Amtrak change policy on Electric Bikes on trains

[Dewey]

Amtrak changed their policy for Electric Bikes on trains earlier this month, now requiring them to be "certified by a nationally recognized testing laboratory" https://www.amtrak.com/bring-your-bicycle-onboard The wording isn't there but this implies only e-bikes that are certified to meet electrical safety standards UL 2849 for the bike or UL 2271 for batteries.

To bring a bike into a passenger car a folding bicycle must fit the dimensions of 34" x 15" x 48" (860 x 380 x 1120 mm) and kept folded only in luggage storage areas at the end of the car (or, in Superliners, on the lower level), not stored folded in overhead racks. Most folding e-bikes are larger than these dimensions so are only permitted to be stored in the bike rack train car, and you may have to pay a bicycle fee.

 

[Chargeride]

This is just a dog licence with the word dog crossed out in crayon and ebike written next to it

 

[Dewey]

This is just a dog licence with the word dog crossed out in crayon and ebike written next to it

Ultimately its up to the Conductor on the train who has the final word what is allowed on board.

 

[Chargeride]

It opens up Pandora's box doesn't it
I would take a guess having insurance would be good incase your bike sets fire to a train, and then the next question would be..what about your laptop, or power drill etc etc

I took the channel tunnel just after it was built and they put our motorbikes into a sealed box which was pumped full of co2.
I don't know if they still do.

 

[Dewey]

I would take a guess having insurance would be good incase your bike sets fire to a train

The thread blowing up on the Ebikes sub-Reddit about bike shop insurance implies its only a matter of time before UL certification is written into personal liability renters & home owners insurance.

 

[scottsdalecommuter]

The thread blowing up on the Ebikes sub-Reddit about bike shop insurance implies its only a matter of time before UL certification is written into personal liability renters & home owners insurance.

very interesting thread, thanks for sharing! I know i've never been fully comfortable charging while not home and will even charge in the garage sometimes for peace of mind. don't know if it helps or not but makes me feel better.

 

[EMGX]

A reasonable and common sense policy IMO. Several years ago I rode the Amtrak Empire Builder to Montana, bought a scooter there (sight unseen, I'd never even seen a scooter close up prior to buying it) and rode it back home 800+ miles camping along the way. I left my bear spray and jet boil fuel at home due to Amtrak regulations/restrictions but there were absolutely no questions or checks into what I was bringing onboard in my backpack, so it was essentially an honor system. The ebike policy might be just a way to keep obviously sketchy looking contraptions off of the train. I've toyed with the idea of doing a train and ride, if so I'd take my Yamaha powered ebike, which surprisingly doesn't have UL listing on the battery, or a bike with my Qiroll - but nobody could even tell that was an ebike.

Views from the train in the gorge. I'd like to take the Empire Builder further east at some point. Except for logistics I would have taken it to Glacier NP when I went there a couple years ago to ride over Going to the Sun road.

 

[Dewey]

very interesting thread, thanks for sharing! I know i've never been fully comfortable charging while not home and will even charge in the garage sometimes for peace of mind. don't know if it helps or not but makes me feel better.

Yes, albeit a bit sad for me as I was hoping to keep running on my DIY ebike for longer. I'm starting a new commute in the spring so was already looking at buying an OEM folding ebike to take on the train. I was planning to donate my current DIY ebike to the local Bike Co-Op but now it looks like I shall have to remove the kit to donate only the frame with its Enviolo cargo hub, but recycle the battery, and take the motor to the County Electronics Collection and Recycling Center.

 

[Chibbie]

That new Amtrak policy states that only Class 1/up to 20MPH motor assistance e-bikes are allowed…That’s a bummer. Not that I was planning an Amtrak trip with an e-bike any time soon; but if I were and if I wanted to take my Class 3 e-bike, this policy wouldn’t allow it. (Yes, I know: how will they possibly be able to identify whether each and every e-bike is class 1 or not? Regardless, anything but a Class 1 is banned, so if you’re inclined to be law-abiding, you wouldn’t bring something that violates the policy.)

What I don’t understand is this: presumably, the policy is about safety/fire risk rather than the maximum motor-assisted speed in and of itself, right? So wouldn’t it make more sense to base the policy solely on battery size/capacity and/or whether the bike is UL certified? Since no one’s going to be riding a bike *on the train,* the maximum motor-assisted speed seems like a poor proxy for “safety during transport on the train.” Am I missing something?

 

[BlackHand]

That new Amtrak policy states that only Class 1/up to 20MPH motor assistance e-bikes are allowed…That’s a bummer. Not that I was planning an Amtrak trip with an e-bike any time soon; but if I were and if I wanted to take my Class 3 e-bike, this policy wouldn’t allow it. (Yes, I know: how will they possibly be able to identify whether each and every e-bike is class 1 or not? Regardless, anything but a Class 1 is banned, so if you’re inclined to be law-abiding, you wouldn’t bring something that violates the policy.)

What I don’t understand is this: presumably, the policy is about safety/fire risk rather than the maximum motor-assisted speed in and of itself, right? So wouldn’t it make more sense to base the policy solely on battery size/capacity and/or whether the bike is UL certified? Since no one’s going to be riding a bike *on the train,* the maximum motor-assisted speed seems like a poor proxy for “safety during transport on the train.” Am I missing something?

Amtrak doesn't say class 1 it says:
Accepted e-bikes are low-speed with fully operable pedals, a motor that produces less than 750W (1.01hp) of continuous power and a maximum speed of 20 mph (32km/h) when powered only by the electric motor.
(The bold is mine)

To me that reads class 1, class 2, and the traditional class 3 where throttle(if any) is limited to 20mph.

 

[Chargeride]

I take my bike on our local commuter, no one has even remotely mentioned it or commented on the battery, but it does look pretty heath Robinson.
I can see I'm eventually going to have to make it more professional looking
Which is a good thing.

 

[6zfshdb]

Most battery fires occur while charging. You can't easily charge on a train.
Sure, you can cause a fire by physically abusing a lithium battery but instances are rare.
I don't understand Amtrak's beef.

 

[Dewey]

You can't easily charge on a train.

I'm not up on the power capacity of the electrical outlets fitted to every seat row in Amtrak Coach class but this Amtrak sub-Reddit thread suggests 120w and up to 20A

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amtrak/comments/154y5no

I expect Amtrak are concerned about the possibility of riders carrying removeable e-bike batteries that are poorly built non-UL 2271 compliant, faulty, or damaged, to their seat and using fast 4-8A chargers to get a top up during their train journey or commute.

 

[6zfshdb]

I'm not up on the power capacity of the electrical outlets fitted to every seat row in Amtrak Coach class but this Amtrak sub-Reddit thread suggests 120w and up to 20A

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amtrak/comments/154y5no

I expect Amtrak are concerned about the possibility of riders carrying removeable e-bike batteries that are poorly built non-UL 2271 compliant, faulty, or damaged, to their seat and using fast 4-8A chargers to get a top up during their train journey or commute.

I suppose it's possible but just how many would actually do this?
I would think most would charge at home or at work rather than on a train.