Another new TQ motor: hpr40
- Thread starter Calcoaster
- Start date
Calcoaster
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
Yeah, I’m questioning the accuracy of the reporting of the BMC weight. The recently released non powered top tier team machine is 6.6 kg (BMC website number) and the hpr40 motor, battery and cables are claimed to weigh 2.7 kg. That makes 9.3kg or 20.46 lb. I’m thinking the Prototype ebike either isn’t road ready or its weight was not reported accurately. Still, 21 lb or so for an assisted road bike is pretty impressive!yes. insane!!! the lightest mainstream road bike frame on the market is the s-works aethos at 1.3lb for the frame. a fairly aggressive high end build (dura ace, one piece cockpit, light and shallow wheels etc) is around 13.5lb. even if the frame didn’t have to get heavier (have to imagine it would, a bit) that would correspond to a 19.5lb e-bike with the HPR40. i wonder what BMC did to find another pound, almost! looks like a normal 2xx drivetrain, etc.
i guess you could save the di2 battery and the bottom bracket, that’s .25 lb
stompandgo
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
That's exactly what they do. Remember, these main batteries are small.i guess you could save the di2 battery and the bottom bracket, that’s .25 lb
Calcoaster
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
I just got a response from TQ to an email question I had sent them in April that included some rather disappointing news about the Hpr40. I had read a posting from a trek rider (with a TQ HPR50 powered domane+ slr) saying his bike store told him not to ride with the assist off because it would damage the motor. I didn’t think that could be true but I emailed TQ with that question, saying I rode a BMC with the HPR50, often with assist off, and wanted to hear from them about the issue. That email was in April. This morning I opened my email and saw a reply from TQ. They said (as I expected), no riding the HPR50 without assist is fine. BUT they added that “just the hpr40 is harmed when you drive with the assistance off.”
I know the hpr40 connects directly to the chainring without a clutch, like a non powered bike, which makes it unique. The hpr50 has a minimum setting of 25% assist with 30W max, which gives a very subtle assist, almost hard to feel but definitely helping. Maybe the hpr40 will have its own software and allow for less than this so it can be ridden at times with (almost) no assist. Seems like the target customer would want that.
Here’s the TQ reply to my email:
no, that is misinformation you can ride without assistance. [answering my original question about the hpr50]
Just the HPR40 is harmed when you drive with the assistance off.
Viele Grüße vom TQ E-Bike Service Team
I know the hpr40 connects directly to the chainring without a clutch, like a non powered bike, which makes it unique. The hpr50 has a minimum setting of 25% assist with 30W max, which gives a very subtle assist, almost hard to feel but definitely helping. Maybe the hpr40 will have its own software and allow for less than this so it can be ridden at times with (almost) no assist. Seems like the target customer would want that.
Here’s the TQ reply to my email:
no, that is misinformation you can ride without assistance. [answering my original question about the hpr50]
Just the HPR40 is harmed when you drive with the assistance off.
Viele Grüße vom TQ E-Bike Service Team
mschwett
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
that would be a deal breaker for me - and i’d imagine most other road riders if there is drag when the motor is off, or if it can’t be ridden with the motor truly off.
haven’t seen this mentioned in any of the early reviews.
Calcoaster
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
Same here. I emailed TQ back asking for specifics on the hpr40 no-assist limitations. I’ll post here if I hear back. In the meantime my hpr50 does everything I want. There’s always the next bike to think about, though!
stompandgo
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
That's disappointing. The bikes that I'd think that are targeting the HPR40 are lightweight bikes that would want to be ridden unassisted when the battery runs out.
Calcoaster
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
Good point, I didn’t even think of that scenario- a long ride that depletes the battery but you still have miles to go to get home. I’m wondering if the TQ caution I got is actually accurate. I hope to hear more details from them.
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It sounds a bit weird to be honest with such a low weight system as this the whole point is to ride 60 or 70% unassisted saving battery for hills and headwind. Might be worth asking Canyon. Think they have one of those chat bots you can text.
Jeremy McCreary
Bought it anyway
- Region
- USA
- City
- Carlsbad, CA
The other reason to ride in OFF: It's a valuable option to match your mood and exercise goals to the ride you find yourself on. Great for slowing down to smell the roses or keep pace with slower riders. Plus, no motor noise whatsoever. Plus, a more direct and in some ways more satisfying connection between rider, bike, and road — but of course, you guys know all about that.
Wouldn't buy an ebike now that couldn't be ridden comfortably in OFF without motor drag.
Wouldn't buy an ebike now that couldn't be ridden comfortably in OFF without motor drag.
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Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
Yes, 45 km/h in the United States.
mschwett
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
looking back at their press statements, note the following
this is super sketch!!! of course it doesn’t have drag when coasting, it’s a mid drive. the chain and pedals aren’t turning when you’re coasting. the fact that they didn’t say “no/minimal drag when off or above the cut off” is really suspicious.
this is super sketch!!! of course it doesn’t have drag when coasting, it’s a mid drive. the chain and pedals aren’t turning when you’re coasting. the fact that they didn’t say “no/minimal drag when off or above the cut off” is really suspicious.
Gionnirocket
Well-Known Unidentified Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Y. O.
When you have a motor that you can set the max cadence assistance for each PAS so you can have the motor fade out whenever you want. Especially useful for exercise when you get into a gears hi cadence sweat spot and it's easy to pedal.
But EU locked down 25kmh wouldn't know anything about that. And yes, no motor drag when off.
But I love reading about that blissfully ignorant.
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Calcoaster
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
I followed up with TQ asking very specific questions to be sure I was clear, and the same support person replied. I asked how that could be true that the hpr40 would be damaged riding with no support. My examples were: depleting the battery on a long ride but still miles to go, riding over the cutoff speed, and choosing to turn support off during parts of a ride. The answer was the same - yes, the motor will be damaged.
Still, I can’t imagine how that could be true and I asked her if she would pass my question on to another tech for confirmation. She wrote back and said she would not pass it on because it is a known fact.
So if you buy a Canyon or a Ridley light weight road bike in Europe you better not ride it over 15mph or you’ll kill the motor? Sorry, but that’s hard to believe that TQ would be so shortsighted. I sure won’t be an early adopter though.
Still, I can’t imagine how that could be true and I asked her if she would pass my question on to another tech for confirmation. She wrote back and said she would not pass it on because it is a known fact.
So if you buy a Canyon or a Ridley light weight road bike in Europe you better not ride it over 15mph or you’ll kill the motor? Sorry, but that’s hard to believe that TQ would be so shortsighted. I sure won’t be an early adopter though.
Gionnirocket
Well-Known Unidentified Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Y. O.
. . .
mschwett
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
i just can’t believe this! but whether it’s damaging it or not, i can’t imagine it feels that great to be spinning the geared motor with every pedal stroke!
Tried the chatbot at Canyon. It said it didn't understand the question! It's late here so perhaps the humans have knocked off for the night and hit the pub. Was a bit nervous in asking in case 2 hours later I find I've ordered a Canyon bike...
Jeremy McCreary
Bought it anyway
- Region
- USA
- City
- Carlsbad, CA
Just tell your partner EBR made you do it. They'll understand. The sofa's not that bad once you get used to it.
Henny Youngman bumped into a friend on the sidewalk...
"Hey, Henny, why the long face?"
"Oh, my wife cut me off for a month again."
"Wow, that's a long time!"
"It could be worse. I know some guys she's cut off completely."
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