New to the forum. Few questions.

[Zeppelin99]

Hey so I'm Nick and I'm new here. I'm deciding on getting an ebike as I dont have a drivers license and looking to commute to work (I'm an electrician)
I live in NB Canada and we have some pretty nasty roads in the Winter so I was deciding on a fatbike.
I want something that will go faster than 32km/h when using it off road (preferably around 60km/h top speed.
I also want to put a cap of nothing more than $3000. I found some good options with luna cycle and hpc but the issue is that their pre built bikes that I was interested in are sold out and also that the exchange rate from canada to us dollars is high and added with shipping it would cost over an additional $1000 at least.
I'm wondering if there's any canadian companies similar to luna cycle or hpc or my second option would be to build it my self (buy a fatbike and the parts needed from luna cycle) although I'm worried that I'll mess it up.
Thoughts?

 

[AguassissiM]

@Zeppelin99

Welcome to the forum.
Have a look here and talk to Garry he may be able to help.

 

[Zeppelin99]

Grin Technologies in Vancouver BC, Canada

Home page

Grin Technologies

www.ebikes.ca

They're very well known in both USA and Canada for developing the Satiator charger, Phaserunner controller and GMAC motor.

Here's useful tool.

Motor Simulator - Tools

Our ebike motor simulator allows you to easily simulate the different performance characteristics of different ebike setups - with a wide selection of hub motors modeled, and the ability to add custom batteries and controllers and set a wide variety of vehicle parameters you'll be able to see...

www.ebikes.ca

Thank you for the info.
I was thinking about getting a geared (maybe 7 speed) fat bike and then getting a mid drive motor for steep uphills in the city. I was thinking the cyclone https://lunacycle.com/cyclone-mid-drive-3000w-planetary-kit/ paired with a good 72v lithium battery https://m.ca.dhgate.com/product/72v...785071|103006001|CA|liuzedongkkkk|m|2|#pd-103

But now looking at the info you sent I see the GMAC motor is a geared hub? Does that mean it could work with switching between gears on a 7 speed despite it not being a mid drive? Also would I have the ability to switch between pedal assist and just strictly throttle? Lately if the battery does die can I see bike normally to get home?
Thanks again.

 

[tomjasz]

40mph (64km/h) with the MAC motor, and it wasn't even pushing its limit.

Please show me some evidence of that. Which MAC motor wind?

Here's useful tool.

Motor Simulator - Tools

Our ebike motor simulator allows you to easily simulate the different performance characteristics of different ebike setups - with a wide selection of hub motors modeled, and the ability to add custom batteries and controllers and set a wide variety of vehicle parameters you'll be able to see...

www.ebikes.ca

If you use the tool, you posted, you'll see how this is not possible!

To the OP...

In order to hit 40MPH you'd need a 35A controller, a 72V battery, and you'd overheat in under 20 minutes.

GMAC with 72V will squeak out 35MPH but may have heat issues too.

getting to 40MPH is a wall for most kits. Stealth eBikes with 3000W plus hub drives in motorcycle rims or ramped up Cyclones will get you there.

BUT this forum is hardly the right place to learn. See endless_sphere.com or Luna's forum for help that won't provide the misinformation already delivered here.

 

[Feliz]

I think the OP needs a motorcycle, you can't safely ride a bike at those speeds on "bad roads".

On second though, I put away my motorcycles every winter, two wheels and snow, slush, and ice don't mix. it's one thing to go out and play in the snow with fat tires but commuting?

 

[rich c]

Really? Ebike commuting is a thing all winter long in New Brunswick? A fat bike will do no better than a mid size tire with studs, probably worse. When streets are frozen, the fat tire will be worse as it "hunts" from rut to rut. You have read that battery range drops dramatically in the cold, right? It took me 9 months to heal from a crash on ice with my fat bike that happened last January.

 

[Zeppelin99]

I didn't feel the need to mention that I would not be driving it at 60kmh during winter months, felt that was self explanatory. I would drive it at low speeds on crappy roads as does everyone driving a car..

 

[rich c]

I didn't feel the need to mention that I would not be driving it at 60kmh during winter months, felt that was self explanatory. I would drive it at low speeds on crappy roads as does everyone driving a car..

But as mentioned, riding at 60kmh is a pretty big challenge for an assisted bicycle any time of the year. The human body is quite an aerodynamic brick wall and it really takes the energy over 35kmh. I ride a lot at 35kmh, but you dramatically drop the range when you get over 45kmh.

 

[Zeppelin99]

This fella is doing 40mph with a cyclone 3000 motor and 72v 24ah battery and he did 15 miles with 60% battery life remaining. The average commute to work certainly wouldnt be any more than 15 miles tops and I could always charge it at work

 

[rich c]

This fella is doing 40mph with a cyclone 3000 motor and 72v 24ah battery and he did 15 miles with 60% battery life remaining. The average commute to work certainly wouldnt be any more than 15 miles tops and I could always charge it at work

I thought you said earlier that $3000 was your cap?

 

[tomjasz]

I


MAC motor and Bafang Ultra are both worth looking into.

Timpo, you are a great fella who goes out of his way to be helpful, but so often you share your Google experience. Pretty good copy and link pastes. But more often than not anecdotes and zero experience. Continuing to post Ebikes.ca links and advising readers to use their motor spec calculators but when we do your claims are oblivious of the simulation FACTS.

neither motor is 40mph capable . Period.

maybe we should share our direct experience not regurgitate opinions. Perhaps helping new fellas with misinformation is not really useful and perhaps even dangerous?

50mph if he wants...but only with a product best suited for advanced users, pushing sketchy safety limits

i have an acquaintance that runs his major upgrade cyclone on a recumbent. Very capable of 40mph. JohnCR on ES perhaps one of the best high speed “eBike “ builders

i went a few weeks just not reading your posts and responding. It’s probably viewed as being a dick most often correcting you, but in my option it’s best to not comment if you’re going to continue with the anecdotes.

I built one crazy fast 2WD MAC. Just because I could but it was a dangerous bike. I didn’t commit to keeping the build as the cost of making it a safe bike was quite a high cost. Damn it was fun, until I needed to stop.

Again your advised link clearly demonstrates those two motors are not capable of 40mph.

a $700 Crystalyte The Crown motor will do 41mph 100% throttle Statoraide and cooling fins could push that but not at cyclone prices.

 

[ROCebike]

This fella is doing 40mph with a cyclone 3000 motor and 72v 24ah battery and he did 15 miles with 60% battery life remaining. The average commute to work certainly wouldnt be any more than 15 miles tops and I could always charge it at work

Riding in the passing lane and in the blind spot of a pick up truck, this guy is quickly going to a hospital.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Riding in the passing lane and in the blind spot of a pick up truck, this guy is quickly going to a hospital.

In the cemetery, rather. The number of "fast & furious" on this Forum exceeds the gates of perception. The fella has no driving license and wants to ride 60 km/h offroad in the Winter...

 

[ROCebike]

Guys like this are what’s preventing regulatory acceptance of ebikes. Cuomo recently vetoed another NYS attempt to introduce Class 3

 

[ROCebike]

I would think that a good lawyer would put Luna Cycles on the hook for selling a 3000 W kit that kills someone. They know better and know what their customers are doing with these kits. No liability waiver will stand up in court with Luna’s existing knowledge.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Do you know if Ferrari and Lamborghini know that their customers might attempt to break the legal speed limit?
What about Ducati or Kawasaki?

The point is no production car or motorcycle is made illegally while Luna is illegal from the start. I'd like to see the Certificate of Conformity for a Luna product. The big brands all deliver CoCs with their Class 3 e-bikes.

Germany is an interesting example. There is no speed limit on big part of German motorways, allowing people drive their cars 250 km/h if they want. At the same time, Germany is the most strict European country regarding e-bike safety. Some food for thoughts.

 

[tomjasz]

I would think that a good lawyer would put Luna Cycles on the hook for selling a 3000 W kit that kills someone. They know better and know what their customers are doing with these kits. No liability waiver will stand up in court with Luna’s existing knowledge.

How so? The products all have disclaimers. A lawyer needs a money source to collect. Bet yer bottom dollar there’s few available assets. Unless someone could prove malice and intent someone is gonna die and someone else will pay the bills. Probably not the shop. Certainly Cyclone in China won’t be touched.

A number of kit companies have been peddling high speed kits, and a majority of those are kits outside of all State and Federal street legal guidelines. This is nothing new. DIY folks have been exceeding good judgement for over a decade. EBR is a bit of a bubble that perhaps atypical eBike riders post in. Do a quick search here for 1000w and you’ll find a bunch of motor threads.

So far eBikes are largely outside of any enforcement. Ten minutes of googling will find scores of eVehicles that many would consider rational. But then we tolerate a number of high death rate activities daily. Second amendment activities come to mind.

“Society gets the criminals it deserves.” We tolerate the limits and call it freedom of choice. Sorry for the extreme cynicism but there are thousands of similar high powered eBikes only resembling bikes because someone hung a bottom bracket and pedals on the frames.

California DOT has no interest in enforcing rules and standards. For that matter only Coumo in NY is the only visible politician stepping on eBike growth. It’s really still the American Wild West.

 

[tomjasz]

The point is no production car or motorcycle is made illegally while Luna is illegal from the start. I'd like to see the Certificate of Conformity for a Luna product. The big brands all deliver CoCs with their Class 3 e-bikes.

Germany is an interesting example. There is no speed limit on big part of German motorways, allowing people drive their cars 250 km/h if they want. At the same time, Germany is the most strict European country regarding e-bike safety. Some food for thoughts.

Illegal? Maybe in Poland. Cyclone motors aren’t made illegally. They could be run at 750w. It’s not illegal to own a cage motor capable of three times the speed limit.

I have seen more than a few very fast “eBikes”, and frankly they’re much more road worthy, especially with braking performance, than any number of class 3 bikes. I often discourage and vett kit builders when I see they’re being risky. There a helluva lot of Walmart $250 bikes with $1000 high speed kits. Remember we can own items reserved to armed forces use in most countries.

 

[erider_61]

I am looking at buying an 8,000 Watt Merkava mainly because of the 120 km max range. The fact that in can do 95 kph is not part of the equation although I am sure I will travel faster than I currently do on my 40 kph Voltbike Bravo.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Illegal? Maybe in Poland. Cyclone motors aren’t made illegally.

Certainly, Cyclone e-bikes are not illegal while made in China. If they are, however, imported to the U.S. and are not restricted to 750 W and to 28 mph these become illegal. If these are imported in Canada and are not restricted to 32 km/h, tell me they are legal. You might use the Cyclone in Europe if it were restricted to 4 kW and to 45 km/h. Provided the Certificate of Conformity comes with the bike. Does it? Does a Cyclone sport the Vehicle Identification Number?

I must plainly say it is not "the freedom of choice" Thomas. It is the extreme egoism endangering the riders and people nearby.