Catalyzt
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
Don't want to start a war here, and there may be rare exceptions. But I am just reflecting (while Seeker is in for a tune-up) on how I wound up finding this great community-- and avoided losing $800.
I already had Survivor, and realized I need a second bike that had more range and better suspension. I stumbled across what I first looked like a great deal, but turned out to be a pretty well-thought-out scam: The Avarax-E. Here is a link to some evidence of the campaign, complete with the (mostly fictional) names and pictures of the slimeballs who enabled it. Pradeep Rana, I believe, is a real person who competed in a real long-distance bike challenge in India a year or two ago. Shame on you, man.
This bike does not exist, and will never be built. There is an entire community of people on social media now who have been ripped off by this campaign, and are trying to get their money back. Most of them have failed, and have no recourse.
It's easy for most of us who have been here a year or so-- myself included-- to look at this campaign now and realize that it's bogus. But as someone new to both crowdfunding and e-bikes, it took me several weeks... okay, a month or two... to figure that out. The price is just a bit too low-- I'd believe this bike existed for $1,700, and $1,000 might be a legit crowdfunding price-- and the weight is too low as well: Maybe a bike like this, with a CF fork, would weigh 42 pounds, but not 38. And if it had a CF fork, it couldn't be priced under $1,000-- that was what tipped me off. (As well as the seller not responding to my emails with these specific questions, while he did respond to everyone else who asked simpler questions like, "When does it ship?" "Can I get these other perks, too?" etc.)
But it almost makes sense, the numbers are just slightly outside the norms and laws of physics, engineering, and product pricing. I think this was a really sharp hustle: E-bikes are a new product, a hybrid of new and old technology, it takes a long time to learn what's a reasonable product and what isn't. I'm not a sucker, I've bought shadier-sounding stuff on Amazon or Ebay that turned out to real. (I just got a $60 3-watt guitar amp that sounds absolutely fantastic through a PA cabinet, and would be fine for playing small clubs.) In fact, I can see why-- to some folks-- the BikesDirect website, where I bought a fantastic bike that has given me over 500 trouble-free miles so far-- looks shadier than this ad campaign does.
They ALMOST got me, guys. My cursor was HOVERING over the "Buy" button.
I can see where there might be situations that would be exceptions-- if it were a campaign by a designer with a track record, for example, or that you knew personally, and you were an experienced buyer who knew exactly what you were looking for.
But if you're new to this? Don't get played. Stay far away.
My personal opinion? This is vulture capitalism at its worst. I'd be thrilled to see Indiegogo go out of business. No disrespect to those who disagree. But I am so grateful for the great advice I got here, and if I save a single person from being taken in by a scam like this, I'll be a happy man.
If you're tempted? Just slow down, post your questions here, strike up a dialogue with some of the more experienced folks. Sleep on it, think it over.
Mad respect for EBR. Thanks so much.
I already had Survivor, and realized I need a second bike that had more range and better suspension. I stumbled across what I first looked like a great deal, but turned out to be a pretty well-thought-out scam: The Avarax-E. Here is a link to some evidence of the campaign, complete with the (mostly fictional) names and pictures of the slimeballs who enabled it. Pradeep Rana, I believe, is a real person who competed in a real long-distance bike challenge in India a year or two ago. Shame on you, man.
This bike does not exist, and will never be built. There is an entire community of people on social media now who have been ripped off by this campaign, and are trying to get their money back. Most of them have failed, and have no recourse.
It's easy for most of us who have been here a year or so-- myself included-- to look at this campaign now and realize that it's bogus. But as someone new to both crowdfunding and e-bikes, it took me several weeks... okay, a month or two... to figure that out. The price is just a bit too low-- I'd believe this bike existed for $1,700, and $1,000 might be a legit crowdfunding price-- and the weight is too low as well: Maybe a bike like this, with a CF fork, would weigh 42 pounds, but not 38. And if it had a CF fork, it couldn't be priced under $1,000-- that was what tipped me off. (As well as the seller not responding to my emails with these specific questions, while he did respond to everyone else who asked simpler questions like, "When does it ship?" "Can I get these other perks, too?" etc.)
But it almost makes sense, the numbers are just slightly outside the norms and laws of physics, engineering, and product pricing. I think this was a really sharp hustle: E-bikes are a new product, a hybrid of new and old technology, it takes a long time to learn what's a reasonable product and what isn't. I'm not a sucker, I've bought shadier-sounding stuff on Amazon or Ebay that turned out to real. (I just got a $60 3-watt guitar amp that sounds absolutely fantastic through a PA cabinet, and would be fine for playing small clubs.) In fact, I can see why-- to some folks-- the BikesDirect website, where I bought a fantastic bike that has given me over 500 trouble-free miles so far-- looks shadier than this ad campaign does.
They ALMOST got me, guys. My cursor was HOVERING over the "Buy" button.
I can see where there might be situations that would be exceptions-- if it were a campaign by a designer with a track record, for example, or that you knew personally, and you were an experienced buyer who knew exactly what you were looking for.
But if you're new to this? Don't get played. Stay far away.
My personal opinion? This is vulture capitalism at its worst. I'd be thrilled to see Indiegogo go out of business. No disrespect to those who disagree. But I am so grateful for the great advice I got here, and if I save a single person from being taken in by a scam like this, I'll be a happy man.
If you're tempted? Just slow down, post your questions here, strike up a dialogue with some of the more experienced folks. Sleep on it, think it over.
Mad respect for EBR. Thanks so much.
