Who is Making These 'Open-Mold' Generic Non-proprietary e-bike Frames?

[Asher]

I noticed the QuietKat/Jeep branded e-bike has nearly the same frame as the Ride1Up 700. Of course, the Ride1Up is front suspension only, the Jeep full suspension; the former is a hub motor and the latter a mid-drive.

But otherwise they appear to be from the same maker. Who? Are these frames modular enough that you can put in whatever you want?

Sometimes I've seen people pooh-pooh non-proprietary frames, but in the case of Ride1Up, it looks well done *and* evidently enables a great price. If you're going to have a bunch of small e-bike brands, then open-mold frames are pivotal to making it affordable - and providing a variety of sizes (though Ride1Up doesn't).

Aventon also appears to use generic frames.

 

[Deleted member 4210]

Aventon is not using generic frames. The welds are quite different (better and smoothed) and when you have the frames side by side you'll notice other contour differences. Not possible to discern from the photos. There are a number of CAD drawings that are out there for the bike industry where the Chinese can copy the basic outline geometry. But there is engineering involved in designing thickness of frame, actual tube shape, determining material properties, etc.

 

[Deleted member 4210]

Btw, 'generic' frames are often sold as 'one size' fits all.( That would be R1Up brand. ) You HAVE to do real engineering design and FEA, to build multiple frame sizes and to maintain frame structural integrity, Get stack and reach correct, along with other factors. Aventon offers their models in multiple frame sizes.

 

[Asher]

Btw, 'generic' frames are often sold as 'one size' fits all.( That would be R1Up brand. ) You HAVE to do real engineering design and FEA, to build multiple frame sizes and to maintain frame structural integrity, Get stack and reach correct, along with other factors. Aventon offers their models in multiple frame sizes.

Thanks for the comments. Agree that engineering has to be done for each size, but there's no reason generic frames can't be sold in multiple sizes, as effectively a series of independent generic frames.

The Reventons looked a bit like American Flyers, but I don't personally know. https://www.americanflyerbikes.com/2020-e-wave

It will be an interesting battle to see if generic frames dominate, especially at the $1-2k price level. Ride1Up has much better value IMO, though I haven't ridden one. Fenders, rack, Schwalbe tires, ~700 wh, integrated lights. Only thing missing is multiple sizes :/.

 

[Deleted member 4210]

Thanks for the comments. Agree that engineering has to be done for each size, but there's no reason generic frames can't be sold in multiple sizes, as effectively a series of independent generic frames.

The Reventons looked a bit like American Flyers, but I don't personally know. https://www.americanflyerbikes.com/2020-e-wave

Well what you refer to as generic frames are what the Chinese call copying frames. They are good at copying drawings and reproducing metal configurations where no real engineering is done. These generic frame factories are all over China. These small importers like R1Up can basically find any factory to copy a frame design they like, and sell them a bunch of ebikes, put their logo on,and spec the components they want on them. The CAD drawings are only generic outlines, not engineering. Rad is doing the same thing as R1UP, many other players like Ecomotion, AddMotor, and on and on. They all just sell one size fits all. Another reason they do this is if a supplier they're using starts hiking prices or goes belly up, it's easy to find another factory who can copy and produce the one frame.

Aventon owns their own factory and so it's entirely different story regarding design, engineering, QC, and commitment.

 

[Asher]

Is there any evidence of these generic, allegedly copy paste bikes structurally failing?

Lol I had no idea RadPower doesn't offer multiple sizes . For a small company like Ride1Up, I understand, but for a company like Rad that's doing way more volume, pretty funny but sad. And the controller just sits on the seat tube...

I just checked their site, eg https://www.radpowerbikes.com/products/radcity-electric-commuter-bike

 

[Asher]

Uh looks like Aventon is about to use the same frame lol

New models for 2020 Aventon Level & Sinch

BRAIN are reporting Aventon are offering two new ebike models, the Level (Class 3) and Sinch (Class 2, fat folder), available from February. Source: https://www.bicycleretailer.com/new-products/2020/01/10/aventon-will-release-two-new-e-bike-models#.XhipE0dKiUk

electricbikereview.com

 

[Alex M]

Well what you refer to as generic frames are what the Chinese call copying frames. They are good at copying drawings and reproducing metal configurations where no real engineering is done. These generic frame factories are all over China. These small importers like R1Up can basically find any factory to copy a frame design they like, and sell them a bunch of ebikes, put their logo on,and spec the components they want on them. The CAD drawings are only generic outlines, not engineering. Rad is doing the same thing as R1UP, many other players like Ecomotion, AddMotor, and on and on.

So the only difference for not including Aventon in this generic class would be 3 different sizes and better welding seams?
Btw, for the sake of fairness, Ride1up frame is similar to Aventon Level, not to Aventon Pace or Jeep.

 

[Alex M]

Is there any evidence of these generic, allegedly copy paste bikes structurally failing?

Lol I had no idea RadPower doesn't offer multiple sizes . For a small company like Ride1Up, I understand, but for a company like Rad that's doing way more volume, pretty funny but sad.

Albeit generic, they are rather different from each other. I think that RAD frame it is not likely to fail, given that much metal.
To avoid multiple sizes, RAD use a simple trick - they make it small, at least some their bikes. Rider can extend the post up to the limit or get a longer post.

 

[FlatSix911]

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