Amazon Stops Selling Illegal eMotos in CA

[DDBB]

True, where I live in N Michigan, I never see LEO's, even on MUPs. I don't fly by people with throttle only either. The one sticking point is taking the bike to Mackinac Island. I believe the latest rules there allow ebikes if you have a disability and you don't have to "prove" your disability to LEO either. You can then ride your ebike as long as it's class one. I have a bad hip, well documented so if I had to, I COULD prove I have a disability. I've been told that they look for people on ebikes that are not pedalling and bust those people for having a throttle. I've taken my dino bike to the island but just don't think it's worth the hassle to bring the ebike which is a bummer because although the path around the island is relatively flat, the interior of the island has some really steep hills, part of the reason I bought the bike w/ the ultra motor, for steep hills!

 

[EMGX]

True, where I live in N Michigan, I never see LEO's, even on MUPs. I don't fly by people with throttle only either. The one sticking point is taking the bike to Mackinac Island. I believe the latest rules there allow ebikes if you have a disability and you don't have to "prove" your disability to LEO either. You can then ride your ebike as long as it's class one. I have a bad hip, well documented so if I had to, I COULD prove I have a disability. I've been told that they look for people on ebikes that are not pedalling and bust those people for having a throttle. I've taken my dino bike to the island but just don't think it's worth the hassle to bring the ebike which is a bummer because although the path around the island is relatively flat, the interior of the island has some really steep hills, part of the reason I bought the bike w/ the ultra motor, for steep hills!

I loved riding around Mackinac Island when I lived in Michigan or visited. Was planning on riding DALMAC this year then replacing the TSDZ2 mid drive with a triple crankset and riding around the island. Unfortunately I'd have to be back home Sept 8 so that won't be possible this year.

 

[stompandgo]

On my long ride earlier this week, I saw a half dozen CPO's (Community Police Officers) as well as two Rangers (the rail trail section along the National Seashore, which is a National Park). The speed limit is 15mph. Some of the radar based speed limit signs are set to 15mph, others are set to 18mph. I do not know if they have any cameras, Flock or otherwise. The police in my town and nearby towns have been posting on social about the difference between e-bike classes and e-bikes .vs. e-dirt bikes. Clearly not the whole picture, but they are trying to do something about the renegades. Meanwhile, I was passed by an analog rider going 23mph or so on the flats. I'm usually going 16-20mph, slowing for groups, kids, the elderly, recumbents, and dogs.

 

[DDBB]

I believe the e-dirt bike category is now referred to as "e-moto" which includes the surrons etc. It really is a shame that their recklessness is affecting all of us or WILL affect all of us eventually. I have the 1,000 watt motor but you'd never know it by how I ride the bike. I can see how even otherwise prudent adults could get in trouble with it or with ANY ebike for that matter. I'm typically not travelling faster than 20mph. I think my "average" speed according to the display is around 13mph.

 

[PedalUma]

The city limits in my town are about four miles by four miles. Most destinations are within three miles. At 12.5 miles per hour, I can get almost anywhere I have business within 15 minutes. Cars take much longer, spending 3 minutes per red light, with say five lights, then all the traffic and parking. I take trails and routes without lights. I very rarely go 20 mph. That might be on a wide residential street. If I need to go to another town, I just put my lightweight eBike on the train. What I am saying is there is no reason to be doing 50. And eMotos don't even have a rack and panniers, so you couldn't go shopping with one.

State lawmakers want to crack down on 'E-motorcycles' popular among Bay Area kids

Children on electric bikes and motorcycles are a staple on Bay Area roads and trails, but state officials hope to restrict the use of models that can reach dangerous speeds.

www.cbsnews.com

Multiple people cited in e-bike and e-motorcycle crackdown in Folsom

A e-bike and e-motorcycle enforcement crackdown in Folsom resulted in multiple people cited and motor vehicles getting towed, according to police.

www.kcra.com

 

[PCeBiker]

The city limits in my town are about four miles by four miles.

I don't envy you,..
I've got my POS for around town and groceries.

I was going over 65kph down the railroad tracks.

 

[Chargeride]

Its got its own chopping board for when he surfaces with a fish in his mouth

 

[PedalUma]

Rail surfing? It looks like Northern North Dakota flats where the river flows north.

 

[6zfshdb]

Off season surfing.

 

[PCeBiker]

Two tornadoes 🌪 lately, and a thunderstorm to come.

 

[PedalUma]

There is one trail here that is super nice, but it ends 500 feet short. Evidently is a legal thing. If railroad ends their easement they must offer it back to the prior owner and no one knows who that is from 160 years-ago. I am building a 350W front hub-drive. That is very unlike me. It is for a grad student on a tight budget who is healthy, but just wants a little assistance. The battery had to be very small to fit between the low-step top tube and the down tube. It is insane that people would paint it with the same brush as a SirRon. It is class 1 PAS with no throttle. I just need the little controller's bag from Amazon that is arriving in an hour. Little known fact: Amazons had only one breast so they could use a bow. They also invented the bra. That is why bra is singular not plural.

 

[PedalUma]

PedalUma eBikes received a new message.
Conversation Summary:

Hi, I have a Surron, Can you help?

Guest User (1784413594) Jul 18, 2026 at 10:26 PM UTC Hi, Thank you for reaching out. I work on regular bicycles, and Class 1, Class 2, and Class 3, lightweight pedal bicycles. I cannot get within 1,000 meters of any illegal motorcycle. No fingerprints. This crack down following recent deaths is a really big deal. Then little old grandmothers with 350 watts of pedal assistance and no throttle who live on a hill and want to ride with their seven-year-old granddaughter are getting painted with the same brush. The Villagers have their pitchforks out and want to ban everyone from the best and cleanest form of transportation ever devised. Take it to Petaluma Motor Wheel or Last Mile Marin. Anthony at PMW could maybe do a speakeasy side job from his off-road ranch. That said everyone is feeling the police enforcement crack down and liability pressure. Amazon was pushed by the state DA to stop delivering eMotos to California. Police are crushing hundreds of illegal ones that are impounded daily and fined. Parents are getting prison time for reckless child endangerment when minors ride them in public. SirRonster influencer is in major regret mode after his concussion. They are not bikes; they are motorcycles. There is no Venn Diagram overlap. Maybe sell it in Nevada or to a Utah rancher with 4,000 acres and seven wives. He can visit them quickly and quietly at night without the kids all yelling, Daddy. The hammer has met the anvil. Thanks again, Rick

 

[PedalUma]

Subject: Making my macfox x1 go faster



I am writing to inquire about the potential options for increasing the top speed of my Macfox X1 electric bike. While I am thoroughly enjoying the bike, I am interested in unlocking a bit more performance for my daily rides and if ya what items do I buy.

Christian,

I can not. I sympathize. Yet there are the matters of the major crack down by police, the recent deaths, and liability. Take the CHP electric bike safety training class. Get the certificate and put it in a sealed bag under your seat in case you are ever stopped. Have your parents research online on how to alter the speed on your bike. If they do you will be highly limited to where you can ride it. It will not be allowed on the streets, in bike lanes, or on multi-use paths. Your parents will also face prison time for reckless endangerment of a minor. At 12.5 mph you can get almost anywhere in town within 15 minutes.

Rick

 

[PedalUma]

A while ago I mentioned a kid who brought in a bike with a botched install of a BBS02 with a broken motor. When he picked up his bike he did not bring a helmet, so I lent him one. When looking at it just now it has a tear and a dent. The mom mentioned that last year he broke his snowboarding helmet in two in a crash. I feel for the kid but obviously my lending him a helmet saved him from drooling in a wheelchair for the rest of his life. And he wanted me to jailbreak his bike. What if I did but did not lend a helmet?

 

[DDBB]

I always wear a helmet as do most but it amazes me how we grew up in the 60's and 70's with no head protection. On bikes and on the ski slopes. After some of the facial injuries I've seen from ebikes, I'm half tempted to wear my full face mtc helmet

 

[David42000]

That person has an EBR a reaction score of 2. Basically no one responds or cares. Cursor over that avatar to see it. Outliers sometimes happen. It is the nature of things. What exactly is the specific question? Is it about illegal eMotos being hated, impounded, and crushed? I love @Gionnirocket 's animations, still not knowing how he pulls it off. My reaction score is 9,900+. I am all for David's two cents here. Keep at it. Maybe someone will react in a positive way, someday.

While I created this profile in 2020, I've only recently started making posts, so it is not like I've only gotten 2 reactions in six years. I've only started now because this is a crucial time to begin to fight the legislation legally. I'm not here for popularity, just to make sure the information is available to those who want to take it seriously. I confess I do not understand how near the whole board that's interacted with me is so opposed to legal information. If I never get more than a six (up from two! woo-hoo!) reaction score, I don't really care as long as there is just one who benefits. Every legal point I've made is highly accurate. I'm disappointed in how little people seem to care about legal solutions while somewhat aware of a legal problem. I think the board has lost sight of civility in a major way. Tracking down the forum rules is not easy here, but the first one is "Be friendly."

It is neither the case that no one responds or cares. It's people engaging with half-baked understandings of the law they have no real clue about finding out they cannot win a legal argument with me. Not that I am never wrong, just no-one has an argument that actually shows I am wrong. I wouldn't dare contradict you in shop talk unless I really really knew what I was talking about, and if I did, and you realized your mistake, you have the humility to admit it and so do I. People are so conditioned by industry manipulation of the regulatoiry concepts that their worldview is shocked when someone comes along and clarifies. Cognitive dissonance.

Here's the two threads gionnirocket thinks are so important to insult me over, pretending he knows something about it that he cannot articulate: https://forums.electricbikereview.c...d-e-bikes-alike-is-not-a-credible-fear.59287/ (okay, I've looked for the first instance and am not immediately finding it.

Here's a thread I commented in. Here, on page 2, 2 posts down from yours, I made a post about why 1 watt might be important after all, and note--becasue NONE of the internet "State-by-State Guide to e-Bike laws" ever include the motor power rating, whether it is "less than 750 watts" "no more than" or "averaging." People online who want to figure out what is going on have no way to do it except to figure out the statute number. PeopleForBikes conceals this watts info in their guide and of course don't include the statute numbers either. This post is about the only place on the internet you can find those details. It took me a long time manually verifying each state and categorizing them to get it done and the only reason I even did it was to be helpful to others. Now I notice my statute list is incomplete, there's only 48. Sigh. Now I have to figure which ones I missed.

Are 750 watt ebikes actually legal?

I live in Ohio and the law states ebikes must have a motor LESS than 750 watts. This is also the same as the federal law, and the same wording for ebikes when it comes to that new tax refund for ebikes. So does that mean, an ebike with a motor rated exactly 750 watts is technically illegal...

forums.electricbikereview.com

https://forums.electricbikereview.com/threads/resist-all-negative-thinking.52076/ Here's an apt quote from someone who has not been friendly at all toward me. Last I knew, mschwett was refusing to have a civil conversation in favor of calling me a sovereign citizen.

well said. this forum, and one other bike forum that i frequent have a small minority who can be very unpleasant at times. they’re easy enough to ignore - the world has enough unpleasantness in it, no need to trouble one’s self with what someone posts on an internet forum. everyone here has access to the internet and an electric bicycle (and likely much, much more) which means we don’t have too much to complain about in the big picture.

it is a mark of character to be able to have an intelligent, civil conversation with someone that you disagree with, as it is to understand the limitations of your own knowledge and experience.

Chargeride interacts and stands in stark contrast, remaining civil. Here's a comment from the same thread.

What I notice the most is mob rule, once a person is targeted, they try to dehumanise them which brings in more personal attacks, then they start feeding off each other to post the most horrible responses.
They will start to invent an entire back story for the person, right down to accusing them of serious crimes, then that becomes the truth.
I'm sure it's a mirror of a million conflicts and genocides.
We must remember, everything we write on the internet, everything we consume is being harvested and analysed by academia with super computers.
I fear their solutions might be worse than the disease.

What's funny about this thread is a guy named Stefan appears to have been getting unfairly attacked and he posted the very best comment about human behavior in the thread. Sometimes I think it's just about not-so-smart people attacking people who seem smarter. It's like classroom bullying where the most intelligent student gets bullied. The fake backstory is being developed about me.

Funnily enough, it has a little to do with the internet. It is all about the human nature.

Only in 1831, a German philosopher Arthur Schopenhauer published the book "Eristic Dialectic: The Art of Winning an Argument". Even if scholars met face to face in those times, they used many dishonest arguments just to win a discussion. Schopenhauer listed as many as 38 ways of winning the discussion, and sadly these are the same as used today on the internet.

The Art of Being Right - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The ultimate stratagem #38, Argumentum Ad Personam (become personal, insulting, rude) is the proof the person resorting to it has lost the discussion. In modern terms, such a person deserves an Ignore. Have you people noticed Argumentum Ad Personam has become the only modus operandi for several users (trolls, stalkers) here on EBR Fora?

Jabberwocky gave me a hard time but engaged enough I think he might come around. Strangely I started liking the Jabberwock despite his penchant for mockery. I thought his attack calling me a Don Juan tilting at windmills was hilarious since he'd been defending the windmills.

I'll be fine. Forum popularity is the last thing on my mind--I have no desire to be popular when popular might be the same thing as displaying the worst of human behavior. I know about the ignore button.

 

[DDBB]

Is this the right room for an argument?

 

[Gionnirocket]

Someone reminds me of this. . .

View this content on Instagram

View this content on Instagram

 

[RunForTheHills]

While I created this profile in 2020, I've only recently started making posts, so it is not like I've only gotten 2 reactions in six years. I've only started now because this is a crucial time to begin to fight the legislation legally. I'm not here for popularity, just to make sure the information is available to those who want to take it seriously. I confess I do not understand how near the whole board that's interacted with me is so opposed to legal information. If I never get more than a six (up from two! woo-hoo!) reaction score, I don't really care as long as there is just one who benefits. Every legal point I've made is highly accurate. I'm disappointed in how little people seem to care about legal solutions while somewhat aware of a legal problem. I think the board has lost sight of civility in a major way. Tracking down the forum rules is not easy here, but the first one is "Be friendly."

It is neither the case that no one responds or cares. It's people engaging with half-baked understandings of the law they have no real clue about finding out they cannot win a legal argument with me. Not that I am never wrong, just no-one has an argument that actually shows I am wrong. I wouldn't dare contradict you in shop talk unless I really really knew what I was talking about, and if I did, and you realized your mistake, you have the humility to admit it and so do I. People are so conditioned by industry manipulation of the regulatoiry concepts that their worldview is shocked when someone comes along and clarifies. Cognitive dissonance.

I hope you take this as a constructive suggestion and not an attack: Stop writing walls of text. I am sure you spent a lot of time researching your ideas and want to back them up, but people are just going to skim it or not read it at all if it is more than a paragraph or two. Present your ideas in small chunks that people can read and respond to without having to break it down. You can then respond with the backup material to support your position. If you want a back and forth conversation, you have to give other people a chance to talk.

 

[Chargeride]

I read every word.