How the heck do I legally ship a spare ebike battery domestically???

magnus-carta

New Member
How the heck do I ship a spare e-bike battery???
Just the battery, no bike.

It is a 480Wh Lithium Ion battery for a Specialized Turbo Vado.

Unfortunately, the local FedEx and UPS stores said they are unable to pack it up for me.

It is being shipped domestically. So it can go via ground.

I've been really trying to figure it out but it's all very confusing... ANY HELP WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED!!! 🙏🙏🙏
 
Will they ship it if you pack it properly? FedEX, Ups, USPS? Maybe a YouTube video on how to pack it or the links from JRA above.
Please post how it works out.
 
Usually the one requirement that is discussed is the state of charge that a lithium battery is at optimally for shipment like somewhere in the 50% range? So in order to check this does the shipper take the senders word for it or do they require a test at the shipping office and then package the unit if it meets the criteria? It isn't rocket science but does have consequences so care should be taken of course.

I have opened up shipments of Hailong style batteries direct from China with no hazardous labeling at all on them with 4-6 17.5Ah packs in each box. However I felt that they were packed quite well using an air pack system that enclosed each battery in a womb of heavier than normal air pack plastic and air. At the same place a guy walked in with a similar battery shipped from USA Bafang Direct unprotected in a Priority Mail envelope......didn't seem like as good an idea to me. Obviously when asked if anything liquid, fragile or potentially hazardous someone wasn't honest....

As time goes on the issue of sending batteries around for whatever reason is going to be more and more common and hopefully the major shippers will get their collective acts together to rise to the challenge. As well as recycling them which is being addressed by a few companies already but they have to get to the recycling centers somehow also. The regulations are firmly in place it is just a matter of following them and the resulting charges to do so, which I am afraid won't be cheap.
 
Will they ship it if you pack it properly? FedEX, Ups, USPS? Maybe a YouTube video on how to pack it or the links from JRA above.
Please post how it works out.
FedEx stores cannot take dangerous goods or hazmat. Li Batteries this size are regulated class 9 hazardous goods. Probably some variability with UPS as many locations are franchises.

So yes, packaging is relatively easy (battery packaging from eBay), the proper markings are not particularly hard, but you do have to be certified and the shipment processed as as a hazmat shipment.

Like any other heavily regulated material (alcohol, tobacco, chemicals, etc) just because you can get it off a store shelf doesn't mean it's easy for an individual to ship it.

PS:
shipper=the person/company who wants to get an item from point A to point B. The shipper is ultimately responsible for ensuring that their shipment complies with laws and regulations.
carrier=the company contracted to transport said item from point A to point B.
 
Legal. You had to say legal. No, I don't see what you can do. I looked into it a while back, to sell a commercial 48v pack. I can't imagine the shippers taking the package if you are honest. In the old days, I used to get LiPO hobby cells (from the King) and they came Priority, in a box with no packing. But lately I've bought LFP cells and it seems like my 40 or 50 cells cost $30-40 to ship. They look legal with the 'Ground Only' labeling. Does anyone do anything for that money, beyond some label or a computer entry? Is it just a ground shipment? I once did a post for an alt energy forum asking if there was any way to move this issue, get some change. The post was removed. People don't want to know. They do what they do. So Amazon bullies the shippers to eat most of the cost. The Chinese just break the law. Some recyclers are completely honest, some are fudging, probably the watt hours. You just can't buy a used pack like the stuff on Hookup unless you are getting a fairly large amount of watt hours.

But I know I can't ship anything. It's not the companies, it's the end user consumer who is stuck. Cheating does seem to be a competitive advantage. I tried to sell a pack "Locally For Delivery", but no takers.
 
FedEx stores cannot take dangerous goods or hazmat. Li Batteries this size are regulated class 9 hazardous goods. Probably some variability with UPS as many locations are franchises.

So yes, packaging is relatively easy (battery packaging from eBay), the proper markings are not particularly hard, but you do have to be certified and the shipment processed as as a hazmat shipment.

Like any other heavily regulated material (alcohol, tobacco, chemicals, etc) just because you can get it off a store shelf doesn't mean it's easy for an individual to ship it.

PS:
shipper=the person/company who wants to get an item from point A to point B. The shipper is ultimately responsible for ensuring that their shipment complies with laws and regulations.
carrier=the company contracted to transport said item from point A to point B.
^^^This. 100%^^^

The last bit by @BlackHand is not to be underestimated. The shipper is the person who is fully responsible for the movement of that hazmat package, from the moment he packs and ships it, all the way to it's endpoint and even to it's disposal. It's a heck of a burden placed on a singular person. And it requires federal certification and qualification to store, pack and ship hazmat. Back in my active duty days and solely responsible as the Hazmat Officer at my CG small boat station, that certification was achieved by an intensive week of training at a naval school. So one can begin to understand why the typical ebike owner cannot be considered the shipper; and that the burden cannot be put upon the guy or gal down at the local UPS Store as to determining whether your ebike battery is safe to ship.

Last summer, I purchased a Yamaha 500wh battery from a shop in CA. I live in NJ. The battery was packed properly in it's special cardboard shipping box, built to withstand the shocks or drops in the course of shipment. It was properly labeled with the prominent hazmat shipping stickers, including the all important UN number, UN3480, as well as the name of the initial shipper (bike shop owner) and with instructions that this package cannot be flown. The battery itself, when I checked the state of the charge out of the box, was reading 0 bars; indicating to me that the battery was in a discharged, deep sleep mode that Yamaha employs when shipping out a new battery. It was shipped cross country by UPS Ground. I can't even begin to think how a battery is drawn down to where the BMS puts it into a deep sleep, by the typical ebike owner.....

UN3480 can be found in this DOT pdf: https://www.phmsa.dot.gov/sites/phmsa.dot.gov/files/2021-09/Lithium-Battery-Guide.pdf Caution: reading this stuff will make your head spin; it did mine.

@indianajo actually has the most practical answer to the movement of an ebike battery by the owner to it's new destination. This is a great topic for someone who is currently qualified to ship ebike batteries as hazmat, to chime in as to the options open for the typical ebike owner who might want to get his/her ebike battery to a Rebuild Facility or say, they want to go on a vacation in a place hundreds or thousands of miles away from their home.
 
Hazmat shipper certification is very expensive.
Not at all true. The book was more expensive than the certificate. BUT very few battery builders have certified their batteries. Only one EM3ev pack has full UN cert. I’m guessing our ever helpful Jenny and UPP are not any more proactive . It’s the battery pack version very that is expensive. I gave up when I realized I could lose it all on a single event. California eBike insurance carrier paid out $50,000 for a UPP pack that the original buyer resold on eBay. All in all it’s just a fucked up mess.
 
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The battery itself, when I checked the state of the charge out of the box, was reading 0 bars; indicating to me that the battery was in a discharged, deep sleep mode that Yamaha employs when shipping out a new battery.
I have received a brand new Specialized 604 Wh battery at the LBS. The battery was taken out of the box, and a techie just attached the battery cover before handing out the battery to me, so it was never activated.

Can anyone confirm I can keep that battery "as is" and only charge it for the first time when I actually need it?

It is not the first battery I've got. The Giant LBS person told me he would now "activate" a new Giant battery by charging it before the LBS released the new e-bike to me.
 
Anyone have suggestions for shipping an e-bike battery from the US to Europe? You Can carry onto planes (NOT checked luggage) up to 160Wh batteries. I have a specialized Levo SL and want to ship it to Italy. I'm coming up with NOTHING!!
 
Some bike shops rent ebike batteries, such as this one in Colorado:


Rentals are also showing up in parts of Europe:


And:


You can also call the LBS in the area where you plan to travel and see if they can provide a rental battery.

Many who frequently travel to the same places, make arrangements to keep a spare battery & charger on site. I met a fellow rider at a trailhead last summer who was from the UK. He bought a battery at a LBS here in the US who agreed to store & charge for him when needed.
 
Anyone have suggestions for shipping an e-bike battery from the US to Europe? You Can carry onto planes (NOT checked luggage) up to 160Wh batteries. I have a specialized Levo SL and want to ship it to Italy. I'm coming up with NOTHING!
Nope. As we speak, there is a giant car carrier ship at sea, on fire, in the Atlantic, having been abandoned and left to burn itself out. It is thought that the fire may have originated in the battery pack or packs of electric cars onboard. These were brand new, off the assembly line, high end German cars.

Figure on shipping the bike without the battery to Italy, then once there, buy a brand new battery. And when you leave IT, figure on having to sell it there.

We can't even come up with a reliable & consistent means of battery transport across state's lines from owner to end-point, let alone doing it crossing the continent and ocean.

If anything, I expect a major crackdown in the transport of these batteries by the shipping industries, sea and air cause they don't like the idea of entire ships sinking to the bottom of the ocean because a lithium ion battery shorted out and created an out of control Class D fire.....
 
Anyone have suggestions for shipping an e-bike battery from the US to Europe? You Can carry onto planes (NOT checked luggage) up to 160Wh batteries. I have a specialized Levo SL and want to ship it to Italy. I'm coming up with NOTHING!!
Well the good news is that Specialized designed it so you CAN travel with your bike. Have your dealer pull the main battery so you can ship the bike and then carry the 160 wh range extender with you on the plane.

 
I travel internationally with a spouse who uses a electric travel wheelchair. It folds up and has the LiON batteries built into the frame, just like most of our bikes. The manufacturer has gone to the trouble of getting her product certified by IATTA that the chair, with batteries still in the frame (they are removeable too), is safe for transport on aircraft.

What does all that mean in reality? You get some almost minimum wage airport security person trying to interpret the documents and when they don't understand, the answer is always NO.

It's not always, but even once is too often. To say that I am unimpreseed with Hamburg airport would becan understatement but thankfully British Airways stepped up and intervened at the last second.

Please note - we are pretty fluent in French and German as well as our native English, and we have the supporting documents translated into Spanish as well. But for air travel, do not expect to be able to take a proper battery with you on any flights with any consistency, until someone designs a proper safe transport case for our "electron distribution assemblies".
 

Introduction​

Grin's modular LiGo battery was born in response to the massive transportation restrictions placed on large lithium ebike packs. Properly certified batteries under 100 watt-hours are even allowed aboard passenger aircraft with your carry-on luggage. Why not use this as the building block that can be easily re-assembled into a large battery?
After much design consideration we decided to implement this as a flat 10s x1p 18650 cell layout, with every battery having its own independent BMS circuit and each pack being potted to protect against the elements.

Air Travel​

Yes, these batteries really can be carried on passenger aircraft in carry-on luggage. Both we and our customers have clocked hundreds and hundreds of flights with LiGo batteries going through security without any incidents. Aaron even caught on video what happens when LiGo batteries go through the scanning belt. We recommend removing the LiGo packs from your baggage and plugging the pair of anderson connectors on each pack into each other, so that there are no exposed terminals and each pack is clearly individually contained. Airport personnel have been well trained at looking for the watt-hour rating lithium batteries and seeing if they are compliant or not.
While most airlines do not have a firmly defined maximum number of batteries under 100 Wh that can be brought aboard, we'd suggest travelling with no more than 4-5 LiGo's per person in order to avoid extra scrutiny. We have had customers travel by air with as many as 12 LiGo modules on them, but we wouldn't recommend that as a matter of course. Furthermore, if you are asked what the batteries are for it's better to say it's backup power for camping, running bright bike lights etc. than to say it's for powering an ebike. Some staff may have been told that ebike batteries are not allowed on planes because they are (almost always) well over 100 Watt-hours.

Background​

Precursor Packs to LiGoIn early 2014 we had a number of 10sx1p batteries made up with an overseas pack assembler running a basic BMS circuit and covered in shrinkwrap, using what were at the time state of the art 25R Samsung cells (for 92 Wh total). That proved the concept and let us validate the process of travelling on numerous international flights with our small battery modules, which were then stacked together on landing into a usable capacity ebike pack.
These little batteries proved useful not just on ebikes but also countless other projects too, from electric skateboards and unicycles that we took to events to portable power for camping trips and even LED boat lighting. However, we also hit many limitations with the imported units, ranging from environmental damage to randomly erratic BMS circuits to cell balancing issues. It became clear that we needed to take both the design and manufacturing in-house, and in 2016 this project picked up in earnest.

Features​

Our completed LiGo battery packs have more functions than you likely thought possible in a battery pack.
  • Rugged fiberglass encased modules can withstand 5m drop
  • Flat 20mm profile fits under skateboard decks, in small pockets etc.
  • Design allow easy stacking edgewise and lengthwise
  • Can readily stack in parallel for required capacity
  • Can be series stacked for 72V without issue
  • Integrated momentary push button for on/off and other functions
  • Ultra low quiescent current drain (<2uA in ship mode)
  • Five embedded RGB LED's for state of charge and other information
  • No spark when plugged into capacitive loads
  • Cell balancing at all voltages, not just full charge
  • IR compensated over-charge and over-discharge current protection

How They Work​

Each battery has two pairs of + and - leads on them, which are terminated in Anderson Powerpoles. That allows you to easily plug a number of packs together in parallel, and when you are done you have two Anderson connectors left over. Typically one goes into the controller and the other could run lights or act as a charging port.
Example of Parallel Connections on Stacked LiGo Batteries

To turn the battery on, press and hold the button until the first LED goes green, then on releasing the button you will see the green LEDs light up all the way and show the batteries current charge level. The top LED will then show a green heartbeat pulse letting you know that the battery pack is on.
LiGoOn.jpg

To turn the battery off, press and hold the button again until the first LED goes red. Then on releasing the button, an animation of red LEDs will scroll down telling you that the pack has turned off.
Animated GIF of LiGo Turn Off Sequence

Other LED Animations​

In addition to the turn on and turn off animations and the heartbeat, the LEDs on the LiGo communicate other states or fault conditions
  • Going to Sleep: When the LiGo is about to enter deep sleep mode (such as from pressing the button 5 times really fast), then all the red LEDs will light up and then slowly fade to darkness
  • Cell Overvoltage: If a cell voltage exceeds the cutoff voltage limit, all 5 LEDs will flash green 3 times quickly. During this cell overvoltage fault, any charge current is blocked from going into the pack but it can still be discharged. Once it has discharged a bit the overvoltage fault should go away.
  • Cell Undervoltage: When a cell voltage is below the undervoltage cutoff threshold, all 5 LEDs flash red 3 times quickly. Further discharging of the pack is blocked. If the undervoltage condition persists for too long, then the pack will enter deep sleep mode to reduce further quiescent current drain.
  • Over Temperature: If the LiGo battery gets too hot, the red LED's will light up in the center and spread outwards like a wave. This behavior will continue until the pack temperature is back down to a safe level, and both charge and discharge currents are blocked.
  • Under Temperature: If the LiGo battery is too cold to be safely charged, all 5 Cyan LEDs will flash 3 times quickly. During this time charging currents will be blocked, but the discharge port is still active. This behavior will continue until the pack has warmed up enough that charging ban be resumed.
  • Short Circuit: In the event of a short circuit on the output leads of a LiGo, the yellow LEDs will light up in the middle and spread outwards like a wave, followed by all yellow LEDs blinking together. Discharge current will be blocked until the short circuit has been removed.
  • Excessive Discharge Current: If the LiGo experiences a discharge current that is higher than the max setting but not a full short circuit, it will turn off the discharge port and animate the red LEDs from the button to the discharge port, and then fade out, repeating this cycle 3 times. Discharge current is blocked until either the load is removed, or 8 seconds has elapsed at which point it will turn back on automatically.
  • Excessive Charge Current: If the LiGo experiences a charging current that is higher than the max charge current setting, it will block additional charge current and the yellow LEDs will animate from the wires toward the button and fade out, repeating this cycle 3 times. During this fault futher charge current is blocked and will remain blocked until there is no longer a higher voltage source on the battery leads.

Videos​




Specifications​

External Specs
Nominal Voltage36.0 V
Nominal Pack Capacity2.7 Ah (2.75 for LiGo+)
Nominal Pack Energy98 Wh (99Wh for LiGo+)
Dimensions201 x 74 x21 mm
Weight610 g (1.3lb)
Internal Specs
Cell Type10s x 1p LG-MG1 (30Q for LiGo+)
Pack Resistance350 mOhm (150mOhm for LiGo+)
Discharge Current5A continuous, 10A max (15A Max for LiGo+
Quiescent Current400uA Operating, <2uA Sleep
BMS Cutout TopologyCommon Charge/Disch Port

*Final specification firmware will allow 15A (5C) burst discharge current for short times, current release always trips the BMS at 10A.

Shipping​

When we initially developed the LiGo battery modules, the shipping regulations allowed up to 20 batteries in the 20-100 Wh power range to be sent in a single box without any dangerous goods fee. Unfortunately, the DG regulations changed in April 2016 to limit this to just two batteries in a single shipment under PI-965-II.
Packing Instruction 965 Lithium Batteries
Then for reasons that were never fully explained to us, in 2017 most of the carriers (like DHL, Fedex, UPS) decided to stop accepting packages sent in this provision, requiring all shipments of pure LiGo batteries required the Dangerous Goods fee.
The situation has remained much more favorable though for LiGo batteries that are are shipped along with a motor controller and conversion kit. Batteries sent this way are considered to be packed with equiment and are shipped under UN3481 ,which allows up to 5 kg of LiGo batteries (8 pieces) to be sent with a kit without any dangerous goods fee.

Air Travel​

Yes, these batteries really can be carried on passenger aircraft in carry-on luggage. Both we and our customers have clocked hundreds and hundreds of flights with LiGo batteries going through security without any incidents. Aaron even caught on video what happens when LiGo batteries go through the scanning belt. We recommend removing the LiGo packs from your baggage and plugging the pair of anderson connectors on each pack into each other, so that there are no exposed terminals and each pack is clearly individually contained. Airport personnel have been well trained at looking for the watt-hour rating lithium batteries and seeing if they are compliant or not.
While most airlines do not have a firmly defined maximum number of batteries under 100 Wh that can be brought aboard, we'd suggest travelling with no more than 4-5 LiGo's per person in order to avoid extra scrutiny. We have had customers travel by air with as many as 12 LiGo modules on them, but we wouldn't recommend that as a matter of course. Furthermore, if you are asked what the batteries are for it's better to say it's backup power for camping, running bright bike lights etc. than to say it's for powering an ebike. Some staff may have been told that ebike batteries are not allowed on planes because they are (almost always) well over 100 Watt-hours.

Availability​

They LiGo batteries are in continuous production and available for purchase on our store page.
There can be manufacturing lead times if we have bulk orders to fulfill but most orders are able to ship out within 1 week.
 
So, it sounds like I'm up s*it Creek without a paddle for getting my 576 wh battery from USA to Colombia. A
See you're in Portland OR. There are LiIon battery rebuilders on the west coast. Maybe one of them could be persuaded for too much money to pack one for you legally.
Having some experience with the US-Mexican border, I would expect your battery to be stolen at Colombia incoming inspection anyway. Met a US customs agent son in 1974. He drove a nice new Oldsmobile & wore really nice clothes. My Dad didn't have that kind of money. I had a 15 year old car I rebuilt myself.
Panama+Colombia really need to pave a road through the Darien gap. I'd have rebuilt my Mercedes 240D and driven down there by now if it was doable. Meanwhile Honduras & Guatamala are vying to win the biggest ****pit award.
 
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