Policy on Sharing Promotions and Pricing Information

[Admin]

Hi friendly forum people! This message is for EVERYONE who joins and posts here... Ebike owners, ebike shops, and ebike manufacturers. The discussion of promotions and pricing is a sensitive subject in this space for a couple of important reasons. I'll be as transparent as possible so that you can understand where I'm coming from and I'll do my best to reply to any comments below and consider your ideas for improvement.

1. Have you noticed that there are very few ads on the forums (and EBR in general). My goal is to provide an open space where people can discuss products without getting too much into promotion, discounting, and critical comparisons. There have been situations here in the past where one person was excited about a Pedego and another jumped in and made them feel bad about the price because "kits are cheaper" or "you can get similar things online" etc. etc. and it sort of ruins the fun and excitement that the original person was expressing. Perhaps that person liked how Pedego's looked or appreciated the dealer network or whatever, and they just wanted to talk about the bike. On other occasions, an individual would be talking about how great their local Haibike dealer was and how they were on the verge of purchasing locally when a member of this forum representing a shop would chime in and say "buy from us online and we'll beat their price" which changes the atmosphere again... I chose to remove brand advertisements in 2017 and forego valuable revenue to set the tone of this space being less about pricing and more about experience and connection. Yes, there are ads along the bottom of all pages here... the very bottom and any shop can sign up for that. I spent over $150k and lots of hours with developers to build that system, and I manually signed up nearly every shop that is listed there over the phone. I pay $6k+ per month on programming support, website hosting, moderation, content creation, legal fees... and that doesn't include my travel, food etc. I could be taking commissions or secretly partnering with any one of these dealers, many have offered, but I don't... because I want to stay objective and separate this community from a sales floor.
2. Many manufacturers have MSRP (manufacturer suggested retail pricing) which shops can dip below if they wish... and MAP (minimum advertised pricing) which they cannot, at least until the end of a season or some other set time. I do my best to uphold and honor these pricing guidelines by limiting conversation about pricing here to one specific forum area called Items, Parts, and Promotions by-Dealer or Brand, which is also strategically located at the very bottom of the homepage. Even with these policies in place and gentle messaging to dealers who join (sometimes multiple guidance emails, polite phone calls, and temporary bans) there have been direct-messaging campaigns through the forum email system where users will be contacted with below MAP pricing... and that's disheartening and potentially damaging to the relationship of trust that I have with each of you. In one case, a dealer who was employing this tactic lost the relationship with a brand that confirmed the unlawful behavior through this site. I value your privacy and strive to reduce any spam that you might otherwise receive. Your emails are not sold or shared unless they are collected specifically for promotional/sales requests (a tool that I have not yet launched).

TLDR: EBR and I requests that users not discuss the pricing of ebikes because it changes the atmosphere, I set the example by limiting ads and foregoing income myself, and instead have invested heavily in an open system where any dealer can join. I do not receive commissions on any ebikes sold through this platform (though I did try it for a limited time in 2014 with one brand towards the end of the season with a limited quantity of bikes). You can read the terms of service and privacy policy for more information on how EBR works.

In terms of revenue generation, EBR relies on income generated through YouTube ads (you may notice that I only allow one ad at the beginning of videos vs. two or even three, and all ads are skippable), Skimlinks (we get a small commission when items are bought on Amazon and other sites with basic affiliate programs), and category promotions (where a bike is pinned to the top of a category on the site). In order to start ElectricBikeReview.com, I quit my job with $10k in the bank and lived in my car for two years before gaining enough traction to sign up some advertisers. You can learn more about that experience in this video:

As always, I'm open to suggestions and feedback... I care about each of you and this community, and my perspective over the years trying different revenue models and communication guidelines has led me to this semi-conservative approach.

Sincerely,
Court

 

[Bruce Arnold]

Thank you, Court, for this post and for all the value you bring to the ebike world. Where would thousands of people be without your input on this wonderful technology? My ebike has changed my life and your reviews helped in a major way to make that happen. I know for a fact that I'm far from the only one to feel this way.

 

[Bluefood]

I have a video of my 'rad power wagon' getting delivered , would it be an ad or a big thumbs up for "Vilofix" ? and can I put it ? Its about 4 min long of asking the tech about my bike and what they do ---

 

[john peck]

Just by way of an apology to Court, I'm sry for mentioning that other kind of 'powered' bicycle on an electric forum, but I do think
riders of anything with pedals become a stronger force for change if we are united. The CCS is still my preferred ride for most purposes.
I hope some day ebikes will evolve to an extent that one can ride nonstop across the Great Basin without charging or fear of becoming
buzzard bait. In the past I have abandoned a motorized bike forum & bike forums as a well because of what I perceived as elitism with
an emphasis on marketing. Thus far I don't see that on this site.

 

[ebikemom]

I have a video of my 'rad power wagon' getting delivered , would it be an ad or a big thumbs up for "Vilofix" ? and can I put it ? Its about 4 min long of asking the tech about my bike and what they do ---

It isn't advertising unless you have a financial connection to the brand--if you are an employee, owner, investor, etc., then it would be advertising. If you are just a consumer talking about your own experience and sharing it, it isn't advertising. When I talk about my own bike, for example, I'm not advertising because I'm just a bike owner/rider, sharing my personal experience.

 

[AlanDB]

It might not be advertising, but it is also not advertising if as a consumer I mention a sale price or discount on a specific brand or a special price offered by a local seller that I happen to run across in my reading and research. I also don't think it is advertising if I post what I paid for a ebike that I bought. Yet as I read Court's opening post in this thread, that would violate the forum policy he outlined. I personally think this rule is overly restrictive, but this is his forum and I appreciate being able to participate in the forum and value everything I have learned here. So I will abide by the rule even though I don't completely agree with it. I suspect I may have violated this rule in some of my previous posts, but I am trying to be careful on anything new that I post.

 

[ebikemom]

Yes, it is Court's call. The pricing policy is to prevent this forum from serving to promote dealers who violate MSRP policies. This is something that I, as a consumer, was completely unaware of as an issue prior to learning about the problem here on this forum.

Thanks for being a good citizen here even though you don't agree with the rules. It's great to have you here!

 

[Electric Bike Company]

Thanks Court - just joined the Forum chats today - I'm glad to have read your post. Thank you for sharing and will keep all these valuable points in mind. Kind regards

 

[Stromer2work]

It might not be advertising, but it is also not advertising if as a consumer I mention a sale price or discount on a specific brand or a special price offered by a local seller that I happen to run across in my reading and research. I also don't think it is advertising if I post what I paid for a ebike that I bought. Yet as I read Court's opening post in this thread, that would violate the forum policy he outlined. I personally think this rule is overly restrictive, but this is his forum and I appreciate being able to participate in the forum and value everything I have learned here. So I will abide by the rule even though I don't completely agree with it. I suspect I may have violated this rule in some of my previous posts, but I am trying to be careful on anything new that I post.

I have a side buisness online, non cycle related, for over 9 years now. Some manufacturers strictly enforce MAP and will yank a distributorship no questions asked when a dealer violates it. Just ask questions and discuss via PM rather than out loud.. discreetness is still a good trait, even in this impersonal internet age we live in.

 

[TomTee]

Newcomer here from the Mid-Atlantic Brandywine Valley.

Price concerns can be very real, however as an official green horn triker I must say the biggest dynamic I experienced in getting into a pair of Falco powered Catrike Dumonts was the indepth presentations, patience and non pressure of the various shops where my wife and I explored our options. We were shopping in the desert of August 2020 when vendors were (and still are) struggling to get their supply line refilled. Most shops gave us a 5 to 6 month wait schedule. At our age we thought our wake might occur first. However one of the nicest most accommodating shops mentioned a dealer in another state who had a good sized inventory of our preferred brand so we were trike owners immediately. Even at that we still were without our drives which were on back order. However, after a relatively short wait, that was solved when the eDrive company surprised me with an invitation to "Come on down!".

This ol' compromised leg arthritic couple were cruising within 48 hours!

Not sure what the protocol is here of mentioning company names but service, education, friendliness & non sales pressure is a large part of the joy of getting into chaise lounge e-triking.

Tom Tee

 

[Frank/Delaware]

Newcomer here from the Mid-Atlantic Brandywine Valley.

Price concerns can be very real, however as an official green horn triker I must say the biggest dynamic I experienced in getting into a pair of Falco powered Catrike Dumonts was the indepth presentations, patience and non pressure of the various shops where my wife and I explored our options. We were shopping in the desert of August 2020 when vendors were (and still are) struggling to get their supply line refilled. Most shops gave us a 5 to 6 month wait schedule. At our age we thought our wake might occur first. However one of the nicest most accommodating shops mentioned a dealer in another state who had a good sized inventory of our preferred brand so we were trike owners immediately. Even at that we still were without our drives which were on back order. However, after a relatively short wait, that was solved when the eDrive company surprised me with an invitation to "Come on down!".

This ol' compromised leg arthritic couple were cruising within 48 hours!

Not sure what the protocol is here of mentioning company names but service, education, friendliness & non sales pressure is a large part of the joy of getting into chaise lounge e-triking.

Tom Tee

Northern Delaware here... Welcome

 

[troehrkasse]

Not sure what the protocol is here of mentioning company names but service, education, friendliness & non sales pressure is a large part of the joy of getting into chaise lounge e-triking.

Mention away! This is very valuable feedback for fellow riders, since it's your direct experience as a customer Glad to hear you were able to find them and get riding so soon! And welcome to EBR

 

[TomTee]

Our experience as newbies: We were first introduced to recumbent trikes at the Lancaster Bike company in Marriet, PA on the Susquehanna river. Having to cease bicycling due to health reasons we were looking for another similar touring exercise. WOW! What an eye opener. Totally confusing with all the makes and models but they patiently explained the various features including a quick visit to their shop. Very impressive! The clincher was the rental. Once you ride one, you are all in.

Still overwhelmed, we went to Jersey Bents, Berlin NJ. Nicest father and son business you will ever meet. Their large show room has many different makes and models but like the Lancaster Bike company orders were on a 6 month waiting list.

Having a custom fabrication background I just knew that what I wanted was somewhere in existence, I just had to find it.

Finding another shop in Mt Airy, MD who said they had hundreds of these in stock we emptied the van and drove down there the next day. 400 bicycles, 6 sold trikes. Oh well, my bad. Again very nice people. Perhaps the most overstocked shop on the face of the earth.

I ask questions, I want details, I want to know the specific type of material and fasteners used. After exploring hours on end of You Tube videos of drive features, bike frames fit and finish, steering designs, center of gravity, quality/adjustability of seating, tire material and sizes plus country of origin plus reading magazine and on line articles my decision was firmly made. USA based Catrike and their full suspension Dumont would be the chassis.

Alas, still nothing available in August / September 2020, sigh!

I called Travis at Lisbon and inquired if they had any Catrikes available, he said "yes"! I asked if they had any Dumonts, his killer answer was "What color". Huh? You pulling my leg? "No" he said. Well I told him "I need two". Again Travis says "what color?" It took me about two minutes to pull out my CC and the rest is history. This guy has about a hundred "J" hooks fastened to his ceiling, he gets in somewhere North of a hundred Catrikes every couple of months. It was a Catrike flash mob.

We have no negative comments in our pursuit. Met some of the nicest folks in about six different shops in PA,DE,NJ, MD, VA and Ohio.

 

[john peck]

Our experience as newbies: We were first introduced to recumbent trikes at the Lancaster Bike company in Marriet, PA on the Susquehanna river. Having to cease bicycling due to health reasons we were looking for another similar touring exercise. WOW! What an eye opener. Totally confusing with all the makes and models but they patiently explained the various features including a quick visit to their shop. Very impressive! The clincher was the rental. Once you ride one, you are all in.

Still overwhelmed, we went to Jersey Bents, Berlin NJ. Nicest father and son business you will ever meet. Their large show room has many different makes and models but like the Lancaster Bike company orders were on a 6 month waiting list.

Having a custom fabrication background I just knew that what I wanted was somewhere in existence, I just had to find it.

Finding another shop in Mt Airy, MD who said they had hundreds of these in stock we emptied the van and drove down there the next day. 400 bicycles, 6 sold trikes. Oh well, my bad. Again very nice people. Perhaps the most overstocked shop on the face of the earth.

I ask questions, I want details, I want to know the specific type of material and fasteners used. After exploring hours on end of You Tube videos of drive features, bike frames fit and finish, steering designs, center of gravity, quality/adjustability of seating, tire material and sizes plus country of origin plus reading magazine and on line articles my decision was firmly made. USA based Catrike and their full suspension Dumont would be the chassis plus the Falco eDrive would be the motor. A hub drive not using a chain drive with plastic gears was a determining factor.

Alas, still nothing available in August / September 2020, sigh!

After sharing my disappointment of Catrike availability, Rakesh of Falco suggested for me to check with Lisbon Rails to Trails in Lisbon, Ohio. I figured OK, probably another disappointment but I'll call them anyway.

Before I called, I checked them out on line and was impressed with their connections with Catrike. They ONLY sell Catrike. So far, Very Good! With a wind under my wings I called Travis at Lisbon and inquired if they had any Catrikes available, he said "yes"! I asked if they had any Dumonts, his killer answer was "What color". Huh? You pulling my leg? "No" he said. Well I told him "I need two". Again Travis says "what color?" It took me about two minutes to pull out my CC and the rest is history. This guy has about a hundred meat hooks fastened to his ceiling, he gets in somewhere North of a hundred Catrikes every couple of months. It was a Catrike flash mob.

Had a delay with the Falco delivery but that was soon gone and we are having the time of our lives. We hit the ski shops and got cold weather gear for all winter riding on the Jersey shore boardwalks, Jersey Delaware River towns, Brandywine path, Markel trail, PA rails to trails, local communities. Why did we wait so long!!

PS, we had a particular request with Rakesh of Falco after delivery. Now understand, he was not looking forward to another sale, he was fully paid, no financial carrot but never the less he said "No problem, Bring it on down". So we did, Rakesh worked some magic and all is well.

We have no negative comments in our pursuit. Met some of the nicest folks in about six different shops in PA,DE,NJ, MD, VA and Ohio.

The big plus of a tadpole trike for me is not having far to fall, if at all. I´ve run out of new parts to injure. Now
if we just had more bike lanes to use them.

 

[Art Deco]

The big plus of a tadpole trike for me is not having far to fall, if at all. I´ve run out of new parts to injure. Now
if we just had more bike lanes to use them.

And less cellphone users in SUVs to dodge ...

 

[Art Deco]

Our experience as newbies: We were first introduced to recumbent trikes at the Lancaster Bike company in Marriet, PA on the Susquehanna river. Having to cease bicycling due to health reasons we were looking for another similar touring exercise. WOW! What an eye opener. Totally confusing with all the makes and models but they patiently explained the various features including a quick visit to their shop. Very impressive! The clincher was the rental. Once you ride one, you are all in.

Still overwhelmed, we went to Jersey Bents, Berlin NJ. Nicest father and son business you will ever meet. Their large show room has many different makes and models but like the Lancaster Bike company orders were on a 6 month waiting list.

Having a custom fabrication background I just knew that what I wanted was somewhere in existence, I just had to find it.

Finding another shop in Mt Airy, MD who said they had hundreds of these in stock we emptied the van and drove down there the next day. 400 bicycles, 6 sold trikes. Oh well, my bad. Again very nice people. Perhaps the most overstocked shop on the face of the earth.

I ask questions, I want details, I want to know the specific type of material and fasteners used. After exploring hours on end of You Tube videos of drive features, bike frames fit and finish, steering designs, center of gravity, quality/adjustability of seating, tire material and sizes plus country of origin plus reading magazine and on line articles my decision was firmly made. USA based Catrike and their full suspension Dumont would be the chassis plus the Falco eDrive would be the motor. A hub drive not using a chain drive with plastic gears was a determining factor.

Alas, still nothing available in August / September 2020, sigh!

After sharing my disappointment of Catrike availability, Rakesh of Falco suggested for me to check with Lisbon Rails to Trails in Lisbon, Ohio. I figured OK, probably another disappointment but I'll call them anyway.

Before I called, I checked them out on line and was impressed with their connections with Catrike. They ONLY sell Catrike. So far, Very Good! With a wind under my wings I called Travis at Lisbon and inquired if they had any Catrikes available, he said "yes"! I asked if they had any Dumonts, his killer answer was "What color". Huh? You pulling my leg? "No" he said. Well I told him "I need two". Again Travis says "what color?" It took me about two minutes to pull out my CC and the rest is history. This guy has about a hundred meat hooks fastened to his ceiling, he gets in somewhere North of a hundred Catrikes every couple of months. It was a Catrike flash mob.

Had a delay with the Falco delivery but that was soon gone and we are having the time of our lives. We hit the ski shops and got cold weather gear for all winter riding on the Jersey shore boardwalks, Jersey Delaware River towns, Brandywine path, Markel trail, PA rails to trails, local communities. Why did we wait so long!!

PS, we had a particular request with Rakesh of Falco after delivery. Now understand, he was not looking forward to another sale, he was fully paid, no financial carrot but never the less he said "No problem, Bring it on down". So we did, Rakesh worked some magic and all is well.

We have no negative comments in our pursuit. Met some of the nicest folks in about six different shops in PA,DE,NJ, MD, VA and Ohio.

Very good to hear that.