mid drives are not for everyone/throttles are fine

[vincent]

i am going to post this and not spend hours of my time defending it, but again today i saw a post where someone was asking for help with picking a class 2 bike and half or more of the replies were about how they did not need throttle??????

going to list 2 examples of my friends and mid drives vs hub with throttle bikes right now

sold a good friend of mine my haibike yamaha hardtail mtn bike when my wattwagon got here
this friend does not ride bikes but has ridden hours and several times 30-40 miles with me on the radmini, some other hub motor 20 inch bikes i had and the rad rover and done fine

she had ridden the yamaha a few times with me , it fits her, she is a light and fit woman and i thought it was going to be a great bike for her
yamaha is rock solid reliable and i wanted her to have a good bike

she has not done well with it, it is exhausting her
she is getting halfway through the rides, getting tired and falling- she has never fallen riding the rad power bikes with me for much longer distances

i sold her husband a flx trail bike with way more torque/power and she is having to ride that
the extra power on the flx and throttle are making a big difference
and now i am considering finding a rad city, mini , aventon, ride 1up etc some other kind of quicker bike to trade her the yamaha back if she wants
i feel really bad that i sold her a bike that is not working well

the reasons she is not doing well with this bike are quite a few
it is an under powered euro spec bike, they live in some BIG hills- will it climb them? absolutely, it will also take a lot out of you doing it
riding is something she wants to do 4-6 times a month with her husband, this is not her only hobby, she has horses
half the time she gets on the yamaha she probably got up at 5am and rode horses for 3 hours, she is tired going into it
so she doesnt want to learn how to shift the gears perfect and become a big time bike rider, she wants to ride a couple of hours with her husband on the weekends and be able to keep up with him and have fun

my bikes are my only hobby and all my extra time is spent riding, that is not my friend and never will be



another friend owns a ranch
he has ridden mtn bikes a LOT with one of his daughters that was on the mtn bike team in college, he knows how to shift gears to climb hills etc

i left him my bagi bike 500 watt hub motor and a yamaha mid drive
they have some huge hills on this ranch
really thought he would like the yamaha but no, he likes the motor on the bagibike way more

for what he needs to do dragging stuff around the ranch etc it is a better , quicker power bike
and it is climbing those hills SUPER easy which surprised me

yes an ultra bike would probably work for both of these people but would be very heavy and expensive


i think a lot of us forget this is a part time deal for others, yes they MAY end up riding a lot more in the future and some of them may get into this a lot like most of us are

but others have families to take care of, limited time to ride, other hobbies etc
they want to ride 4-5 times a month but cannot wipe themselves out riding a lower powered bike in hard terrain just because it "feels" more like a bike
they dont care about that

these are not their goals, they are YOUR goals

there are nicely programmed cadence bikes, not all cadence are on/off switches

i am disappointed in this forum the way some of the people with several expensive mid drives that obviously ride a lot/ several times a week judge others on the fact that they want something different from their bikes
i would like to hear more from people that are casual riders and that are not drinking the koolaid
every post gets overloaded with 10 people on here that bash throttles and push mid drives

i met a couple several months ago on a bike trail, they bought sondors on the first round kickstarter, they have been riding those for years and love them
they have no desire to upgrade or get anything different, those bikes are doing everything they want
and that is PERFECTLY ok

lots of people bought pedego and have probably been riding them for years

lots of people bought rad power bikes and have done great with them

there are plenty of nice hub drives out there that will do great for a lot of people

lots of people are just riding their cheap hub bikes on the weekends and not on this forum talking about bikes

 

[FlatSix911]

Good analysis... certainly different strokes for different folks. The bottom line... more people on bikes of any kind is a good thing.

I've been a cyclist for many years and I'm a Mid-drive guy... lots of my friends are weekend warriors and love their throttles.

 

[Katysax]

I agree with you. I am a long-time cyclist but over 65 with health issues. I have both a hub bike with pedal sensor and a Como with torque sensor And mid drive. The hub bike with pedal sensor and throttle is easier to ride. The difference is subtle, but the hub bike gives you a little push. I can modulate to where I do little to no work. On the Como in turbo mode i still have to work. I honestly think that many/most people who are casual cyclists would enjoy the cadence sensor and throttle more. I like both. For my longer rides I prefer the Como. For errands and tooling around the neighborhood I prefer the hub bike with cadence sensor and throttle. I rarely touch the throttle but there are times when it is nice to have.

 

[vincent]

Katysax nice write up on the differences

 

[Stefan Mikes]

but the hub bike gives you a little push.

The mid-motor gives you a lot of pull

 

[Nova Haibike]

i saw a post where someone was asking for help with picking a class 2 bike and half or more of the replies were about how they did not need throttle??????

I don't know why it should irk you. Everyone is entitled to post their opinion. It is an open forum, after all. We all have our opinions and life experiences. As long as people are polite and respectful, offering another POV should be welcomed, not discouraged.

 

[vincent]

because that was not was the person was asking - they did not ask whether they should get a class1 or class2 bike
they wanted suggestions for a good class 2 bike

they did not ask for anyones opinion on whether they needed a throttle or not

 

[onlineaddy]

Why do you care what other people think? Why do you feel the need to get others on your side? I thought you were tired of these throttle debates: why start another?

Get the right tools for the job and enjoy.

Personally I got my first e-bike with a throttle. I’ve come to realize that I don’t have to have the throttle. But, having it doesn’t hurt for the rare occasions I use it.

That’s me, and it may or may not be for others. As the saying goes, YMMV.

 

[byunbee]

@vincent, your point is valid. Unfortunately, it's just human nature that people have opinions and sometimes whether your want it or not, they will push their opinions onto others, not just on forums, but in everyday life. I know I'm guilty of this.

All I can say is it is what it is.

 

[vincent]

honestly this post was not for the people on this forum posting all the time or for me- it was mainly for newbies

and maybe for the mid drive pushers to open their minds and realize everyone does not want the same thing from their bike as they do



i certainly do not care what anyone else thinks, feel very knowledgable in my pick of bikes for me lol
i am on this forum to learn about new products coming out and increase my knowledge of ebikes/batteries etc

 

[vincent]

if you read through the numerous post on new people asking for suggestions on an ebike, especially if they mention throttle the whole thread turns into throttles suck and you dont need a throttle

 

[PatriciaK]

I think it's important that someone who has never ridden an ebike before TRY different drive and class bikes to see how they feel BEFORE buying, and that's what I usually recommend. Also, if I notice something particular in a forum with regard to how a specific bike handles, I mention that and suggest the prospective buyer check out the brand forum for more information.

Of course, I love my bike, and if someone is looking for something similar I do recommend checking out the brand and model. Nothing wrong with that.

Everyone is entitled to express their opinions, as long as they do so respectfully, so not sure why this matters to the OP. But, that's his opinion, so, ok then .

 

[Nova Haibike]

if you read through the numerous post on new people asking for suggestions on an ebike, especially if they mention throttle the whole thread turns into throttles suck and you dont need a throttle

I don't think I have ever read anyone say "throttles suck," only that they either aren't necessary, or that they had or have one and rarely use it.

Newbies ask questions, looking for guidance. If a more experienced person offers an opinion, the newbie can ignore it, reject it, or embrace it. Regardless, the only way to know is to experience it..whatever it may be...yourself.

 

[vincent]

have you noticed how many people come here and ask for suggestions on a bike and never come back- even to their own threads
could it be when these people ask for help on picking a bike the threads run into opinions from 10-15 of the same posters and devolve into throttle vs no throttle and mid drive vs hub


what i am realizing is this forum is really small and the majority of long term/majority posters are probably at best 50
we dont seem to be picking up a lot of new posters
if we do they are in the sub forums on their particular brands- often the cheap hub brands so many of the main posters would dismiss as junk

when i ride the loop in tucson i see pedegos, rad power bikes, bbshd kits
sometimes i will see a specialized but not near as often as the first 2
but i dont get the impression these people are on the forum, they are probably happy with their bikes but we dont hear from them


this is my last post on this, maybe on the forum in general
i dont feel like i help people much on here because any post where i mention throttle is overrun with that discussion only
it is pretty much a waste of my time
i will support ravis bikes and pushkar but i am not someone who continues to waste my time on something i do not think is effective
hopefully some newbies will come across this thread in their research and the first few posts that pertained to the thread title will help them

 

[steve marino]

I'm with you Vincent. I stopped posting too because it's sort of a one mind thing going on. If someone mentions an opinion that differs too far from the group hive mind, there's a ridiculous amount of criticism. It's far too nanny and PC too. You can plainly see this from a popular post that is gaining so much attention, and it's devoted to someone that is happy that a biker was busted for riding an eBike w/o pedals? I mean, come on, that is just petulant childishness. Why would anyone be happy over that?

There is one forum w/ the initials E.S. that's about the only real eBike forum around, and those folks really know what they're talking about because they build their bikes and even batteries from scratch.

Granted, not everyone here is as I described, but enough are to make it an unpleasant experience. I think nearly all internet forums are populated by busy body types who are sticklers for little bitty rules, and it either makes the forums into rah rah cheer leaders for certain ideas, and/or makes the forums pretty toxic and disagreeable. Free wheeling, unique, fun people that respect someone else's right to have an opinion that's different are in the minority. Scarce as hen's teeth actually. It's not an age thing though. I'm nearly 70, but I'm rebellious, creative, enthusiastic and have new ideas. Some people are just plain born old and are conformists, is what it is.

 

[MarkF]

I knew I wanted a throttle but saw the throttle debates and decided not to ask. I did my own searching and liked the Raleigh retroglide with throttle. I bought the bike and love it. I don't like that it only goes 20 mph only so my next bike will be a class 3 with throttle. That really limits whats available. I was glad to see Pushkar and Ravi talk about coming out with bikes that look great and have throttle options. I will always encourage anyone looking for a bike with throttle with my own stories of liking a bike with throttle.

 

[Deacon Blues]

To throttle or not to throttle....that is the question, and I'm living it.
I have a throttle on my ebike, but seldom use it. My wife has a throttle on her ebike and loves it.
I tried convincing her that she didn't need a throttle, but in the end I realized that people like what they like. What works for me doesn't work for my wife.

Telling someone they don't need a throttle is really telling someone that THEY don't need a throttle and therefore, neither should you.

 

[dAz63]

Both my bikes have throttles, I only use the throttle for walking the bike up a slope, the cruiser has a 500w rear hub motor, I prefer it for longer trips and have passed 12000km in 2.5 years, it climbs hills ok, the other bike an older mountain bike with a BBSHD fitted, I mainly use it for shopping pulling a trailer, climbs hills no problem,

with the hub motor I have it on full assist and first gear in climbing a steep local hill, the middrive on the other hand climbs the same hill in first gear with much less effort, this is on assist level 4 out of 9 and with a full trailer.

 

[E-Wheels]

Bottom line... more people on bikes of any kind is a good thing

^this

 

[ruffruff]

Hmmm I think this site is pretty civilized compared to some.

Throttle vs non-throttle.
All depends on the job for me.
I would never own a hunting bike without a throttle.
Single track EMTB bike. no throttle for me.