Differences between hub motor with Torque sensor vs mid drive motor

I have Flatout in all of my 26x4 fat tires. I saw a YouTube video that compared Mr. Tuffy Tire Liners, Tannus Armor, Green Slime, and Flatout. The Flatout performed the best. I've got 1200 miles on my main ebike, lots of trail riding, zero flats. I buy the 32oz bottles and put 16oz in each tire.

 
What I found odd about that demo is that he used a power drill. I have yet to have a tire attacked by a drill while ridding! Okay, so we have strayed off topic and I will take advantage of that for a humor break. I am in an office building with everything from attorneys, plumbers, to child psychologists. You can tell when the psychologist has had a client because there is pee on the seat. Across the hall is a Taylor. I don't know how swift she is. I was walking to the mail boxes when a young woman just walked passed holding a dress and asked, "Do you know were the place is for altercations"? Now I need to replace a mid-drive.
 
I have Flatout in all of my 26x4 fat tires. I saw a YouTube video that compared Mr. Tuffy Tire Liners, Tannus Armor, Green Slime, and Flatout. The Flatout performed the best. I've got 1200 miles on my main ebike, lots of trail riding, zero flats. I buy the 32oz bottles and put 16oz in each tire.

That stuff has worked for me across a wide variety of punctures, both as a tube sealant and as my tubeless sealant. Survived a 6-nail puncture (nailgun strip) once on a fat tubeless tire with Flatout. Use it on my Bullitt where the tires are much narrower and pressures much higher (60 psi front and 70 rear). Its only failure was very recently when something - I never figured out what - put a 3/4" tear in my tire casing and a similar slice into my front tube. Flatout everywhere. Tire (20x2.4") went flat in about 20 feet. Was almost unpatchable. Not much anything will do against that.
 
That stuff has worked for me across a wide variety of punctures, both as a tube sealant and as my tubeless sealant. Survived a 6-nail puncture (nailgun strip) once on a fat tubeless tire with Flatout. Use it on my Bullitt where the tires are much narrower and pressures much higher (60 psi front and 70 rear). Its only failure was very recently when something - I never figured out what - put a 3/4" tear in my tire casing and a similar slice into my front tube. Flatout everywhere. Tire (20x2.4") went flat in about 20 feet. Was almost unpatchable. Not much anything will do against that.
I found the new thinner flat out sucks in tubeless. the sealed holes always weep and you can lose 8ox in a month or two. I dont have any of the regular to test it out.
 
When I get a little slice in a tire I fill it with gasket making sealant. Works great. After a huge homeless encampment was bulldozed as a public health emergency, someone was going around smashing bottles on all the MUPs. The brown beer bottles are the worst because you can't see it until you are on top of it and hear that you are breaking glass with your tires. The encampment had no sanitation, no water, and there was a fire. They didn't have any kind of latrines. It took a crew with three bulldozers and other heavy equipment with a team of 12-15 an entire week to clean out the encampment. I heard that there were sharps everywhere.
 
I found the new thinner flat out sucks in tubeless. the sealed holes always weep and you can lose 8ox in a month or two. I dont have any of the regular to test it out.
I talked to FlatOut maybe a year ago and the woman I spoke to on the phone told me the viscosity on the version Home Depot sells is no different than the Sportsman Formula that everyone uses on their bikes - at least they before the bike version came out. I have had great experience with the original stuff so no interest in experimenting. I did also have it seal a puncture on that same 2.4" tire. The one where it didn't it was literally at night, below freezing, with a full load of groceries and I was just not in the mood to go hunt down the culprit for posterity's sake. Was my first need-roadside-repair flat in over two years so I guess I was due.
 
I talked to FlatOut maybe a year ago and the woman I spoke to on the phone told me the viscosity on the version Home Depot sells is no different than the Sportsman Formula that everyone uses on their bikes - at least they before the bike version came out. I have had great experience with the original stuff so no interest in experimenting. I did also have it seal a puncture on that same 2.4" tire. The one where it didn't it was literally at night, below freezing, with a full load of groceries and I was just not in the mood to go hunt down the culprit for posterity's sake. Was my first need-roadside-repair flat in over two years so I guess I was due.
I bought it as I had no luck with the regular flat out on our 70 psi tandem tires. so I bought the thinner stuff but then decided to go to tubeless and used that. the tire held air well but it leaked out the punters always. I would see wet spots in the same places on the tires. every day.
 
I use Flatout Sportsmans formula (the yellow label) and I run my 26x4 fat tires at 18 PSI. 1200 miles, no flats.
 
I'm in the process of building a new bike with a carbon frame. On my other aluminum frame I had a grin GMAC hub motor, cadence sensor and a 48T chainring. I moved up from a 44T because I was maxing out the pedals on the flats at between 300W and 400W of PAS. So, the new carbon frame will still have the GMAC but with a BB torque sensor. I like to run a double chainguard at the front and with a 42T chainring, I will have no more than 1mm clearance on the chainstay. So I may have to go down to a 40T. The rear cassette is 11-36 10 spd. Any ideas as to how much speed I may give up on the flats by going down from 48T to 40T? How much extra oomph does the torque sensor contribute when pedaling hard? I realize that this last question is fairly nebulous since it depends on how you program the PAS and the factors you use for the torque sensor. The CA3 seems to give me almost unlimited options.
 
I'm in the process of building a new bike with a carbon frame. On my other aluminum frame I had a grin GMAC hub motor, cadence sensor and a 48T chainring. I moved up from a 44T because I was maxing out the pedals on the flats at between 300W and 400W of PAS. So, the new carbon frame will still have the GMAC but with a BB torque sensor. I like to run a double chainguard at the front and with a 42T chainring, I will have no more than 1mm clearance on the chainstay. So I may have to go down to a 40T. The rear cassette is 11-36 10 spd. Any ideas as to how much speed I may give up on the flats by going down from 48T to 40T? How much extra oomph does the torque sensor contribute when pedaling hard? I realize that this last question is fairly nebulous since it depends on how you program the PAS and the factors you use for the torque sensor. The CA3 seems to give me almost unlimited options.
at about 90 rpms cadence you can do 28 mph or so with a 42t chainring and 700c wheels.
 
This is a torque sensing mid-drive with a throttle and an internally geared hub. It is posable to have it all. It feels like a bike but amplified, no surge or lurch, immediate, smooth, for her birthday. Then her husband had to get one for Christmas. Better eBikes do not look or feel clunky. Good ones are lithe, and elegant. Pedal speed is the same as chainring speed.
Why don’t you raise money and start manufacturing? I would buy one
 
Looks like I'll have to settle for a 42T and forget the inner chainguard. Gives me 1 or 2 mm of clearance on the chainstay and about 51mm chainline. I've got a clamp-on chainguard that will work. To get a better chainline, I would have to put spacers on the inside of the spider to move the chainring further to the left and I would have to go down to a 40T or even a 38T.
 
I would buy one
Thanks for saying that. I like to keep it local. If you want to see some of my builds they are on google maps. Just search for PedalUma eBikes. Maybe you have a local builder who can help you. All the best.
 
Any one can use this simple tool for calculating gearing. I use it regularly. You will loose almost 20% on the top end but gain about 20% of torque in every gear.

Thanks PedalUma. Neat calculator. Now all I have to do is figure out my rpm. I don't have a clue how fast I pedal. It's something that I've never been interested in, because I've had a motor. I think the CA3 might keep tabs on that, but I don't know if it retains historical information. Once I get it hooked up I'll check it.
 
Any one can use this simple tool for calculating gearing. I use it regularly. You will loose almost 20% on the top end but gain about 20% of torque in every gear.

Thanks PedalUma. Neat calculator. Now all I have to do is figure out my rpm. I don't have a clue how fast I pedal. It's something that I've never been interested in, because I've had a motor. I think the CA3 might keep tabs on that, but I don't know if it retains historical information. Once I get it hooked up I'll check it.
If you have an analog watch with a second hand, calculating your cadence is easy. Just count revolutions for 15 seconds and multiply by four. For me it is easiest while ridding to just double the number twice. So, if it is 15 revolutions in 15 seconds, you get 30, then 60. You have a cadence of 60. It is is 20, then you get 40, then your cadence is 80.
 
As soon as it warms up and the ice is off the streets and it's safe to ride, I'll try that. Thanks for the tip.
 
Too many variables involved in dialing in gearing on an ebike. To make a good decision, you need to bring riding data and goals to the problem.

By way of example, my personal top riding goals:
1. Low assist whenever possible.
2. Stay within a cadence range my funky knees will tolerate in this hilly area.
3. Solve cadence problems with gear shifts first, then assist changes.

Data collection :
A. Find out what my preferred cadence range really is. Ballpark will do.
B. Test existing top and bottom gears in realistic riding conditions with an eye toward room for improvement and acceptable trade-offs.

I found that my stock bottom gear was way too high and that top gear was about right for my goals. That ruled out a chainring swap alone.

Armed with that data, I used a gearing calculator in 2 steps:
1. Find out what current top and bottom gears are in gear-inches. Otherwise, no way to know how to change them based on (B) above.
2. Play around with the calculator to adjust top and bottom gear-inches accordingly.
3. Unless you're a real gearing connoisseur, rely on the cassette manufacturer to space the gears in between. Most use an exponential spacing.

You may well have other goals, but a calculator won't do much good till you have a firm idea of what they are and how what you have now actually rides.
 
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I set aside the Sheldon Brown charts when I found this site. Frankly I hate the redesign, but this link preserves most of the older version's look/feel. This one is Speed at Cadence.

There is also a Cadence at Speed, and those two charts pretty much let me figure out what gears I wanted to start out with on each new bike build. I pretty much always ended up changing the chainring a time or three once I actually rode the finished bike and picked up a quirk I hadn't factored in earlier. So take all these calculators with the proverbial grain of salt.
 
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