JES2020
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I have a strange feeling this and related posts from the OP are going to go on for quite a while.
Bafang 500W Mid Drive Kit Availability
- Thread starter jfny1978
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Thank you, yeah, I learned today that all BBS02's are the same exact unit, and you can program the Wattage. So that' not just your opinion, that's how it works! I think I am going to get the programming cable, which is only $15, and tweak ALL of the settings to my own needs. You can even customize the pedal assist levels.
JES2020
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You can program MOST of the better controllers and some of the cheaper ones. Between the c and p parameters (KT controllers ), there must be way more than 200 variables you can program.
tomjasz
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How did you come to this conclusion?
Jeannette at California Ebikes said their 500w motors they sell are just 750w motors programmed down to 500w, and I did some googling and discovered that that seems to be the case everywhere. I could be wrong, but that's what it seemed.
tomjasz
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Thanks for clarifying. While not entirely true, in the case of the 48V 500W and 750W that's correct. BUT there are other BBSxx series motors with different specifications.
Be smart when programming and don't just experiment with settings.
There are sets of *.el files with settings others have settled on. Use them as a guide.
Thank you.
There is no difference between the 500W motor and the 750 w motor except the controller. The BBSO2 can be programed for 500W max. Keep in mind that the regulations read motor output not battery draw. The BBSO2 is in the 70% efficiency range so you would need to set the controller to 15 amps at 48 volts. Then program the speed for 20 mph max
On my BBSHD bike, programed the same way, there are 9 settings. The first 6 settings I have programed for a class 1 bike. Settings 7 and 8 are class 3 and 9 is off road/emergency setting. I have the throttle programed for 400 battery watts max and 15 mph. I use it to get started then I pedal. I could get back on the throttle alone but it would be slow.
The first six setting on my bike max out at about 690 battery watts or about 500 motor output watts.
Go with the BBSO2 and program it as you wish. 48 volts is easier on things than the 36V. The difference is the 36v has a lower top speed and more torque at the lower end for the same wattage.
On my BBSHD bike, programed the same way, there are 9 settings. The first 6 settings I have programed for a class 1 bike. Settings 7 and 8 are class 3 and 9 is off road/emergency setting. I have the throttle programed for 400 battery watts max and 15 mph. I use it to get started then I pedal. I could get back on the throttle alone but it would be slow.
The first six setting on my bike max out at about 690 battery watts or about 500 motor output watts.
Go with the BBSO2 and program it as you wish. 48 volts is easier on things than the 36V. The difference is the 36v has a lower top speed and more torque at the lower end for the same wattage.
On torque sensing vs PAS, I have some opinions. Which one is better depends on a number of things. I prefer the PAS to torque sensing. I did not at first because my subconscious mind was not ready or programed for PAS. The human mind is programed for torque sensing. Once you re-program your mind for PAS, PAS becomes much more versatile. For me, it took a surprising amount of time for that to happen.
With torque sensing, the more you put into the pedals yourself, the more you get out. When you get to a hill, you pedal harder to get up the hill or use throttle. Your mind is programed to automatically put in more power on a hill and this feels natural.
With a PAS sensed bike like the Bafang, you set an amount of help and a speed limit that you will get. If you are below the speed limit, the bike will put out power up to the chosen limit. Once the speed limit is reached, the power will reduce to maintain that limit. Kind of like cruise control. The problem is when you get to a hill, your mind automatically increases the power output from you. Well, the Bafang units will gladly back off and let you work your tail bone off climbing that hill. It feels sluggish because no matter how much you pedal, the power output remains the same.
Once you re-program your brain to sense how much you want to put in and not automatically increase your own power output, the modus becomes simply increasing the power levels to maintain how much you want to put in for how fast you want to climb. I have learned to automatically change power settings and gears to maintain what I want. The result is that I can chose what I want to put in, even on a hill.
What does maintaining what you want offer. Well, you can set the power settings high enough that no power is required from you. You spin the pedals but there is no resistance. This is fantastic if you are old and need to loosen up, like using a stationary therapy bike before adding power. Great if you have just overdone some other activity and need to loosen up. Like cleaning requiring bending and kneeling, then you end up stiff. Grab the bike, set the PAS high and loosen back up. 15 minutes of that and you feel much better.
The same is true if you need to keep your heartrate at something less than stupid but still ride where you want. On a torque sensed bike, you might need to add too much of your own power to get what you want and bust the heart rate you have set. The same is true if you bonk easily. You can increase the power and trace through the pedal strokes in order to move lactic acid out of the muscles.
PAS sensing is also great for interval workouts. You can pick a speed on PAS setting, get to that speed and reduce the power greatly for one minute. Try to maintain that speed and then increase the power to rest.
In short, a torque sensed bike acts like a regular bike and you need no changes to handle it. A PAS bike requires some subconscious reprograming of the mind but then doubles as a therapy recovery bike and opens up options for getting as much or as little as you want at any time.
The stock programming is 9, ten percent increases in power. That really sucks because the power jumps at slow speeds is too much. At high speeds, the power requirements from wind resistance climb fast. I have mine reprogrammed for small increases progressing to higher increases at the top end. That feels much more natural and allows me to mix easily with non e bike riders.
I bike three days a week with a group of riders. Average age in the group is about 75 years old. 3/4 ths are on e bikes. Most of the bikes are PAS but we have two people on torque sensed bikes. On the metro paths where we park we have a choice in one direction of easy fairly level terrain. the other direction is lung busting climbs and steep descents. If our group shows up on all e bikes we like to go the hilly route. We find that the torque sensing riders are far less enthusiastic about that choice than the PAS riders. The torque sensing riders are often winded at the end of the ride and often use throttle. Most of the PAS sensed bikes don't even have a throttle. To dangerous with gabby seniors at a stop light.
With torque sensing, the more you put into the pedals yourself, the more you get out. When you get to a hill, you pedal harder to get up the hill or use throttle. Your mind is programed to automatically put in more power on a hill and this feels natural.
With a PAS sensed bike like the Bafang, you set an amount of help and a speed limit that you will get. If you are below the speed limit, the bike will put out power up to the chosen limit. Once the speed limit is reached, the power will reduce to maintain that limit. Kind of like cruise control. The problem is when you get to a hill, your mind automatically increases the power output from you. Well, the Bafang units will gladly back off and let you work your tail bone off climbing that hill. It feels sluggish because no matter how much you pedal, the power output remains the same.
Once you re-program your brain to sense how much you want to put in and not automatically increase your own power output, the modus becomes simply increasing the power levels to maintain how much you want to put in for how fast you want to climb. I have learned to automatically change power settings and gears to maintain what I want. The result is that I can chose what I want to put in, even on a hill.
What does maintaining what you want offer. Well, you can set the power settings high enough that no power is required from you. You spin the pedals but there is no resistance. This is fantastic if you are old and need to loosen up, like using a stationary therapy bike before adding power. Great if you have just overdone some other activity and need to loosen up. Like cleaning requiring bending and kneeling, then you end up stiff. Grab the bike, set the PAS high and loosen back up. 15 minutes of that and you feel much better.
The same is true if you need to keep your heartrate at something less than stupid but still ride where you want. On a torque sensed bike, you might need to add too much of your own power to get what you want and bust the heart rate you have set. The same is true if you bonk easily. You can increase the power and trace through the pedal strokes in order to move lactic acid out of the muscles.
PAS sensing is also great for interval workouts. You can pick a speed on PAS setting, get to that speed and reduce the power greatly for one minute. Try to maintain that speed and then increase the power to rest.
In short, a torque sensed bike acts like a regular bike and you need no changes to handle it. A PAS bike requires some subconscious reprograming of the mind but then doubles as a therapy recovery bike and opens up options for getting as much or as little as you want at any time.
The stock programming is 9, ten percent increases in power. That really sucks because the power jumps at slow speeds is too much. At high speeds, the power requirements from wind resistance climb fast. I have mine reprogrammed for small increases progressing to higher increases at the top end. That feels much more natural and allows me to mix easily with non e bike riders.
I bike three days a week with a group of riders. Average age in the group is about 75 years old. 3/4 ths are on e bikes. Most of the bikes are PAS but we have two people on torque sensed bikes. On the metro paths where we park we have a choice in one direction of easy fairly level terrain. the other direction is lung busting climbs and steep descents. If our group shows up on all e bikes we like to go the hilly route. We find that the torque sensing riders are far less enthusiastic about that choice than the PAS riders. The torque sensing riders are often winded at the end of the ride and often use throttle. Most of the PAS sensed bikes don't even have a throttle. To dangerous with gabby seniors at a stop light.
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Hi, I bought a bafang from china using amazon.co.uk, it took several months and made the mistake of fitting it to the bike before testing. It had 3 faults, a faulty controller, a faulty speed sensor and the pedal assist wouldn't work. After a month of not being able to ride my bike, I had a new controller sent from China but I still had the pedal assist fault. At this stage bought another bafang motor here in the UK with a good track record. Arrived in 7 days, tested it, and fitted it and goes like a dream.Hi everyone - I placed an order on Amazon.com for a 500W Bafang Mid-Drive Kit and it is estimated to arrive anywhere between 3 and 7 weeks from now. I am pretty sure it's coming directly from China. I know Bafang doesn't even have these available on their own site right now, and I confirmed by contacting Bafang directly, that they don't have their own stock of them.
Just wondering if anyone knows of anywhere in the US with these in stock, or if I am just going to have to be patient.
With the second motor kit I was able to eliminate what was wrong with the first faulty motor and it is either the power assist pcb and or white connector or the round magnet senser. I figured by having a spare motor I will have readily available spare parts and can sort out the pedal assist problem at my leisure.
Anyway, the moral is don't buy, IMO, anything from china, because it takes ages to deliver and if it not tested you will have a hard time putting it right. Amazon won't want to help you out because by the time you have realised you been sold a dud you have ran out if warranty time. The chap in China I bought from said he had a repair agent about 80 miles from me but he didn't answer his phone.
The stock programming is 9, ten percent increases in power. That really sucks because the power jumps at slow speeds is too much. At high speeds, the power requirements from wind resistance climb fast. I have mine reprogrammed for small increases progressing to higher increases at the top end. That feels much more natural and allows me to mix easily with non e bike riders.
Ditto. Please post your .el config file.
Ditto. Please post your .el config file.
PedalUma
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- Petaluma, CA
I just looked on eBay. Some good prices. Look for a US flag for US stock. These ship from the Port of LA area. I did not like my one experience with California E-Bikes. But that is not statistically representative of anything. I like the taste of the TS as a personal preference.
Surly. I love them! Nice ride. Just watch out for boost spacing with a BSS02 because of the offset. A Bling Ring could help a lot but getting one a large enough to bring the chain back in on the Bridge Club could rub the extra-wide chain stays. The motor may mount without touching by adding a couple of spacers but then the lowest gear will not be accessible without throwing the chain.
give me a bit and I will go out and pull the file off the bike and take a picture of it
The only things I will buy shipped from China are inexpensive things that I'm willing to take a loss on if it never arrives or isn't as described or defective. One bad experience was from a China based seller with stock in the US. When trying to communicate with them the problem they all of the sudden couldn't comprehend simple English and repeatedly gave nonsensical responses to my messages. Because I caught the problem right away, and because I was persistent with Amazon customer support, including repeating their claim to be the "most customer centric business in the world" to them they eventually, after higher up the chain customer service review, issued a full refund. That was for a $200+ item which is why I pursued it at all. No more purchases above maybe $10-$20 from a China based seller.
