Just got a Wheel for my wife.

[Mark Stonich]

I just picked up a Wheel for my 70 y/o wife, and found this forum while it charges. We had test ridden the wheel in her own bike and decided that it's what she needs. She needs short cranks so the Demo bike at Perennial Cycle here in Mpls MN didn't work for her. Paid $1500 but only had to wait a week for it.

Small price to pay for not having to decide between getting a good workout or riding with my sweetie. We've been biking together for 50 years. But her knees are a bit wonky and she's on the heavy side. So her climbing has suffered. At my age 13-15mph is a workout, so Eco mode lets her keep up, except for larger hills.

First project will be to build a cradle to hold the Wheel vertical. Because it's easier to put the bike down onto the Wheel than the Wheel up into the bike. This is needed because she will use it in 2 bikes and I may borrow it occasionally. When her shoulder is acting up she needs to ride the recumbent I built her, which is harder on her knees. Hopefully the Wheel will solve that issue.

With it's fat tubes and bright red paint, her Cannondale looks like it was made for the Copenhagen Wheel.

 

[Sonoboy]

Mark, while I'm not experienced with this particular mode of electrification, could you turn the bike on it's handlebars and seat while installing the wheel? Just an observance. Look forward to your input in the coming weeks on your experience with this.

Edit: I just recently bought a Park bike repair stand, and it makes life so much easier if you choose to do your own maintenance. Highly recommended. Here's the link to one that Court reviewed:

(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)

 

[Mark Stonich]

Tipping it upside down would have it resting on the plastic shifters.

I've been using Park stands for over 30 years. Knew the gent who was their head engineer before he retired in 2004. I've got 3 clamps & 2 stands, mounted in truck wheels full of concrete. Heavy as hell but easy to move if you tip and roll them.

I've invented an attachment to the Park stand that makes it much easier to load heavy bikes. After I retire from crank shortening I may start selling them to eBike shops and owners.

 

[Sonoboy]

Tipping it upside down would have it resting on the plastic shifters.

I've been using Park stands for over 30 years. Knew the gent who was their head engineer before he retired in 2004. I've got 3 clamps & 2 stands, mounted in truck wheels full of concrete. Heavy as hell but easy to move if you tip and roll them.

I've invented an attachment to the Park stand that makes it much easier to load heavy bikes. After I retire from crank shortening I may start selling them to eBike shops and owners.

Well now you've got my curiosity up. My bike is 72 pounds (still over 60 if I remove both battery packs). I've been considering adding a rope pulley system to the overhead to help hoist the bike. Does this differ from your solution? Thanks.

 

[Sonoboy]

Does anyone here own the PCs-10? Mine seems to have shipped defective. The little ball on the vertical rod won't retract and so it can't snap into the hole which is meant to lock it into the base. I've tried applying force, but there's a level at which you have to stop.

Are you talking about item #4?

Edit: if so, the spring button needs to easily move within the hole that’s in the tube. There’s probably some paint that’s making the hole smaller than it should be. Yo can give the ball a tap with a hammer to force it into the tube. This may knock out the paint and allow proper operation. Repeat several times if necessary. Should this not work, there may be a steel burr around the hole. Using a drill bit of the diameter of the ball, press the ball into the tube and move off center by reaching into the tube end with some needle nosed pliers. Then de burr the hole using the drill bit. Realign the ball with the hole (again using the pliers), and this should allow the spring ball to move in the hole.

 

[rich c]

Please report back on how you like working off your smart phone. A friend of mine test road one at their company, but was annoyed with not being able to see the phone screen in bright sunlight. Actually all his complaints were about the phone control part of it. Weather, phone battery life, and visability.

 

[Mark Stonich]

JayVee
Jane's rings are 22/32 on 148mm cranks which she spins rather well. The wheel gives an extra boost when starting. Not so much that it feels like taking off on you, but the effect feels like starting downhill when you aren't. What is the nature of her disability? I do a lot of work with special needs folks. Usually shortening cranks for people with knee or hip issues.

 

[Mark Stonich]

Well now you've got my curiosity up. My bike is 72 pounds (still over 60 if I remove both battery packs). I've been considering adding a rope pulley system to the overhead to help hoist the bike. Does this differ from your solution? Thanks.

Sonoboy,
The pulley system sounds like a great idea. I use one to hoist bikes up between my garage trusses. Be sure to incorporate a cam cleat or 2, like this one. So much easier than tying off the rope(s).

But, I like to justify a basement full of toys, er tools. So;
A while back I bought a Park wall mount repair stand to mount on a home made base and upright. The socket was slightly warped in the area of the welded square tube. It fit the 100-3D clamp that came with it OK but not my Extreme range clamp tot vintage linkage clamp. Called Park and had a replacement the next day. Not one to let a freebie go to waste, I spent 20 minutes with a die grinder and salvaged the original socket. I machined a slug to fit into the socket on the stand and welded it to a heavy piece of 1"x 2"steel tubing. (25.4mm x 50.8mm for those of you who live in more rational lands.) 15" away I bolted on the salvaged socket and welded on a long lever going the other way. Then I cloned the clamping hardware and added an adjustable counter weight.

To use, I move the Park clamp into the "remote" socket. This gives me a 30" range of heights. I can clamp onto the bike without lifting it.

Then use the lever to raise it to a comfortable working height. ('76 Raleigh Super Course MkII with a '67 Sturmey Archer S5 5 speed hub)

Or keep it low for working on cranks and BBs.

I originally came up with this idea for framebuilding, so that no matter how I oriented the frame, I could weld or braze at a comfortable height. The counterweight allows me to balance the weight of a frame, so I can set the clamping force very light. Then I can easily rise or lower the frame as needed, without adjusting the clamping hardware.

But now with a bad shoulder, it's nice for mounting bikes too. For an eBike I would set the swing at 8-10" instead of 15". With a fairly heavy unassisted bike, a lot of clamping force is needed at the center pivot when the bar is near horizontal.

I'm hoping to spin off my short crank business and concentrate on tools. I wonder if there would be demand for something like this.

 

[Sonoboy]

Sonoboy,
The pulley system sounds like a great idea. I use one to hoist bikes up between my garage trusses. Be sure to incorporate a cam cleat or 2, like this one. So much easier than tying off the rope(s).

But, I like to justify a basement full of toys, er tools. So;
A while back I bought a Park wall mount repair stand to mount on a home made base and upright. The socket was slightly warped in the area of the welded square tube. It fit the 100-3D clamp that came with it OK but not my Extreme range clamp tot vintage linkage clamp. Called Park and had a replacement the next day. Not one to let a freebie go to waste, I spent 20 minutes with a die grinder and salvaged the original socket. I machined a slug to fit into the socket on the stand and welded it to a heavy piece of 1"x 2"steel tubing. (25.4mm x 50.8mm for those of you who live in more rational lands.) 15" away I bolted on the salvaged socket and welded on a long lever going the other way. Then I cloned the clamping hardware and added an adjustable counter weight.

To use, I move the Park clamp into the "remote" socket. This gives me a 30" range of heights. I can clamp onto the bike without lifting it.

Then use the lever to raise it to a comfortable working height. ('76 Raleigh Super Course MkII with a '67 Sturmey Archer S5 5 speed hub)

Or keep it low for working on cranks and BBs.

I originally came up with this idea for framebuilding, so that no matter how I oriented the frame, I could weld or braze at a comfortable height. The counterweight allows me to balance the weight of a frame, so I can set the clamping force very light. Then I can easily rise or lower the frame as needed, without adjusting the clamping hardware.

But now with a bad shoulder, it's nice for mounting bikes too. For an eBike I would set the swing at 8-10" instead of 15". With a fairly heavy unassisted bike, a lot of clamping force is needed at the center pivot when the bar is near horizontal.

I'm hoping to spin off my short crank business and concentrate on tools. I wonder if there would be demand for something like this.

Sweet! I like your solution so much I almost regret buying the Park stand. However I don't have access to a welder. You must have a great workshop, along with the knowledge to properly make use of it. Thanks for the reply!

 

[Mark Stonich]

Thanks for your answer. She had a motorcycle accident when younger. Things were actually fine until last year when she slipped on an ice patch and broke her knee cap. That's when the knee problems started to come back. There's a loss of strength accompanied by pain when putting too much pressure on the knee. Walking is not a problem, but carrying heavy loads is no longer possible. Not sure of all the details, as it's a friend's wife. I offered to help put the bike/kit together as they're both over 75.

In a lot of cases the apparent lack of strength isn't that the muscle isn't strong, but pain prevents you from applying full tension with it. Reducing the bend in the knee with short cranks and spinning freely (easier with shorties) often helps. That she has no trouble walking, where the knee isn't loaded while bent, suggests that reducing the bend MAY help. She should run this past her Ortho and PT to get their opinion.

If she's a candidate for knee replacement, everyone I know who's had one, including my wife, says they should have done it sooner. 7 weeks after Jane's TKR she was climbing much better than before. And she rode 9 miles the day before her surgery. But after replacement, a lot of people lose range of motion and still need shorties. I've sold at least 100 sets 100mm or shorter to adults. Many to people with knee replacements whose PT wasn't aggressive enough.

If you want to have them contact me I can help them determine if short cranks are likely to help. I have all the work I want/need and would have retired years ago if there was someone else, anywhere on the planet, doing the work. So if her situation doesn't warrant shorties, I won't try to talk them into anything to try to make a sale. If nothing else, I can offer her some strategies for biking with bad knees. And Jane can share her experience with the Copenhagen Wheel.

Mark Stonich; BikeSmith Design & Fabrication
5349 Elliot Ave S. Minneapolis, MN 55417 USA
Ph. (612) 710-9593 http://bikesmithdesign.com
https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikesmith/ (Mostly Wildlife)

Recommended reading;
Crank Length, Leg Length and Power
Short Women / Short Crank Feedback
Range of Motion Limitations & Crank Length

In case they worry that short cranks will cost her power;

I recently got a phone call from an average sized adult mountain biker who says he's climbing familiar hills 1 or 2 gears higher on 135s than he'd used with 175s before he messed his knee up. He was just hoping shorties would let him ride again. Now he wants to get back into racing. He’s in Big Bear Lake California where the “Hills” are mountains.

A local Gravel Road racer is 6'-2” (188cm) and after much trial and error finds he is fastest on 135s despite having no RoM or other issues.

Another 6’2” gent in Texas competes in long distance Brevets on 95mm cranks due to severe range of motion limits. Another man with range of motion limits is climbing the hills of San Francisco with a single 38t chainring and a 12-25 cassette, also on 95s. The fellow in San Francisco bends pedal spindles. I just heard from another gent who does the grueling 200 mile Seattle to Portland on 95s.

One of my customers, 5'-7" (170cm) tall professional triathlete Courtney Ogden, won the big money 2011 Western Australia Ironman on 145s. He's done extensive work with the people at PowerCranks where they are becoming big advocates of shorter cranks.

A few years ago a team of 4 Australian MTB racers, ranging in height from 5'10 to 6"1 won a 24 hour MTB race on 125s. With the shorter cranks they rarely had to stand. conserving energy. And they were able to get by with a single chainring, before today’s monster cassettes, because the useful RPM range is so wide with shorties. Many customers have reported that they notice themselves needing to shift much less often.

This from a serious roadie with severe range of motion limitations;
"I’m 5’8” 168lbs – regarding strength, I’m not the strongest. However, I’m not the last up the hills and can do more than my fair share on the front of the group. The 115mm Andels you made for me still have no issues what so ever, I’m on my second set of rings! Please send me another set of 115s for my new bike.”
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Knee Friendly Pedaling

Riders usually push down on the pedals by using their quads to straighten the knee joint. First pushing the pedal forward, then down. There is always going to be a bit of this going on but you can do a lot to reduce the loads on your knees.

Try concentrating on using your glutes and hip flexors to swing your knees up and down. Relax your quads and just let everything below the knee act as a connecting rod between the knees and pedals. At the bottom of the pedal stroke use your hamstrings just a little bit to pull your foot back as though you were scraping mud off your shoe. Don't consciously push forward at the top of the circle. That's when knees are most bent and the tissues around them are most vulnerable.

If you aren't clipped into the pedals, and most of the time even if you are, you don't pull up on the pedal. But the idea of using the hip flexors to lift the knee is to reduce the amount of work done by the front foot that is wasted by raising the weight of the other leg and foot. If you aren't clipped into your pedals you don't want to completely unweight the upward foot. Some contact is needed to keep it located on the pedal. A grippy pedal like a spiky MTB platform or the MKS Grip King (AKA Lambda) makes this easier.

Pedalling on the mid-foot instead of the ball of the foot reduces stress on the knee. And testing has shown that it increases endurance, at a slight cost in peak power. However, be careful to avoid toe/tire interference.

If you do this while spinning freely, in low gears, you won't have to apply much force with any single muscle group. If you aren't comfortable spinning, your cranks are probably too long. 21-21.6% of inseam is best for healthy, non-triathlets, without joint issues. When a person is uncomfortable at higher RPM it isn't due to the muscles switching from extension to contraction more often. It is because their muscles are extending and contracting at a speed that is too fast for them. This recruits more fast twitch muscles, which produce more heat and lactic acid. Shortcranks reduce this speed by moving the muscles a shorter distance per revolution. Allowing more use of slow twitch fibers for a higher comfortable cadence.

Your quads will still end up doing much of the work. But easing some of the tension pulling your patella down onto the joint can make a big difference. When I get a twinge in my knee, it reminds me to concentrate on my pedaling and I actually accelerate.

BTW I read about this type of pedaling years ago, as a way to help you spin better. So it has a double benefit.

For eBike types, think of more efficient pedaling as a way to lessen drain on your batteries.