha
Also Jan Ove Waldner, Jorgen Person, Erik Lindh, and all the great table tennis players from that era! (Current Swedish ping pong players are really good as well haha)
Jorgen Person was just here in Chicago competing in the Edge Ball Open, so I got to see him live! haha
I also work for North Park University which is affiliated with Swedish Covenant! lol
Small world!
Take care, ride safe
Marc V
Also Jan Ove Waldner, Jorgen Person, Erik Lindh, and all the great table tennis players from that era! (Current Swedish ping pong players are really good as well haha)
Jorgen Person was just here in Chicago competing in the Edge Ball Open, so I got to see him live! haha
I also work for North Park University which is affiliated with Swedish Covenant! lol
Small world!
Take care, ride safe
Marc V
JRA
Well-Known Member
I also live where it gets dark early but instead of snow I have lots of rain to deal with. I have a set of neoprene raingear made by Stromer that I use while commercial fishing that goes on when it is really nasty out but my base layers of a set of tights with chamois, merino wool jersey and light merino wool sweater stays the same. For lesser rain I just use Gage raingear or Red Ledge lighter weight coat and pants. My son works for Nike and got me a pair of Converse water proof All Stars that are doing very well as I use flat pedals on my e bike. Sometimes I come home pretty dry and other times not so much but we don't get much lower than 40d here so by wearing wool I am still comfortable.
I read awhile ago that using the tight black gloves like mechanics use as a base layer for your hands also helps in cold climates. I just use the stretchy back insulated gloves that I get for $4.50 a pair and never had cold hands, even if wet.
I like threads like this that expose what is going on across the pond. The market there is much more mature and I am sure there are many folks like Taipan, who has been kind enough to take the time to share with us his clothing solutions, that have e biking pretty well dialed.
A big thing for me however is lighting but it probably deserves its own thread. There are many ways to skin that cat also!
I read awhile ago that using the tight black gloves like mechanics use as a base layer for your hands also helps in cold climates. I just use the stretchy back insulated gloves that I get for $4.50 a pair and never had cold hands, even if wet.
I like threads like this that expose what is going on across the pond. The market there is much more mature and I am sure there are many folks like Taipan, who has been kind enough to take the time to share with us his clothing solutions, that have e biking pretty well dialed.
A big thing for me however is lighting but it probably deserves its own thread. There are many ways to skin that cat also!
Taipan
Member
Hey @JRA,
Thank you for your kind message and glad that "across the pond" experience sharing was useful.
I got myself involved into lighting options too, maybe we could share thoughts on a dedicated thread ?
T.
PS: don't buy any of the lights Court reviewed in his last video "Bike light comparison", it's puppy stuff barely good enough for California hippie darkness ^!^
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