Detailed Ride Report - Distance/Battery

[Reid]

That's why I have mine set at 40V. I noticed when I had it set higher that it started cutting back before I really needed it to. So I just keep an eye on the voltage meter. Doesn't take much effort.

Ditto, I set it at 40V too and just watch the voltage as it coasts downward and s/pace my use of the remaining current, just as Bruce does.

 

[karmap]

This behavior is based on lithium ion battery chemistry, as you suspect. The cutoff is in the controller, not the battery, as Chris Hammond described.

I keep an eye on the voltage indicator -- not the little bars, that's a very rough estimate -- and try not to go below 46 volts. I occasionally get as low as 44V, which is roughly 30% of battery capacity, but performance has dropped considerably by then and drops even faster from there on. Twice, I've gotten down to 42V -- 20% -- and I'm doing almost all of the work. With my 17.4 Ah battery, I can ride 50-60 miles (depends on terrain, wind, etc.) before getting below 44V. Plenty for me, until I get in better shape.

If you need to know how to set the voltage cutoff and a bunch of other useful stuff, check out this video with @Tora Harris.

That is absurd to me. I have the 19.8 and there is no way I would get to 60 miles before 44V unless I did 100% Eco mode. Maybe. 60 miles to 0% battery isn’t even happening.

 

[Bruce Arnold]

That is absurd to me. I have the 19.8 and there is no way I would get to 60 miles before 44V unless I did 100% Eco mode. Maybe. 60 miles to 0% battery isn’t even happening.

Absurd is a harsh word.

I rode 50 miles on a charge last week and was at 44.8 volts (resting). This was mostly on Eco mode but I occasionally used 1, 2, cruise control, and Throttle Assist Boost. Had it been on Eco mode only, the whole time, 60 miles is a reasonable estimate. This is not an isolated incident.

I can think of several non-absurd explanations. One might be simply that our riding styles differ. For instance, I was not pushing the speed. These bikes sip energy if ridden at around 15-16 mph in the lower levels of assist. Get up over 20 mph and average watt-hours soar.

Another might be that, given normal variance in cell capacity, I lucked out and got a bunch that are towards the top end, and you got a bunch that are towards the bottom end. Not bad cells; all within spec, but the specs are a range, not an absolute.

 

[Reid]

That is absurd to me. I have the 19.8 and there is no way I would get to 60 miles before 44V unless I did 100% Eco mode. Maybe. 60 miles to 0% battery isn’t even happening.

I think he pedals more than you envision? I sure do.

 

[Chris Hammond]

That is absurd to me. I have the 19.8 and there is no way I would get to 60 miles before 44V unless I did 100% Eco mode. Maybe. 60 miles to 0% battery isn’t even happening.

I did a 40 mile casual ride with family a week ago. My son rode the CCS for the first 20 miles all in Eco, and I rode home in Eco. I had only charge to 80%, which is 55.4V and at the end of the ride had 52V which is still 60% battery; granted this was a slow ride, but still, I could make it over 100 miles easily if I chose to ride appropriately for distance over speed.

 

[NeilCruz]

That is absurd to me. I have the 19.8 and there is no way I would get to 60 miles before 44V unless I did 100% Eco mode. Maybe. 60 miles to 0% battery isn’t even happening.

@karmap

If you are not getting the kind of range you expected then consider:

• Is this a CCS or RCS?
• Is the bike mechanically sound -
  Do the wheels spin freely without any sounds or signs of rubbing?
  Are the tires inflated?
  Chain lubricated?
• What is the total loaded weight - the bike + you + lock + gear + etc
• How fast are you going
• How much time do you spend with throttle vs. peddling?
• What assist level are you in 80%+ of the time?
• Is it chilly (cold air is denser, so more impact at higher speeds)
• Tire type and road condition - gravel vs asphalt vs grass, etc.

Now if you have a CCS with 19.2 and your total bike load is 200lb or lower and you are getting drastically less range than you expect, there might be something wrong.

Didn't you have a battery that had something loose inside of it?

 

[Trail Cruiser]

@karmap

If you are not getting the kind of range you expected then consider:

• Is this a CCS or RCS?
• Is the bike mechanically sound -
  Do the wheels spin freely without any sounds or signs of rubbing?
  Are the tires inflated?
  Chain lubricated?
• What is the total loaded weight - the bike + you + lock + gear + etc
• How fast are you going
• How much time do you spend with throttle vs. peddling?
• What assist level are you in 80%+ of the time?
• Is it chilly (cold air is denser, so more impact at higher speeds)
• Tire type and road condition - gravel vs asphalt vs grass, etc.

Now if you have a CCS with 19.2 and your total bike load is 200lb or lower and you are getting drastically less range than you expect, there might be something wrong.

Didn't you have a battery that had something loose inside of it?

Don't forget tire pressure, their rolling resistance are rated at pressure of 55 psi and higher. If you have low tire pressure, esp if less than 45 psi then you need more power to overcome the tire rolling resistance alone.

 

[NeilCruz]

@Mark Peralta

Because we have bikes with different tire pressures, I didn't say a specific PSI. My RCS has a max of 30 PSI, and a CCS will of course be higher. I have been riding with a PSI of ~ 27, but I'm thinking of dropping that down to ~23-24 and locking out the front fork. Will try that this weekend.

 

[Reid]

I used to have an unrestored 1915 Detroit Electric Model 60 Brougham. Its instruction book advised the use of pnuematic tires if maximum range was the primary object. Semi-solid "cushion" tires were a flat free option. But they cost battery power and considerably knocked down the potential 100 or so mile range of the car.

We don't much worry about maximizing our range on these bikes, but if we were to do so: cadence sensor only, low rolling resistance, use muscle power to get up to speed, avoid non-aero postures, and so forth.

I wonder how much two different style riders on the same model ebike, biking together, might by mere riding style and posture, etc, vary the range of the two bikes.

 

[Trail Cruiser]

I used to have an unrestored 1915 Detroit Electric Model 60 Brougham. Its instruction book advised the use of pnuematic tires if maximum range was the primary object. Semi-solid "cushion" tires were a flat free option. But they cost battery power and considerably knocked down the potential 100 or so mile range of the car.

We don't much worry about maximizing our range on these bikes, but if we were to do so: cadence sensor only, low rolling resistance, use muscle power to get up to speed, avoid non-aero postures, and so forth.

I wonder how much two different style riders on the same model ebike, biking together, might by mere riding style and posture, etc, vary the range of the two bikes.

Here is a simulation of one pedaling at a leisurely 25 watt effort and upright position (system A) and the other one on exactly the same ebike pedaling harder at 75 watts effort and doing aero "tucked in" position (system B). In this example the range increases from 35 miles to 41 miles and the speed increases from 18.6 mph to 22 mph. Hope that helps.

http://www.ebikes.ca/tools/simulato...0c&mass_b=110&hp_b=75&throt_b=40&frame_b=road

 

[devhead]

Will someone post the chart for a CCS with 19 amp hour battery. I just got my bike last week and I still haven't figured out what voltage a full charge is. I remember Tora telling me to ignore the bars and use the numbers. I need numbers!

 

[karmap]

 

[NeilCruz]

@devhead

It doesn't mater the "size" (i.e. 12aH, 17ah, 19.2ah) - all 48 Volt systems use the 48V columns, so you just need to use the above post from @karmap and just focus on the 48V columns.

 

[john peck]

I have the 21ah; the results above seem consistent with mine when considering I weighed #300 when a got it, #230 now, &
the fact nothing here is flat. I've never gone below 45v.