New Vado 5.0 IGH, 1st ride, and my experience

[GuruUno]

Took the bike for a 28-mile 1st-day ride and overall I was very impressed.
The overall feel, handling, and performance are one of the best I've had....this is my 6th e-bike in the last 5 years. It just keeps getting better.
Albeit I'll need to embrace the Mission Control having had been a user of BLevo, so it's a bit foreign to me.
I began out the gate with 'Smart Control'. I set it for 35 miles, 2-1/2 hour ride, 10% remaining battery to get back from wherever. All other settings were "out of the box" default.
My 1st destination was about 6 miles away to stop and say hello to a buddy and I was surprised to see that I had already used 16% (85% remaining) after such a short ride. All in Smart Control.
Moving on, afterward, I started playing with the assistance level for pedaling going from normal to slow, slower and slowest to feel the differences. I then went fast, faster, and fastest. The display showed my cadence average for each selection.
At about 19 miles I stopped and took it out of Smart Control and used the parameters available via a selection made such as ECO, Sport, and Turbo along with the pedaling choices. Looking for the "sweet spot" in 'manual' mode (non-Smart). I immediately saw that my usage was more favorable to conserve power. However, Smart Control is a phenomenal choice if it can be mastered. I'll still be adjusting and learning, it's the only way. After 5,100 miles on my Vado 5.0 in the last 20 months and 2,100 miles on the Vado 5.0 SL in the last 8 months, I can say this is a totally different experience that will take time to adjust to and learn.

I did have a few items of concern. I haven't checked the specification diagrams to verify but it sure seems that the crank arms are lower to the ground than on either of my other bikes. Several times I could feel my foot scrape on the slightest turning (left or right) when my foot was on the downstroke. Normally I'd have to be really angled to get the slightest 'touching' of the pedal to the ground on any other bike, but this bike seems to be oddly closer than any other. I measure just under 3 inches (see photo).

I also got an error 3 times on the display of Mission Control on the iPhone in a "System Event": The connection between the automatic gear shifter and the TCD-w got interrupted. Check visually if the automatic gear shifter was damaged or wrongfully disconnected. When restarting the bike, this event will be cleared from the display but the gear shifter may not be operational anymore. Error Code 4096 If issues do not resolve, please contact your dealer.

I had no issues, have not attempted to do another ride to determine if it is problematic or not. I had no problems riding or shifting, so I'm baffled.

I'm also a little confused about the wheel circumferences setting, is this correct (see photo)? (84.65in)

Anyway, overall, I'm super excited and impressed. I hope it won't fade and continue to be a fun ride.

47% left after a 26.93-mile ride....eh

(Oh, and a side note: Rider Care totally sucks, try calling, try e-mailing, let me know if it's me they avoid or do they avoid everyone...as I have had pre-sales questions, concerns, etc. over the last few weeks and never got any replies ever at all.....ever, which is a major concern if and when I do need to have an interaction to have a question or problem addressed or resolved. Do they even 'Care' (Rider Care)??????)

 

[mschwett]

thanks for the report!!

the pedal strike issue is odd; the bottom bracket height of the vado - at least per specialized - is pretty standard at 285mm. crank should be 170mm, leaving 115mm from centerline of pedal to ground when the bike is vertical. 4.5 inches for those of us in the colonies, which should be 4” clear after pedal width taken into account.

if you’re getting a lot of pedal strikes, be VERY careful. a pedal strike around a fast turn can lead to a bad crash if the pedal hitting the ground causes the rear wheel to lift or lose traction. i had this problem on my creo due to inexperience and poor pedal choice for a road bike - long since alleviated but that bike has a 20mm lower BB than yours.

the only real ways to change this are 1) bigger tires (not recommended) 2) less suspension travel (won’t make much difference unless your front end is really soft) 3) smaller pedals and 4) shorter cranks.

i did #3 and #4 and focused on my technique, always remembering to have the inboard pedal up when turning.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

An interesting write-up Guru! Thank you!

 

[rochrunner]

if you’re getting a lot of pedal strikes, be VERY careful. a pedal strike around a fast turn can lead to a bad crash if the pedal hitting the ground causes the rear wheel to lift or lose traction. i had this problem on my creo due to inexperience and poor pedal choice for a road bike - long since alleviated but that bike has a 20mm lower BB than yours.

i did #3 and #4 and focused on my technique, always remembering to have the inboard pedal up when turning.

Reminds me of back in the day carving some turns on my BMW motorcycle and impressing my buddies behind me with the shower of sparks from dragging the center stand on the asphalt when I had to lean farther into the turn -- a real butt-clenching moment for me! Ever since, I'm religious about keeping the inside pedal up when cornering on a bicycle, especially since I don't have a good feel for the cornering limits and don't want to discover them by experience (too old for dealing with gravel rash!).

 

[mschwett]

Reminds me of back in the day carving some turns on my BMW motorcycle and impressing my buddies behind me with the shower of sparks from dragging the center stand on the asphalt when I had to lean farther into the turn -- a real butt-clenching moment for me! Ever since, I'm religious about keeping the inside pedal up when cornering on a bicycle, especially since I don't have a good feel for the cornering limits and don't want to discover them by experience (too old for dealing with gravel rash!).

yes. and an inherently bad crash because it occurs at high speed around a corner!!

 

[Gee_Whiz]

I've noticed the crank arms seem extra long as well but not sure the size

 

[rochrunner]

I've noticed the crank arms seem extra long as well but not sure the size

It should be stamped on them somewhere and is also in the geometry chart on the web site at 170mm for all sizes, which is pretty standard. The BB height is also the same for all.

 

[Nubnub]

I'm also a little confused about the wheel circumferences setting, is this correct (see photo)? (84.65in)

It seems setup for wheel circumference is hit or miss. If your bike has 650B, 2.3 in wheels, the circumference should be closer to 87in. Good news if this is true is that you went farther than the Mastermind distance may have said. The bad news is that your assist will cut out at a lower speed than it should.

 

[scrambler]

@GuruUno have you used an ebike with a Bosch gen4 CX before, and if so can you compare the Torque and power feel with this new vado 2.2 motor / 90Nm of torque.
Also can you compare the feel of the pedal assist between both?

Thanks

 

[Gee_Whiz]

@GuruUno have you used an ebike with a Bosch gen4 CX before, and if so can you compare the Torque and power feel with this new vado 2.2 motor / 90Nm of torque.
Also can you compare the feel of the pedal assist between both?

Thanks

I have on an Allant 8+ and there's no comparison. They're close in nm but the Vado IGH feels like a different generation of ebike. Faster, quicker and feels lighter on its feet even as a heavier machine.

 

[scrambler]

Thank you so much for that feedback!

 

[GuruUno]

@GuruUno have you used an ebike with a Bosch gen4 CX before, and if so can you compare the Torque and power feel with this new vado 2.2 motor / 90Nm of torque.
Also can you compare the feel of the pedal assist between both?

Thanks

I've not tried the newer Bosch e-bikes to compare, as of yet. I had an Allant 9.9S a few years ago and it had torque but felt very, very heavy and was not as agile as the Vado.

 

[Gee_Whiz]

Thank you so much for that feedback!

Very welcome; the Vado IGH is more refined and more efficient than any of the CX bikes imo. It's not a gulf in terms of climbing ability but the overall of the bike is a nice package.. probably the best out; But.. they are heavy machines and it's unlikely they would make for great fitness/pedal bikes off motor imo. In ECO the bike moves fairly easy and you CAN pedal off motor but its a different, far less efficient experience from a regular bike entirely. They make for almost perfect car replacement commuters though.

 

[jimji]

@GuruUno have you used an ebike with a Bosch gen4 CX before, and if so can you compare the Torque and power feel with this new vado 2.2 motor / 90Nm of torque.
Also can you compare the feel of the pedal assist between both?

Thanks

I recently bought a Trek Rail pretty high end mountain bike and thought the Bosch seemed to have more power than the comparable Brose in the Specialized. These are mountain bikes so a little different. However just test rode the Vado 5 with igh which I loved btw and found it similarly slightly less powerful feeling than the Bosch in my Trek. Still its pretty good and is smoother in its delivery and quieter than the Bosch imo.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Vado 5 with igh which I loved btw and found it similarly slightly less powerful feeling than the Bosch in my Trek.

There are three major differences:

• Trek Rail has the mountain gearing, which gives higher torque at the rear wheel but the e-bike is slower
• Motors optimized for e-MTB have more powerful lower end than the commuters
• Vado 5.0 IGH has the IGH. IGH is less efficient than the chain/derailleur system, and it also has less impressive gearing ratio than your Rail has.

 

[jimji]

Took the bike for a 28-mile 1st-day ride and overall I was very impressed.
The overall feel, handling, and performance are one of the best I've had....this is my 6th e-bike in the last 5 years. It just keeps getting better.
Albeit I'll need to embrace the Mission Control having had been a user of BLevo, so it's a bit foreign to me.
I began out the gate with 'Smart Control'. I set it for 35 miles, 2-1/2 hour ride, 10% remaining battery to get back from wherever. All other settings were "out of the box" default.
My 1st destination was about 6 miles away to stop and say hello to a buddy and I was surprised to see that I had already used 16% (85% remaining) after such a short ride. All in Smart Control.
Moving on, afterward, I started playing with the assistance level for pedaling going from normal to slow, slower and slowest to feel the differences. I then went fast, faster, and fastest. The display showed my cadence average for each selection.
At about 19 miles I stopped and took it out of Smart Control and used the parameters available via a selection made such as ECO, Sport, and Turbo along with the pedaling choices. Looking for the "sweet spot" in 'manual' mode (non-Smart). I immediately saw that my usage was more favorable to conserve power. However, Smart Control is a phenomenal choice if it can be mastered. I'll still be adjusting and learning, it's the only way. After 5,100 miles on my Vado 5.0 in the last 20 months and 2,100 miles on the Vado 5.0 SL in the last 8 months, I can say this is a totally different experience that will take time to adjust to and learn.

I did have a few items of concern. I haven't checked the specification diagrams to verify but it sure seems that the crank arms are lower to the ground than on either of my other bikes. Several times I could feel my foot scrape on the slightest turning (left or right) when my foot was on the downstroke. Normally I'd have to be really angled to get the slightest 'touching' of the pedal to the ground on any other bike, but this bike seems to be oddly closer than any other. I measure just under 3 inches (see photo).

I also got an error 3 times on the display of Mission Control on the iPhone in a "System Event": The connection between the automatic gear shifter and the TCD-w got interrupted. Check visually if the automatic gear shifter was damaged or wrongfully disconnected. When restarting the bike, this event will be cleared from the display but the gear shifter may not be operational anymore. Error Code 4096 If issues do not resolve, please contact your dealer.

I had no issues, have not attempted to do another ride to determine if it is problematic or not. I had no problems riding or shifting, so I'm baffled.

I'm also a little confused about the wheel circumferences setting, is this correct (see photo)? (84.65in)

Anyway, overall, I'm super excited and impressed. I hope it won't fade and continue to be a fun ride.

47% left after a 26.93-mile ride....eh

(Oh, and a side note: Rider Care totally sucks, try calling, try e-mailing, let me know if it's me they avoid or do they avoid everyone...as I have had pre-sales questions, concerns, etc. over the last few weeks and never got any replies ever at all.....ever, which is a major concern if and when I do need to have an interaction to have a question or problem addressed or resolved. Do they even 'Care' (Rider Care)??????)

Was really wondering what this auto shifting would feel like in the Vado and was lucky enough to find one to test ride today though it was a medium and I would need a large. Unfortunately I just bought a used Priority Current igh for $2K but found I wanted a stronger and more comfortable riding bike as it has no suspension and is a lighter weight bike with pretty narrow tires and could use another gear to go fast with.
The Vado 5.0 with Igh and belt drive worked so well and with front adjustable air forks and included spring seat post as well as those fairly wide tires it was the most comfortable ride I have ever had. I believe the Bosch motor in my Trek Mt bike may be more powerful but the Brose in the Vado 5.0 is no slouch and is quieter and smoother. I really like how easy it is to change your cadence level on the controls and I did so on the fly using a slower than standard level. Its easy enough that you could kind of use it like a manual adjustment to shift with though thats obviously not its intended purpose. Still its nice to be able to change you cadence level while rmoving for a change of pace. When you stop peddling it downs shifts as if you have stopped to make it easier to get going again but if you are just coasting it takes a full revolution or so for it to find your chosen cadence again. However I noticed on the Specialized site that you can change how low it auto downshifts in the app which I think is pretty brilliant. I did have trouble trying to get it above 25 mph not because of cadence level but it just would have taken a lot of effort likely having to do with the big tires. I fell in love with the simplicity and clean look on the Priority and might end up liking that bike too but likely will buy the Vado with auto shifting when the next one comes into my local shop later this year. Not sure I can ever go back to a derailleur and manual shifter except for a mountain bike. Great job specialized.

 

[jimji]

There are three major differences:

• Trek Rail has the mountain gearing, which gives higher torque at the rear wheel but the e-bike is slower
• Motors optimized for e-MTB have more powerful lower end than the commuters
• Vado 5.0 IGH has the IGH. IGH is less efficient than the chain/derailleur system, and it also has less impressive gearing ratio than your Rail has.

All sounds true except I found the full power Brose motors on the Specialized Turbo Levo Mt bike felt similar to what I just experience on the Vado and was one of the reasons I bought the Trek over the Levo at the time. Turns out that the instant jump from the Bosch at least in the higher assist levels is kind of unusable at least for me in technical terrain. I might have to try the Bosch speed model in something like the Gizelle plus model to get a better comparison but then I would only be interested in the igh again. They didn't have a Vado 5.0 with derailleur to compare to but I doubt it would change my mind.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Jim, I do not deny your experience may prove what you say is true. Only the Specialized 2.2 motor is rated at 90 Nm, and the Bosch CX is 85 Nm. Different motor tuning perhaps?

I owned a Giant Trance E+ 2 Pro. The motor was rated at only 80 Nm but the oomph of the PW-X2 motor was improbable. I could make a wheelie on several occasions, something I would never get from Vado 5.0 (the 45 km/h or 28 mph version). Different tuning!