What's it like to ride a fat bike?

[tomjasz]

Nice find!

 

[SDDave]

I had to try the 4" to see if they were something I could use with my 80%+ pavement riding style. I consider that idea a mistake. I can't stand the noise of the knobby style tires on pavement at all (silence is golden here). When I switched to 4" Origin 8's with pavement tread, I experienced the self steering issue I had read about (spooky might be an understatement). Sure you can eliminate/control it with air pressure, but at the pressure necessary to control that, you've pretty much lost the reason you went 4" - the ride! Bottom line, for my purposes, the fattys were a mistake. Converting to 27.5+ which is a good rolling resistance/ride compromise - for me anyway.

Bike currently has 26x3" Kenda Flame tires, which aren't too bad. I'd just like something with a little less rolling resistance. FWIW

I am at a loss, I have not experienced that on 4” tires on my fat bike. From 10 to 20 psi.

 

[AHicks]

I am at a loss, I have not experienced that on 4” tires on my fat bike. From 10 to 20 psi.

That would be a good thing!

If you are running the knobby type tires that come stock with most 4" bikes, you aren't going to experience the self steering. It's not until you switch to a pavement tire you're going to see that. Fingers crossed you don't have that experience.

 

[Tom@WashDC]

I've been riding a Fat Bike configured with a mid-drive, and 4.5" tires for eight months. I would never go back to regular tires. My wife rides an Aventon Level with 27.5" X 2.2" tires. The Level is an excellent bike, but I am trying to convince my wife to go to the Fat Tire bike as I believe it is much safer when transitioning to different road, trail, gravel, grass, surfaces, and it is a much softer ride. I ride at 20 PSi. and it feels like I'm floating. The fat tires allow you to really go anywhere you want, over any surface with ease.

 

[AHicks]

I've been riding a Fat Bike configured with a mid-drive, and 4.5" tires for eight months. I would never go back to regular tires. My wife rides an Aventon Level with 27.5" X 2.2" tires. The Level is an excellent bike, but I am trying to convince my wife to go to the Fat Tire bike as I believe it is much safer when transitioning to different road, trail, gravel, grass, surfaces, and it is a much softer ride. I ride at 20 PSi. and it feels like I'm floating. The fat tires allow you to really go anywhere you want, over any surface with ease.

Make and model of tires? Knobby design? Noisey as speed builds?

 

[TOOSLOW]

I've been riding a Fat Bike configured with a mid-drive, and 4.5" tires for eight months. I would never go back to regular tires. My wife rides an Aventon Level with 27.5" X 2.2" tires. The Level is an excellent bike, but I am trying to convince my wife to go to the Fat Tire bike as I believe it is much safer when transitioning to different road, trail, gravel, grass, surfaces, and it is a much softer ride. I ride at 20 PSi. and it feels like I'm floating. The fat tires allow you to really go anywhere you want, over any surface with ease.

Holy Crap, 20 psi ? Running 6psi at +10c, Works out to 5.2 psi at 70f. Jumbo Jim 26" x 4.4. Tubes in.

20psi seems wayyyyy to hard.

 

[Tom@WashDC]

Probably is. I just recently got some Kenda Juggernaut Pros, and started them at 25psi. Now riding at 20. The specs say 5-30 psi. I'm going to drop the pressure to 10 psi tomorrow, and see how it goes.

 

[Tom@WashDC]

Dammit, been riding since March without a flat tire at 20 PSI on my Fatty. Lowered the tire pressure to 10 PSI, and my riding buddy on his new Sondors Rockstar lowered his tire pressure to 15 psi from 25. We both got pinch flats. Much softer ride than the 20psi I was riding, but pinch flats are a hazard at that pressure I guess. My Slime was not effectual. Got me 4 miles, had to walk the last mile home.

 

[ElevenAD]

Dammit, been riding since March without a flat tire at 20 PSI on my Fatty. Lowered the tire pressure to 10 PSI, and my riding buddy on his new Sondors Rockstar lowered his tire pressure to 15 psi from 25. We both got pinch flats. Much softer ride than the 20psi I was riding, but pinch flats are a hazard at that pressure I guess. My Slime was not effectual. Got me 4 miles, had to walk the last mile home.

I dont know how you guys even ride fat tire bikes with 20 PSI! I ride my buddies at 20 PSI and its just too mushy and bouncy, i cant go below 25psi and i could not even imagine 10PSI, instant flat imo unless your very light or ridding on sand.

 

[Jon A]

Uhm, no. It's bouncy because you're running such high pressures. Higher pressures make the tires bouncier over bumps.

If you're of a reasonable weight, there is absolutely no issue running in the 10 psi range, even really fast over rock-garden type terrain on a well set up fatbike. Now if you're a really heavy guy, the fatbike is fully rigid, you aren't running good offroad tires and you are running tubes...then yes, you will need to run much higher than optimum pressures to avoid pinch-flats--just as you would if the tires were skinny. Ride, handling and traction will suffer greatly. That is not "how a fatbike handles," it's how that particular fatbike handles. If the thread was "what's it like to ride a mountain bike?" I wouldn't feel descriptions of the shortcomings of a fully rigid bike running street tires with tubes would be representative of that question either.

The best solution for pinch flats is to stop running tubes. Virtually no mountain bike riders much above the Walmart bike level run tubes anymore. I'm not sure why people think somehow the same rules wouldn't apply to fatbikes if they want to ride them the same way. If you run them, if the bike has no suspension, if you're a heavy guy....you'll need to run higher pressures on that bike. But that has nothing to do with "fatbikes" in the general sense.

 

[Tom@WashDC]

Yes, I know tubeless is the way to go. He had his flat after going over a large rock. I got my flat due to a glancing side blow from a rock that resulted in a tire sidewall pinch flat, and gave me a tube pinch flat, a double whammy! It sure felt nice riding at the lower tire pressure though.

 

[theemartymac]

I'm a big guy with 2 fat bikes, and I run 20 psi front, and 25 rear on my commuter bike because I run fast with cargo. On my city bike, I run 18/20 and don't stress about it. Makes for the best compromise of rolling resistance and cush for me. Because I'm a big guy, I wouldn't go below 15. These bikes are bloody heavy too. So while the non-ebike guys on fatties can get away with 10 psi and less off-road, I wouldn't try that on a 90lb ebike.

 

[AHicks]

Clearly the terrain you're riding is going to have something to do with the most practical air pressure for your own purposes. Regarding pinch flats, can't you feel the tire bottoming out on the rim previous to that? That's a WAY no-no signal here. That said, I'm more likely going to have that happen on a break in the pavement than I am a rock, so I have no experience to draw on regarding a rocky trail.

I'm running my current 3" tires (Kenda Flame's) in the high teens as well (Marty and I are both PLUS size weights). After a lot of messing around with different pressures (something I enjoy doing when switching to a new tire), that seemed like the best compromise between ride and minimized self steering (I ride mostly pavement with some grass, sand, and packed single track).

Noteworthy maybe, but on my "city" bikes, I'm running 18-20 psi in the front, with 25-30 in the rear on Schwalbe Super Moto-X 2.4" tires. Noteworthy because that's not much more than I would be running in the fatties. Way better rolling resistance (compared to any street tread fatty I'm familiar with), and a great ride. Only downside (for my purposes) is the difference in flotation available. -Al

 

[Jon A]

So while the non-ebike guys on fatties can get away with 10 psi and less off-road, I wouldn't try that on a 90lb ebike.

Certainly true to some extent, but not as much as some think as it's often much smaller than differences in rider weight. Last year when I was over 200 lbs, I put more weight on the tires of my 30 lb fatbike than I currently do with my 60 lb E-Fat. Sure, I'll err on the side of maybe 1-2 psi more on the E if rocky terrain is on the menu, but that's about it. 1-2 psi makes a big difference with fatbike tires.

I'm running 18-20 psi in the front, with 25-30 in the rear on Schwalbe Super Moto-X 2.4" tires. Noteworthy because that's not much more than I would be running in the fatties.

Noteworthy and should be red-flag raising that you'd run a tire with many times the volume at the same pressure. As tire volume increases, optimum pressure decreases, that's just the way it works. You won't get the same pressure recommendations for a 2.0 gravel or XC tire as you will a 2.5" tire--the smaller tire needs to be run at much higher pressures. Much less the idea that the ideal pressures would be the same for a 4" tire as a 2.8." Your desire for a silent tire on pavement keeps you from trying most of the good fatbike tires. There's nothing wrong with that, you just have to keep in mind the results you have with the "street" tires are not applicable to the tires most commonly used on non-city/commuter fatbikes. Many of those tires aren't even rated to take more than 20 psi, much less 30.

 

[AHicks]

I get what you're saying Jon. Those thoughts aren't lost on me. The pressures I'm running/getting away with have been experimented with extensively. The first bike I put them on had Schwalbe Marathons that needed 50psi at minimum, and I generally rode them at 60-65psi. They rode like roller skates on a brick road....

I'm very careful to mention the surfaces I run on most frequently whenever I mention any of this as I don't want to mislead anyone. I'm never bottoming out on the rims which is something I play close attention to. No history of flats of any type. The sidewalls are not running collapsed like a flat tire, and the rolling resistance/handling response doesn't have that heavy fat tire feeling at all. All this while getting the same distance on a charge as I was getting using the 60psi Marathons. This bike had the tires changed. All else is equal!

My thought is that these Schwalbe Super Moto-X tires might be a little different tire design, though I don't know that for sure. Thinking maybe like comparing a radial tire to a bias belted tire. Completely different animals.

If you ever get a chance to try a set, or any similar sized (2.25-2.5"+-) of the Schwalbe balloon type, I'd be interested in hearing your impressions, and the results of your experiments running them at various pressures....

I THINK there are more guys riding fat tires on the street (and just dealing with the noise) than you might be thinking of. -Al

 

[TOOSLOW]

Any of you guys commenting actually ride a fat e, and off asphalt? Or your just putting in your 2 cents?
I run a full suspension fat ebike, with 1 kilowatt of juice with a weight of roughly 65lbs. (bike)
I pound through the toughest of rooted trails, black single track, jumps, stairs, up and down, yada yada and more yada. Running in turbo mode 98% of the time. Jumbo jims with tubes. That sealing gunk stuff is not for me. Not interested in the mess, plugged valves, cost, and seasonal tire changes just compound the problem.
Running tubeless is mostly about the weight, not pinch flats.
And in my thousands of miles, only had one pinch flat because I was lazy and nailed a curb.
I run anywhere from 5-6 psi adjusting for ambient air temps, winter and summer. At first I resisted these low psi tire advocates, but after running, and pounding through all kinds of terrain, I slowly dropped psi until I finally realized they, the low pressure guys, were right all along. Buy a accugage 0-15 psi, that's all you fat tire guys will ever need.

Now after that rant, I think I have calmed down now.

 

[Tom@WashDC]

Any of you guys commenting actually ride a fat e, and off asphalt? Or your just putting in your 2 cents?
I run a full suspension fat ebike, with 1 kilowatt of juice with a weight of roughly 65lbs. (bike)
I pound through the toughest of rooted trails, black single track, jumps, stairs, up and down, yada yada and more yada. Running in turbo mode 98% of the time. Jumbo jims with tubes. That sealing gunk stuff is not for me. Not interested in the mess, plugged valves, cost, and seasonal tire changes just compound the problem.
Running tubeless is mostly about the weight, not pinch flats.
And in my thousands of miles, only had one pinch flat because I was lazy and nailed a curb.
I run anywhere from 5-6 psi adjusting for ambient air temps, winter and summer. At first I resisted these low psi tire advocates, but after running, and pounding through all kinds of terrain, I slowly dropped psi until I finally realized they, the low pressure guys, were right all along. Buy a accugage 0-15 psi, that's all you fat tire guys will ever need.

Now after that rant, I think I have calmed down now.

Ha ha, glad you calmed down Tooslow! I ride my Luna BBSHD Fatty (hardtail) almost every day. 50% on paved bike trails, 50% on grassy banks, gravel, and dirt trails. I've only ever had a pinch flat when encountering very rocky surfaces for an expended period of time. I've never had a pinch flat that wasn't caused by some serious hard edged rocky terrain. It has been 1200 miles since my last flat, so I cannot complain. I will go tubeless on my new dual suspension DIY Fat bike build that I'm working on presently.

 

[Jon A]

I THINK there are more guys riding fat tires on the street (and just dealing with the noise) than you might be thinking of. -Al

I think you're probably right about that on this board. Lots of commuters and road riders here. It's usually skewed quite severely the other way on many other fatbike boards though--some never ride on pavement with theirs. But a lot do both and typically feel their offroad setup works just fine on the road. Much like a mountain bike--yes it's louder and less efficient, but it still rides just fine. I liken it to driving a big 4X4 on the road. Sure, it's louder and less efficient...but it works just fine--cruising down the road on pavement isn't a difficult thing to do. Some gladly make the tradeoffs so they have the capability to go offroad with the same vehicle.

E-Bikes have really opened up that possibility for a lot of people. No longer do you need a 20 lb road bike with tiny rock hard tires to make a long commute without killing your legs. With E assist, many are able to use their offroad MTB/Fat for double duty where it wouldn't have been practical in the past.

Any of you guys commenting actually ride a fat e, and off asphalt?

I do.

Just went on a 20 mile pavement ride yesterday. I was using these tires for that:

8 psi front, 10 psi rear. Rides and handles beautifully. But yes, those tires are loud on pavement. Feels wonderful all the way up to 38 MPH--I'd actually feel pretty safe at that speed if I didn't have to worry about a car pulling out in front of me. Thankfully I now have a really bright headlight with a blinking mode so people can see me coming!

Somebody who appears to have deleted his post, noted he was 240 lbs, carried 20 lbs of gear so that low pressures wouldn't be appropriate for him. Even though he deleted his post, I think the subject of weight is worthy of further discussion.

Many big guys particularly like fatbikes because the tires are so well suited to carrying more weight. With the larger volume and contact patches, you gain a lot of weight carrying capacity per psi of pressure added--or conversely, adding a lot of weight doesn't change the tire sag/contact patch as much as it will on a smaller tire. If you use my bike above as a baseline here's how that would go. The bike and I total about 220 lbs, so that comes out to having about 25 square inches of contact patch on the ground (rounding off). If I was going to let him borrow the bike for a day, to set it up for carrying 100 lbs more weight, I'd add only 4 psi to each tire--12F/14R--and he would be golden. There would be zero worries at all. Adding air to the shock and fork would actually be the bigger deal. So a 0-15 psi gauge would still work just fine, and my tires would stay well under their max rating of 20 psi.

Note 8/10 psi is just my default pavement/safe from rim-strike in rocky terrain starting point, I typically lower it from there offroad depending upon conditions. Where rim strikes aren't a worry I'll cut it down a couple psi...on powdery snow I'll cut it in half as a starting point... If I was commuting on pavement on a daily basis, I may try a couple psi more to see if I could get a measurable increase in efficiency (especially if my battery was barely making it the distance) but there's certainly no need from a ride/handling standpoint. Anyway, you all get the idea. Here are a couple threads where lots of big guys share the pressures they use (most using typical offroad tires):

Clydesdales on Fat Bikes?

www.mtbr.com

How to determine tire pressure for fat bike tires?

www.mtbr.com

 

[TOOSLOW]

NO self respecting hardcore fat biker has a kickstand on their rig.
And, do you you ever ride that rig? Or just polish it while you watch the afternoon soaps?

 

[Jon A]

And, do you you ever ride that rig? Or just polish it while you watch the afternoon soaps?

From just the last few days:

The "easy" side of the range to ride (no sagebrush):

The river bottom--posing different challenges:

NO self respecting hardcore fat biker has a kickstand on their rig.

But of course in the pics above, I was not a "fat biker." I was a hunter. Just one of the many uses for this extremely versatile tool. It took a decent amount of effort to put a kickstand on this bike and I LOVE! it. NO self respecting hardcore person who uses his bike for anything other than a toy will enjoy being without one. I'd just love to have to lay the bike on the ground, pointing the rifle in an unsafe direction every time I get off it (which is often). Even when not hunting, you would not believe how much nicer it is to use every time you need to go through a gate.

For me, this bike is far too useful and versatile a tool to only use as a "toy." And when I want to, I can yank off the kickstand in about 30 seconds, the rack in about 1 minute and the extra battery in about another minute knocking 10 lbs or so off it. Roughly the same amount of time one spends adjusting the tire pressure for different conditions. Can you not turn a wrench?

It would be fun to take you on a ride with me sometime and watch you try to keep up. Some things you learn when you want to get somewhere offroad that isn't on a "bicycle trail" built for bicycles--going uphill is usually the bigger challenge where lots of power helps, getting through sections that can't be pedaled will make you wish for a throttle, and if you want to cover large distances in a reasonable amount of time, lots of battery capacity is needed. Of course the way I have the bike set up, one doesn't need to use any of those things when he wants to be a "purist" on a "ride for fun."