Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
It is the older technology Bosch E-Bike. Was the C380 you rode a Smart System e-bike?
Specialized Vado 4 vs Gazelle Ultimate 380+ (long)
- Thread starter newts
- Start date
newts
Active Member
- Region
- USA
The new Gazelle has a larger battery for the same price so that's definitely good. But I find for the most part the range for my commuting and recreational use is fine. The Bosch system allows multiple batteries and one reason I got the step over frame is for the place to mount a second battery if I wanted more range (it is not cheap and difficult to add the wiring so I don't think I will but the option is there).
The Purion is fine, I just find it annoying that the trip odometer doesn't have a decimal point. I like to see progress! It also doesn't show percentage of the battery, only the 5 "legs" which are not linear. same for charging. I usually do a 40-80 charge cycle to maximize battery lifetime and I would like to know the power level more precisely. It does have mile estimator which appears fairly accurate. Lastly I would like a timer and average speed for the trip. Otherwise it does what I need and is easy to read. I don't care about bluetooth or fitness apps or maps. 90% of my riding is the same commute every day. Since it is Bosch you can upgrade to any other display they make but again, apparently it is a pain to take things apart and snake the wiring in the frame. And my biggest complaint on the better displays is they have magnet mounts to be easily stolen. I know they pitch it as you can easily remove it to prevent it being stolen but I don't want to carry around part of the bike? seems absurd. Also the other models have real time clocks that need batteries to be replaced periodically (yearly?). I hate having more consumables.
Not sure the noise you mention? The noise of the motor? It is odd for a belt driven bike it is louder than than the Brose which has the belt inside the motor and is much quieter. I got used to it though. And my friend who bought my Vado is replacing the internal belt after 4000 miles for some reason which apparently is not easy or cheap for a 3" belt...
Bottom like they are all good bikes and I am sure you will be happy with anything in that range. Hopefully the nits I pick here can help you. I know other people have different habits and use cases where the things I don't like are features.
The Purion is fine, I just find it annoying that the trip odometer doesn't have a decimal point. I like to see progress! It also doesn't show percentage of the battery, only the 5 "legs" which are not linear. same for charging. I usually do a 40-80 charge cycle to maximize battery lifetime and I would like to know the power level more precisely. It does have mile estimator which appears fairly accurate. Lastly I would like a timer and average speed for the trip. Otherwise it does what I need and is easy to read. I don't care about bluetooth or fitness apps or maps. 90% of my riding is the same commute every day. Since it is Bosch you can upgrade to any other display they make but again, apparently it is a pain to take things apart and snake the wiring in the frame. And my biggest complaint on the better displays is they have magnet mounts to be easily stolen. I know they pitch it as you can easily remove it to prevent it being stolen but I don't want to carry around part of the bike? seems absurd. Also the other models have real time clocks that need batteries to be replaced periodically (yearly?). I hate having more consumables.
Not sure the noise you mention? The noise of the motor? It is odd for a belt driven bike it is louder than than the Brose which has the belt inside the motor and is much quieter. I got used to it though. And my friend who bought my Vado is replacing the internal belt after 4000 miles for some reason which apparently is not easy or cheap for a 3" belt...
Bottom like they are all good bikes and I am sure you will be happy with anything in that range. Hopefully the nits I pick here can help you. I know other people have different habits and use cases where the things I don't like are features.
fooferdoggie
Well-Known Member
the older kiox and nyon have a screw in back that locks it in place.
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
First of all, the Smart System is a brand new system with new motors, display, battery but what is the most important: the brand new system (control system).
Bosch promised maintaining any older system for 7 years... But the countdown started several years ago.
If I ever were so mad to go for a Bosch E-Bike, I would choose something with sustainability.
Bosch promised maintaining any older system for 7 years... But the countdown started several years ago.
If I ever were so mad to go for a Bosch E-Bike, I would choose something with sustainability.
Last edited:
AvalancheRun
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
Yes, the C380 was brand new - with the Bosch Smart System, Kiox display and new 625 Wh battery. My wife actually test rode that bike, while I took out an Avignon that time. Avignon, despite being a new $5000 model sported some older basic screen with magnet adhesion. Definitely did not like that!
They have a mid step C380+ model (class 3 is a must for me!), but upon reading more into the product line the C380+ has not been updated. Old display, still 500 Wh, on sale for $4500. Would rather pay more for those updates of course..
AvalancheRun
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
I don't think they've updated the class 3 C380+ model just yet, only the class 1 C380. I completely agree with your complaints about the screen. I would love for it to read percentage, show decimals, etc. Most other screens have sufficiently modern features. The new model with Kiox was great! In fact, that and the battery update would push me towards Gazelle.
So when riding the class 1 C380 (new model), and Avignon (also new model) bikes my wife and I really loved how quiet they were. There was a little noise, but it wasn't offensive noise. The belts were super quiet compared to chains. The shop didn't have a class 3 Gazelle model in stock, but since they have a mid step C380+ coming next week they had me try out a Reis and Muller Homage with the same Bosch motor as the C380+.
The R&M was 2X as loud as the class 1 Gazelle. I later saw some youtube videos of the C380+ where it sounded the same. Now, to be clear it was audible but not annoying. The Turbo Vado 4.0 had some nasty brake squeal, like a 15 kHz tone. I'm hoping it was because the bike had zero miles and the brakes needed bedding.
Sorry for threadjacking, hopefully it helps someone else who is also deciding between these two bikes! Totally agree that they are both very good.
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
That is correct.
Buy phone mount and find app that displays everything you need or bike computer like garmin.
I had Intuvia and replaced for Purion as found Intuvia to distracting. Prefer to look at scenery than a computer display.
About only thing I miss on Intuvia is time, just to know if I'm running late on commute.
Had it fall off MTBing while push through bush, luckily I found it. Can bolt them on.
While top loading in frame battery on Gazelle is fiddly, there is no chance of it falling out. Needing key instal it is biggest gripe. Had old powerpacks fall off when not clicked home correctly. Given choice go with powertube as broken powerpack batteries are very expensive to replace, even worst if it happens in middle of nowhere and stuck with long ride home with no assist.
Given I mostly charge battery while in bike, rarely need to remove powertube battery.
Given I mostly charge battery while in bike, rarely need to remove powertube battery.
JselRollTide
New Member
- Region
- USA
If you wanted to ride around with a frame mounted child seat and a 30 pound kid in the back, would you feel comfortable/confident on either of these bikes?
AvalancheRun
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
Both have the MIK system (Mounting Is Key), so you could search for MIK child seats.
Gazelle has a page on child seats:
All about e-bikes with child seats | Gazelle
Can you fit a child seat on an e-bike? Read here what you should look out for and which bike is best suited.
Since, I commented earlier I should add that wife and I both went with 2023 C380 models, despite my earlier insistence on class 3.
If they are older gen3 65nm performance line you can get dongles to get around speed limit.Both have the MIK system (Mounting Is Key), so you could search for MIK child seats.
Gazelle has a page on child seats:
All about e-bikes with child seats | Gazelle
Can you fit a child seat on an e-bike? Read here what you should look out for and which bike is best suited.www.gazellebikes.com
Since, I commented earlier I should add that wife and I both went with 2023 C380 models, despite my earlier insistence on class 3.
AvalancheRun
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
It's the newest one with smart system (75 nm). I thought about that, but I only hit 22 mph max on my Strava anyway. After thinking about it more, riding faster than that in my area is too risky
I just bought a c380+. First thing I did was change the display to a Nyon. Now, I find the biketo be fantastic. Gazelle should upgrade the display as an update. The Purion is simply inadequate on a 5k bike.
AvalancheRun
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
We ended up getting C380s and I feel that it’s a fine bike, but way overpriced. I actually ripped off the Kiox 300 in favor of the Flow app (excellent app). The smart system button pad is all you really need. Glad to hear you the Nyon is working out for you.
Some of us prefer to look at countryside when riding instead of yet another computer screen, in which case Purion is just fine. Why pay for something we don't need or use.
AvalancheRun
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
That was why I got rid of it. If I want maps/stats, phone is there (as an option). Otherwise the Kiox was distracting. Knowing exact speed at all times isn’t important.
Varia radar requires the phone to be in an audible location anyway, and definitely wasn’t having two screens on a bicycle.
The newer Kiox purion adds a screen to the button controller which was previously perfect.
AvalancheRun
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
The great thing about this system (and I've been critical of it), is the information isn't stored in the screen. So with screen, or without, that info is there. (may require phone in proximity, can't say as I never ride without my phone*)
Nice that it's set up in a way that provides space for owner customization.
Anyway, back to your main point - yes, the $5k price is too high imo.
Nice that it's set up in a way that provides space for owner customization.
Anyway, back to your main point - yes, the $5k price is too high imo.
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