Faraday fiasco

[Spanishbulldog]

Faraday sold bikes in Spain for a short while and I bought one in 2018, As they no longer support their bikes in Europe I thought I would share as this may be very helpful for anyone upgrading or modifying their bike, so the battery went bad in the first month, as Faraday wanted $800 to ship a new one I decided to rebuild the battery locally, so your warned the battery is not standard it has a chip in the end and that was the issue as the cells were good, Yaa project - I will replace the nonstandard battery and the controller, the three speed switch was replaced with a throttle as it also didn’t work with a reg system either. I mounted the new Battery and controller in a leather bag on the crossbar and it looks fantastic. I was very happy as it all worked until I got on it, haha the motor shut down under power, so tried 2 more controllers from different manufacturers, first didn’t turn on second no power. The only part I haven’t replaced is the motor, and yes EVERY single part on the Faraday is non standard including the Cree led in the headlight, yes I blew that also. So the motor must have some funky stuff in it, as every sensorless controller I have tried will not work, I have spent more than the $800 but I do have a 36v 350w setup that will power the bike 10x further and faster than the standard. In conclusion I used topbikekit who ship in 3 days to purchase 2 controllers $24, and then do the watertight press fit connectors, hub motor $85, throttle $5 speed, pas I got my battery locally but they also do them. As tax is 30-40% it does add up. I am glad I had to do it as it is done now and I don’t have to find out propriety parts later. oh and I now have a digital display, 5 speeds, motor breaking cutoff.
Don’t get me wrong, it is a fantastic bike with some great components but the electronics are a nightmare, I am posting this as I couldn’t find any help anywhere on the replacement of the components and had to work this out very slowly by trial and error – mostly error
Hope it helps someone

 

[indianajo]

Welcome to the site.
Faraday went broke news reports say. Perhaps with these proprietary parts this was justified. They had some uniquely minimal e-bikes that covered fans of the tiny. Bionx is another brand with proprietary IC's in their battery.
Glad your bike is running now with the standard stuff. I had to waste $300 buying junk batteries before I found one that worked (at 2.2 X the price of the junk ones).

 

[FlatSix911]

Faraday sold bikes in Spain for a short while and I bought one in 2018, As they no longer support their bikes in Europe I thought I would share as this may be very helpful for anyone upgrading or modifying their bike, so the battery went bad in the first month, as Faraday wanted $800 to ship a new one I decided to rebuild the battery locally, so your warned the battery is not standard it has a chip in the end and that was the issue as the cells were good, Yaa project - I will replace the nonstandard battery and the controller, the three speed switch was replaced with a throttle as it also didn’t work with a reg system either. I mounted the new Battery and controller in a leather bag on the crossbar and it looks fantastic. I was very happy as it all worked until I got on it, haha the motor shut down under power, so tried 2 more controllers from different manufacturers, first didn’t turn on second no power. The only part I haven’t replaced is the motor, and yes EVERY single part on the Faraday is non standard including the Cree led in the headlight, yes I blew that also. So the motor must have some funky stuff in it, as every sensorless controller I have tried will not work, I have spent more than the $800 but I do have a 36v 350w setup that will power the bike 10x further and faster than the standard. In conclusion I used topbikekit who ship in 3 days to purchase 2 controllers $24, and then do the watertight press fit connectors, hub motor $85, throttle $5 speed, pas I got my battery locally but they also do them. As tax is 30-40% it does add up. I am glad I had to do it as it is done now and I don’t have to find out propriety parts later. oh and I now have a digital display, 5 speeds, motor breaking cutoff. Don’t get me wrong, it is a fantastic bike with some great components but the electronics are a nightmare, I am posting this as I couldn’t find any help anywhere on the replacement of the components and had to work this out very slowly by trial and error – mostly error Hope it helps someone

Congratulations on keeping your eBike alive... and sorry to hear that Faraday is now out of business.

 

[Ollybolly]

Faraday sold bikes in Spain for a short while and I bought one in 2018, As they no longer support their bikes in Europe I thought I would share as this may be very helpful for anyone upgrading or modifying their bike, so the battery went bad in the first month, as Faraday wanted $800 to ship a new one I decided to rebuild the battery locally, so your warned the battery is not standard it has a chip in the end and that was the issue as the cells were good, Yaa project - I will replace the nonstandard battery and the controller, the three speed switch was replaced with a throttle as it also didn’t work with a reg system either. I mounted the new Battery and controller in a leather bag on the crossbar and it looks fantastic. I was very happy as it all worked until I got on it, haha the motor shut down under power, so tried 2 more controllers from different manufacturers, first didn’t turn on second no power. The only part I haven’t replaced is the motor, and yes EVERY single part on the Faraday is non standard including the Cree led in the headlight, yes I blew that also. So the motor must have some funky stuff in it, as every sensorless controller I have tried will not work, I have spent more than the $800 but I do have a 36v 350w setup that will power the bike 10x further and faster than the standard. In conclusion I used topbikekit who ship in 3 days to purchase 2 controllers $24, and then do the watertight press fit connectors, hub motor $85, throttle $5 speed, pas I got my battery locally but they also do them. As tax is 30-40% it does add up. I am glad I had to do it as it is done now and I don’t have to find out propriety parts later. oh and I now have a digital display, 5 speeds, motor breaking cutoff.
Don’t get me wrong, it is a fantastic bike with some great components but the electronics are a nightmare, I am posting this as I couldn’t find any help anywhere on the replacement of the components and had to work this out very slowly by trial and error – mostly error
Hope it helps someone

Hi there,
Id also like to keep my beloved Faraday alive, and after a few years of excellent service I now need to replace my battery. I’m resigned to an external battery, perhaps in a case like yours - looks great. However, to have a battery built I need to know the front hub motor’s specs - like what is its voltage range? Faraday says that it’s tuned to 43V (matching their custom battery), but how closely matched will I need to get the battery made since 43V is unusual? I believe it’s a Bafang motor but seems non standard. The serial number on the side is BF1512 SYXD 7961, which i can’t find anywhere via google and Bafang haven’t replied to email. If you have any ideas, I’d be very grateful to hear. Actually I’d be grateful to know the details of all of the parts that you’ve ended up installing if they’ve worked for you..

If Im dreaming a d a new battery isn’t a solution I may need to install a whole new motor, battery, controller and torque sensor. That would be a pain, but worth doing as my bike is my daily commute transport. If anybody has completed any Faraday hacks please share them so we can keep them on the road.

cheers,

Olly

 

[harryS]

I see Faraday used to advertise a 43 volt battery. Must be LiFePO4.
A fully charged Li-ion pack with 10 groups in series is 42.0V max, 36V at nominal charge.
A fully charged LiFeP04 pack with 12 groups in series 43,2V max, 38.4V nominal.

LiFePO4 is a safer chemistry, less likely to blow up and much better life, but has less energy. Odd choice for a limited space.

The motor is just your regular geared motor. It will run on anything from 24 volts up to 60 volts, just at different speeds. It's the controller that needs attention. If it can run on regular Li-ion cells. Its top speed on a fully charged Li-ion pack will be just a little less, but for the same volume battery, it will go farther. LiFePO4 and LI-ion cells have similar low voltage cutoffs, so the controller should work safely on either one.

How many wires come out of the Faraday battery? Looks like two in the picture. If there are only two, there there's no reason to believe there's a chip in there to restrict 3rd party batteries. The OP may have been talking about the BMS. If you put Li-Ion cells into a battery that used LiFEPO4, well, you never put the wrong type of BMS with a battery. If you rebuild the battery, you have to use the charger appropriate to the cell chemistry.

I've never seen a Faraday, so I'm just guessing here and could be wrong. If I'm not wrond, one could rebuild the battery with li-Ion cells and a new BMS. or replace it with an external battery. What I would do, if I had a Faraday would be to hook up one of my regular 36V packs to the controller and see if it works. Maybe you have a friend with a 36V scooter pack that you could test.

 

[harryS]

If it does use LiFePO4 cells, it's probably easiest to have someone rebuild it. It probably was made with 12 32650 cells, and would be not hard to replace. These are 32mm (1 1/4") in diameter.

 

[Ollybolly]

Hi Harry and thanks.
I will see if I can acquire a 36V battery to test the controller. It looks like you right about the LiFePO4 chemistry, based on some further information, though on the bikes tech specs it does say Lithium-ion.

Existing battery:
Voltage 43.2
Cells: Panasonic 18650 GA 3.5 AH
Battery amp hours: 6.9ah
Battery watt hours: 298 wh (24 18650-PF cells) - I thought I’d read 12 cells somewhere.
Weight: 1.44kg

The charger says 2A, 51V, and I’ve read somewhere that inside the “brain” (see below) there is an integrated charger that presumably steps the voltage down to the battery’s requirements.

Existing motor:
Bafang, “custom tuned” 43V (looks similar to a Bafang FM G311.250.V/D, which says it’s a 36/43V, but not as heavy)
Motor nominal output 250 watts, peak 350 watts.

Regarding proprietary chips, the Faraday does have a “brain” below the seat (see wiring diagram attached) that stores some kind of chip plus an integrated rear led light. I’m not sure how standard that setup is, but the Faraday controller on the handlebars is a very minimal power controller with only battery charge remaining e-ink readout. Perhaps its this under-seat brain that needs to be satisfied.

Cheers,

Olly

 

[harryS]

Sounds good, except Panasonic 18650 GA are not LiFePO4. They're high quality Li-ion cells, The charger is important too. It would be a 50.4V charger if you did have 12 of those Panasonics.

What's wrong with the battery anyway? Does it have two wires? No voltage coming out of it? You should prove it's the battery before you replace it.

 

[Ollybolly]

Hi Harry, yes I can confirm that it’s a 51.4V charger (see photo).

The battery remains functional, but after more than 3 years of everyday riding it’s lost some zip and range. I’m thinking ahead to a replacement as I don’t want a disposable bike.

Also, yes the battery has two cables coming out of it as per the photo attached.

cheers,

Olly

 

[harryS]

Mystery no longer. Your standard 48V Li-Ion is 13series groups. Either Faraday ran out of room or they wanted an odd duck voltage, Maybe the controller locks out a 13 series battery, You could do a partial charge on a 13 series to get around that if you wanted to test an external pack,

Nonetheless, the Panasonic GA is a good cell. You probably have another couple of years. Ask a rebuilder to quote you a new one. If you could get a similar tubular case, it's just 24 $8 cells, a $20 BMS and an hour with a spot welder.

 

[Ollybolly]

Thanks very much Harry. I will be seeking a new build from a local provider. This has been very helpful!
Happy riding.
Olly