Bridgestone ebikes have front re-gen hub motor, extending range by over 40%

[Timpo]

Bridgestone re-gen equipped hub motor is on front wheel, extending the battery range by over 40%.
https://www.bscycle.co.jp/TB1e/ (Translator needed, website in Japanese)

Although the actual battery capacity is 9.9Ah, they advertise the battery capacity is 14.3Ah equivalent.

I think other companies like Stromer and GMAC equipped bikes should try to put their hub motor on front, so that they could recoup more energy.

 

[steve marino]

I would like to see the facts on a 40% increase. That sounds like advertising malarkey to me.

 

[rich c]

I call BS on that 40% too. Maybe if your ride starts on the Continental Divide and heads east.

 

[Deleted member 4210]

I would like to see the facts on a 40% increase. That sounds like advertising malarkey to me.

Total malarkey. Off by a factor of 10 at least. 4% at most, and thats if you have a lot of downhill riding, and dont use assist going up the hill before it.

 

[Captain Slow]

It is Bridgestone who are a reputable company, so maybe it's a translation error?

 

[Scott Adams]

The only energy expended by the battery that is recoverable is the energy used to accelerate the mass of the combined rider and bike or to climb hills.

All of the energy used from the battery (or your legs) while you are cruising at a constant speed and not gaining altitude is impossible to recover with any form of regeneration on a bike or a car.

A slow ride uphill might achieve high percentage levels of energy recovery when descending, but typical riding conditions would not yield 40% recovery.

Riding downhill without climbing back up doesn't happen all that often.

Whether it is on the front or rear wheel is important because a bike can exert greater stopping power from the front wheel while remaining in control, so you could in theory absorb energy during hard braking better than from the rear, assuming the regen is powerful and quickly modulated - similar to a disc brake.

 

[JRA]

That is a Sanyo Eneloop type hub motor. The motor was invented around 2006 by a guy in Illinois (iirc) and he licensed the design to Sanyo but they never really did anything with it at the time other than mamachiri type bikes. I have been wondering if it would show up again some day.

New Eneloop Bike Recharges On the Flat

Sanyo has added a new electric bike to its Eneloop line-up, and it comes with the brand-new Eco Charge Mode. We first saw the Eneloop bike when we took it for a spin around the car-park at CES in Las Vegas (before being kicked out by a security guard). That bike would charge only on […]

www.google.com

 

[harryS]

A quote from one of the above linked reviews. "Riding on the flat for 1Km will give enough juice to use the power mode for 300-meters. "

It seems to me that converting mechanical energy to spin a wheel is much more efficient than converting mechanical energy toward that, plus the extra work of spinning a generator to charge a battery.

Riding on the flat for 1.3 Km with the system turned off has to take less rider energy than riding 1KM to charge the pack and then using it for 300m. And riding a regular bike for 1.3Km will take even less engery because I don't thave the cogging of a DD motor. In other words, I'd sooner take a regular bike than try to charge a battery by pedaling.

All these bikes that claim to extend battery life. Sure they will, if the rider is putting in a huge chunk of effort,

Meanwhile, in the larger scheme of things. Stay healthy everyone.

 

[AHicks]

3 things. First, anything is possible, but I'd have to see the 40% recovery, or even half of that to believe it.

Second, thinking many are not familiar with GMAC.

Last, I hope like hell the GMAC designs are left on the rear. If I'm going to loose traction for ANY reason, I'd much prefer it be on the rear! I HATE pavement burns!

 

[Cyklefanatic]

Nobody is mentioning how awful front wheel drive can be. If you hit a bit of sand or dirt going uphill the wheel can spin and the bike shifts sideways. Also happens if try to ride on a beach.

 

[Ken M]

3 things. First, anything is possible, but I'd have to see the 40% recovery, or even half of that to believe it.

Second, thinking many are not familiar with GMAC.

Last, I hope like hell the GMAC designs are left on the rear. If I'm going to loose traction for ANY reason, I'd much prefer it be on the rear! I HATE pavement burns!

Yes the GMAC / Phaserunner from Grin is a fantastic drive system but even they say that the major benefit of the regen is the reduced wear and tear on brake pads. The power generation extends range in the 4-8% range and probably more on the low side of that range.

 

[opimax]

Having had regen on my Stromers not sure why the motor has to be on the front. You get in the habit of braking early since regen doesn’t do as much as full braking. So you start braking early, if you need hard stops, automatic reaction to use both brakes as normal with more on the front as you are supposed to do. I guess if you live in a the world of mainly hard stops it may make a little more sense.

Regen would start when either brake handle is pulled so motor on the back using front brake would start regen. Continuing to pull would start friction on the front pads. On some versions using the using the rear brake would use less slowing power and the front would have more regen /slow down power. You get used to what works while riding. It was also configurable to how much regen was used when slowing . Set it higher in hilly terrain and less on flatter areas.

Even carrying 3 big batteries I would still run out of juice so getting 4-8 miles back on a 100 mile ride was also worth while aside from saving brake pads.

 

[AHicks]

I bought my Shimano brake pads from AliExpress in bulk, so I got them for super cheap.

I don't mind the mild inconvenience of changing brake pads slightly more often.
Also if that's the case, the hub motor really should be on the front because front pads wear out faster.

With added price, mechanical complexity and weight for adding re-gen system, I don't know if it's worth it if main benefit is saving brake pads

This isn't about replacing brake pads, or which end you wear out quicker. It's about operating the potential of the GMAC system safely. You want to put yours on the front, go for it!

 

[AHicks]

Having had regen on my Stromers not sure why the motor has to be on the front. You get in the habit of braking early since regen doesn’t do as much as full braking. So you start braking early, if you need hard stops, automatic reaction to use both brakes as normal with more on the front as you are supposed to do. I guess if you live in a the world of mainly hard stops it may make a little more sense.

Regen would start when either brake handle is pulled so motor on the back using front brake would start regen. Continuing to pull would start friction on the front pads. On some versions using the using the rear brake would use less slowing power and the front would have more regen /slow down power. You get used to what works while riding. It was also configurable to how much regen was used when slowing . Set it higher in hilly terrain and less on flatter areas.

Even carrying 3 big batteries I would still run out of juice so getting 4-8 miles back on a 100 mile ride was also worth while aside from saving brake pads.

This GMAC regen is a different breed of cat. It's WAY more effective than anything ever available from a direct drive. Because of this, it HAS to be variable. You do not want all of this at once for the most part.

Especially noteworthy with the GMAC is the amount of regen available. You don't need to be flying down a hill to feel it. Because the gear drive motor is turning 5x faster than a direct drive hub/motor, the GMAC regen is able to completely stop the bike by itself!

The variable regen is used/controlled with either the primary throttle, or a second one used exclusively for braking. If using the primary throttle, once a brake signal supplied (from front or rear), braking action is provided just like power. Increasing the throttle setting increases the amount of regen/braking. A brake signal with no further action from the throttle does nothing but allow the bike to coast.

No doubt this throttle braking is going to take some getting used to......

 

[opimax]

No doubt it is different , my main point was front wheel motor doesn’t make much difference. The amount you can set the Stomer to is almost full stop also but the way it used it is not not variable once in motion so if set so high it would be too much most of the time

 

[JRA]

Nobody is mentioning how awful front wheel drive can be. If you hit a bit of sand or dirt going uphill the wheel can spin and the bike shifts sideways. Also happens if try to ride on a beach.

That hasn’t been my experience at all after riding thousands of miles on dd 1000w peak front hub motors. The two wheel drive motor/human effect works very well in fact in all the situations you mention.



I don’t believe you need fat tires to ride sand either....

Regen is good for saving pad wear as a drag brake. As I posted the Sanyo hub has been making those claims for over a decade. EBike marketing is e lastic