Love my CCS, losing patience with Juiced

PeteH

Member
Summary - My bike's been off the road for a month now -- this is getting old.

Here's my story: my rear hub staring making groaning sounds under load after a few hundred miles. It's gradually gotten louder, and I was afraid it would fail entirely the day after the warranty was up. To me, it's pretty obvious that the freewheel clutch is slipping. It uses rollers which are pinched when the hub wants to turn faster than the wheel -- that is, when power is applied. Pretty clearly, one or more of the rollers aren't totally locking up. They may be worn or cracked, or maybe the tapered channeld they run in are worn or cracked.

So I contacted Juiced on November 4. After they had me rule out some other possible causes, they told me to send back the wheel. (By the way, I offered to put in a new freewheel if they sent it to me. That would save a lot of time and shipping costs. But they said they have to follow their procedures). On November 6, I got RMA number and shipping label.

It was a fair amount of work on my end to safely pack the wheel. The axle ends are fragile especially the right side where the electrical cable comes out. So I used a hole saw to cut 2.5 inch holes in a couple of 2x6 blocks and zip tied them over each side of axle. On the right side I made an cutout area for the cable so it wouldn't get pinched. I got a bike box from the local bike store and cut it down to size. Juiced told me to clean the cassette, but that's all. I affixed labels with the RMA number on the hub and one of the spokes. I took the package to UPS on November 7, the day after the RMA was issued.

A week goes by. Juiced has had the wheel for 5 days. On November 15 I emailed support, but no response. But later that day, I got emails saying my "order" was ready to ship, and then it was "on the way." But no tracking information was available. Two days later, on November 16, I emailed them saying that UPS had not received the shipment. After that, there were multiple calls, emails, and online messaging. Most of the phone calls resulted in my having to leave a callback message, which was never returned.

Finally, on Nov 21 I got an email from Juiced that my "order" had been delivered. I'm out of town for Thanksgiving, so can't open the box until November 24. I unpack it, and what do I find? A whole new wheel, tire, and cassette! The hub has a few scratches on it, so maybe it's not so new. But what's NOT on the wheel are the brake disk and the axle spacers, washers, and nuts.

I contact Juiced immediately, but it took 3 days to get a response to many phone messages and emails. I finally get hold of someone during the lunch hour on November 27. I was promised the parts would ship ASAP. (I told them if they could just find my old wheel, they could take the parts off of it, or just send me the whole thing). Anyway, two days later on November 29, I got an email from a support person that my shipment was going out that day, and then an automated email with a tracking number. But here it is, December 4, and UPS is still waiting for the package with my parts.

So it's been a month, and still nothing to ride ! The people at Juiced are quite nice, one you get hold of them. But commitments were not kept. Also, this repair is costing Juiced lots of money. I didn't need a new rim, tire, spokes, cassette, hub, and motor. Bafang freewheels only cost around $30, and there's a YouTube of someone changing one in less than a minute.

Now I wish I'd just waited for the freewheel to fail and fixed it myself. It's also possible that it would have quieted down after a while. Juiced sells great bikes at a great price. But they have some work to do to fix their service department. I get the feeling they're more than disorganized than understaffed.
 
My wife had a problem with the bearings in her Pedego's motor. The local mechanic wanted to take the motor apart and replace them. Pedego said no and shipped a new rear wheel assembly. So that part may just be industry practice, regardless of what makes sense to you, me, or the local Pedego guy.

As far as the delays, I'm right there with you. Room for improvement, for sure.
 
My wife had a problem with the bearings in her Pedego's motor. The local mechanic wanted to take the motor apart and replace them. Pedego said no and shipped a new rear wheel assembly. So that part may just be industry practice, regardless of what makes sense to you, me, or the local Pedego guy.

As far as the delays, I'm right there with you. Room for improvement, for sure.
By the way, that is not industry practice. Sending out a new freehub, for a dealer to replace is. (that is, if the freehub is making the groaning noise that Pete mentions, which does happen). Since Juice is dealing with an end customer, they have no idea of that customer's level of mechanical competency, so while it's more of hassle for a customer to ship the motor, and rim back, but less time consuming overall for Juiced - because they could run into all sorts of communication issues and troubleshooting if a customer does not have the right tools or experience - that is probably why Juiced did it the way they did. Also, it may not have been the freehub that is the issue. If I am a customer, I'd rather get the whole new motor and rim, as Juiced supplied.
 
Bafang freewheels only cost around $30, and there's a YouTube of someone changing one in less than a minute.
Sorry about your troubles. I had a long wait for a new motor myself this summer.

I don't believe removing the freehub on the CCS is a one minute job - I've tried. The cassette comes off easily, but the freehub is integrated into the motor and as far as I can tell you have to disassemble the motor to swap it out. CCS apparently has a higher-end Bafang motor to accommodate the 9-speed cassette. Curious to see which Youtube video you mean.
 
Points well taken. They can use any warranty repair strategy they want.

But if they're not going to try to fix the hub, why not just send a new wheel in the first place? I'd be back on the road in a couple of days. I could send back my old wheel in their box if they wanted.

And if they wanted to test my hub before shipping a new one, OK, I get it. But don't keep my disk and and axle hardware! It's like taking your car in to get a CV joint fixed under warranty, and getting it back with no brakes.

Hey, it's been a month, and counting. If they ship my parts today, it will have been 5 weeks.
 
Sorry about your troubles. I had a long wait for a new motor myself this summer.

I don't believe removing the freehub on the CCS is a one minute job - I've tried. The cassette comes off easily, but the freehub is integrated into the motor and as far as I can tell you have to disassemble the motor to swap it out. CCS apparently has a higher-end Bafang motor to accommodate the 9-speed cassette. Curious to see which Youtube video you mean.



Here's the video, 1 minute 6 seconds long:


Except for the color, the hub looks the same as mine, which is labeled BFSWX02 48V (10). Of course, if you were doing it, you'd probably clean and grease the ring gear (assuming you're supposed to). Also, the freewheel is already attached to the nylon gearset, and replaced as a unit.
 
Received the missing disk, bolts, and axle hardware yesterday, after finally finding someone in customer support who was willing to take ownership of the problem. She actually talked to someone in the warehouse and told them my situation.

So after 5 weeks I'm back on the road again. Went for a 25 mile ride... Yay!

Actually, the locking spacer was not included -- that is, the one that bolts to the left-side dropout. So I'll have to call Juiced again for one of those. Until I get it, I'll have to rely on the spacer tabs to keep the axle from rotating.
 
Received the missing disk, bolts, and axle hardware yesterday, after finally finding someone in customer support who was willing to take ownership of the problem. She actually talked to someone in the warehouse and told them my situation.

So after 5 weeks I'm back on the road again. Went for a 25 mile ride... Yay!

Actually, the locking spacer was not included -- that is, the one that bolts to the left-side dropout. So I'll have to call Juiced again for one of those. Until I get it, I'll have to rely on the spacer tabs to keep the axle from rotating.

It has been a long wait for PeteH. Problem with most companies, small or large, new or established, is the poor communications with their customers. Is not always "bad service", but almost always the customer with the problem is left in a cloud of uncertainty. Who is handling my problem?, and what is the status? As PeteH mentions, from the outside it looks as if nobody "takes ownership of the problem".

The rush to push new products to the market forces companies to deliver a half-tested product, just relying on few prototypes and tests to assess design and manufacturability. It is a business model of almost all start-ups and new companies, and it is kind of accepted by the user to exchange features and novelty for less initial reliability. This business model requires a strong service early on, and more important, good communications with the customer.

Hope you enjoy your "new" bike!
 
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Very well said, Jom. Tesla is an extreme case of what you describe. Hop on over to their forums or the Reddit Tesla Forum and you'll never buy one. Ever.

But they've been the best cars we've ever had the honor of owning.
 
3000+ mi. CCS overhaul: Finally tired of putting on cheap replacement spokes once a week. rebuilt whl. with 12g Sapim. trued & glued
with threadlock to +.5- mm. (love how easy the rims are to keep true) Sapims are definitely more resilient . Since the whl was off, I got
the thick veneer of mud, pine needles, & generic slime out of the fenders. Derailleur still functioning, but idler rowels are pretty worn.
Freewheel worn also. Upside, I have a chromo mtn bike I rarely ride with exact same freewheel & derailleur in new condition I'll swap them
in along with a new cable & sheath. The old one kinked after I put on riser bars (too short). Cleaned & lubed, my second chain is still good
for another 500 mi. Motor & other components still perform as well as when I bought it.
 
Just finished indexing; Bike's like new. Decided to just replace derailleur rowels; the rest isn't really that worn. It was the cable & rowels
making the gears slip, no was to adjust it.
 
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Sorry you had such a bad experienced with Juiced. I had a Juiced bike and the battery went bad. They sent me a new one of larger capacity within a couple of days. I hadn't even returned the old one. And they gave me a free front basket. Granted, when I worked with them, they were a smaller company. It must have been 3 years ago . . .
 
Those plastic cogged discs that channel the chain thru the derailleur. When they wear out, they create a bit of slack that messes with your index &
can snag your chain if they're really bad.
 
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Sorry you had such a bad experienced with Juiced. I had a Juiced bike and the battery went bad. They sent me a new one of larger capacity within a couple of days. I hadn't even returned the old one. And they gave me a free front basket. Granted, when I worked with them, they were a smaller company. It must have been 3 years ago . . .

I think part of the problem is that Juiced has grown so fast they can't keep up with customer issues. No problem with advertising, I can't watch anything
on U-tube without first getting hit with a Rip Current ad. (Is she his daughter or his mistress?);)
 
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Sorry about your troubles. I had a long wait for a new motor myself this summer.

I don't believe removing the freehub on the CCS is a one minute job - I've tried.


Removing the wheel from a CCS is not a one minute job! Tip: just unscrew the derailleur & let it hang aside. It's easier than wrestling with the wheel.
 
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I think part of the problem is that Juiced has grown so fast they can't keep up with customer issues. No problem with advertising, I can't watch anything
on U-tube without first getting hit with a Rip Current ad. (Is she his daughter or his mistress?);)
I don't think Mr. Juiced is old enough to have a daughter that could be confused with a mistress.
 
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