Apples to Apples? Bosch vs. Bafang Ultra

[Gionnirocket]

I'm happy with the Ultra because I have a fat tire bike that inherently has more resistants and drag, therefore it needs the torque. I rode a Felt Outfitter with a Bosch and it simply didn't have enough for that heavy of a bike and it was $2000 more than my Biktrix. Otherwise there's lots of good choices in motors. One size does not fit all.

I concur.

 

[fooferdoggie]

I agree ... Bosch and the big four are geared more towards women.

But then again... why not save a few dollars and just castrate the Ultra with a little tuning?

you mean they don't need a lot of power to feed their power hungry silliness?

 

[Gionnirocket]

you mean they don't need a lot of power to feed their power hungry silliness?

Some may call it silliness... others may call it ability.
If the panties fit. . .

 

[Johnny]

I see @Johnny you have an analytical mind, so I have all the answers for you.

1. I had two 604 Wh (nominal) batteries with me;
2. I went into the 100% Turbo mode after 6 min 56 s when I rode onto an open road;
3. After 33 min 39 seconds of Turbo ride, I had a stop for 31 minutes;
4. Meanwhile, I replaced the battery with 231 Wh left with a spare that initially had 583 Wh;
5. Then I continued the ride for 39 min 52 s, all in 100% Turbo mode.

Below, there are analytical data from BLEvo app for Specialized e-bikes. I think BLEvo reports not the "Motor Power" but rather "Power Draw from the Battery". I estimate the efficiency of the Brose TF/Specialized 1.2s motor to be at 78% (as the actual peak power of that motor is 520 W).
View attachment 75230

If you're interested with the Excel file, I can share it with you.

P.S. Do Bafang motors provide such data?

That is a good data Stefan,

If you have used 664wh of battery then given the time and approximate efficiency you have stated(%78) the motor averaged around ~400W (401.4w ) right ? Respectable but still a good bit under its stated peak power of 520 and close to the stated 350W nominal.

Now,

-I believe winter time in Poland is a bit cold. That will significantly help with cooling,
-Moreover you have ridden at a higher speed which further helps with cooling.
-You have also given a break in between which may have had a positive effect.

Given that it averaged less than its stated peak power and was closer to its nominal, I think your results are expected.

At their peaks (which is a system dependent variable btw) they will heat up hence will not be able to sustain it for a long time. When the temperature increases your motor becomes less efficient which will further increase the temperature etc. and so on. That should be the reason why these motors have heat protection.

People may need to keep similar speeds while climbing and for that an Ultra will be capable of doing so for a good amount of time.

I don't know if stock ultra is giving that data , Brose is quite refined and I really like the data it provides. The upgraded controller for Ultra though should be able to provide similar data.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

-I believe winter time in Poland is a bit cold. That will significantly help with cooling,
-Moreover you have ridden at a higher speed which further helps with cooling.
-You have also given a break in between which may have had a positive effect.

This is about right. The temperature on that ride was around 1 C, which might have helped cooling. I just want you to know I & brother had a very similar ride in the summer but that was a mountain road ride with some inclines exceeding 18%. The ambient temperature was 25 C (77 F) and I was riding in full Turbo mode. I can say the way out was for 12.5 mi with elevation gain of 2200 ft. We actually were in a race with a young competing roadie (he won because he was very strong and was not afraid to ride downhill fast!) The ride duration uphill was about 45 minutes. I had no tool to determine the motor temperature at a glance at that time but the motor never issued any warning.

Let us assume these motors are well designed.

 

[webcurl]

I agree ... Bosch and the big four are geared more towards women.

But then again... why not save a few dollars and just castrate the Ultra with a little tuning?

Mine's bigger than yours and my ebike has a Bosch in it!

 

[TForan]

Mine's bigger than yours and my ebike has a Bosch in it!

So, we are going grade school now ?

 

[webcurl]

So, we are going grade school now ?

With:
I agree ... Bosch and the big four are geared more towards women.
Guess we are

 

[Gionnirocket]

With:
I agree ... Bosch and the big four are geared more towards women.
Guess we are

This discussion went there way before my comment... hence my comment.

 

[McCorby]

This discussion went there way before my comment... hence my comment.

.......says one of the biggest instigators.....lol

 

[Gionnirocket]

.......says one of the biggest instigators.....lol

Guilty as Charged