Gravel Class 3

[WattsUpDude]

what do you like about the Civante over the Rush?
What was the speedbox install like? Any problems with it?

I have a Yamaha dealer close to me with all the models. They are high on my list. I rode a BH bike last summer with the PW-se motor. Other than the creaking that everyone complains about, I loved that motor.

I actually like my Urban Rush (in it’s current state) more than the Civante. But if I went into the store and they were both full price, it’s a no-brainer to choose the Class 3 Civante for only $100 more.

The Speedbox install is pretty easy but it takes about an hour to do it right. There’s a tutorial on YouTube. And yes, I had that creaking once, too. It was the motor mounts not torque to spec.

 

[ruffruff]

What are your thoughts on a Wabash?

E Bike | Yamaha E Bikes

Yamaha e-bikes enable more roads and trails bicycle riding. Cutting edge electric bike motors, reliable, long-lasting batteries and intuitive controls make Yamaha e bikes the perfect do-more ride. Yamahabicycles.com

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[WattsUpDude]

What are your thoughts on a Wabash?

E Bike | Yamaha E Bikes

Yamaha e-bikes enable more roads and trails bicycle riding. Cutting edge electric bike motors, reliable, long-lasting batteries and intuitive controls make Yamaha e bikes the perfect do-more ride. Yamahabicycles.com

www.yamahabicycles.com

That’s the bike that I originally wanted. I don’t know of a working tuning box that will derestrict it though so you may be stuck with Class 1 speeds until one gets developed.

 

[ruffruff]

That’s the bike that I originally wanted. I don’t know of a working tuning box that will derestrict it though so you may be stuck with Class 1 speeds until one gets developed

That’s the bike that I originally wanted. I don’t know of a working tuning box that will derestrict it though so you may be stuck with Class 1 speeds until one gets developed.

Doesn't the SpeedBox work with any PW-SE?

 

[WattsUpDude]

Doesn't the SpeedBox work with any PW-SE?

It doesn’t. It’s pretty specific to the motor and display combination. Even then, there may be a specific tuner for just that year and model. I made an entire thread on it in the Yamaha section when I was on a search for it.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Specialized Creo Evo

I think it is too expensive for the OP. Also, he might be not that happy with the 240 W motor and the 320 Wh battery. Yes, I know it is a properly lightweight gravel e-bike but...

 

[jabberwocky]

The Civante might be a good choice, especially if you have a local Yamaha dealer that you like. Its setup more as a road bike from the factory, but if it has clearance for larger tires (as Saratoga Dave says), a tire swap is easy enough. The geometry is definitely in the "endurance road bike" territory, so its relatively slack and has a long wheelbase. I'm guessing it would handle gravel just fine. Only real nod to its road bike heritage is that low BB drop (so the cranks are higher off the ground; makes handling a little twitchier but lets you pedal through corners easier).

Class 3 from the factory and the price is good. Parts are fine for the price.

 

[WattsUpDude]

The Civante might be a good choice, especially if you have a local Yamaha dealer that you like. Its setup more as a road bike from the factory, but if it has clearance for larger tires (as Saratoga Dave says), a tire swap is easy enough. The geometry is definitely in the "endurance road bike" territory, so its relatively slack and has a long wheelbase. I'm guessing it would handle gravel just fine. Only real nod to its road bike heritage is that low BB drop (so the cranks are higher off the ground; makes handling a little twitchier but lets you pedal through corners easier).

Class 3 from the factory and the price is good. Parts are fine for the price.

It’ll likely take a 45mm wide tire. That would be really plush for mixed riding.

 

[jabberwocky]

It’ll likely take a 45mm wide tire. That would be really plush for mixed riding.

Yeah, I run 40s on my non-electric and 45s on the Revolt ebike. The Civante comes with pretty wide tires (35s) from the factory.

 

[Saratoga Dave]

I like the idea of the Wabash and looked at one when I bought the Civante… but weirdly, it comes with smaller tires than the Civ, 33mm vs 35. I don’t know what the clearance looks like for larger, but that doesn’t seem like enough tire for real dirt or rocky type gravel, to me at least. Plus the Civ gives you that whole 25 mph on the way home thing after a long ride

 

[jabberwocky]

The fact that the Wabash is only class 1 is a little weird. I'll note that the geometry between the Civante and Wabash are almost identical. It wouldn't surprise me if they are the same frame.

 

[ruffruff]

It doesn’t. It’s pretty specific to the motor and display combination. Even then, there may be a specific tuner for just that year and model. I made an entire thread on it in the Yamaha section when I was on a search for it.

Yep, just looked at their website, it's pretty specific to individual bikes and motors/displays.

 

[ruffruff]

The fact that the Wabash is only class 1 is a little weird. I'll note that the geometry between the Civante and Wabash are almost identical. It wouldn't surprise me if they are the same frame.

I think they are trying to hit the adventure side a little harder with the Wabash and keeping it Class 1 puts it inline with a lot of eMTB and open to more single track?? Just my guess.

 

[jabberwocky]

I think they are trying to hit the adventure side a little harder with the Wabash and keeping it Class 1 puts it inline with a lot of eMTB and open to more single track?? Just my guess.

That could be. Riding actual singletrack with drop bar bikes isn't that common, but people do it. Its also nice for states (like PA) that haven't legitimized class 3s anywhere yet, if you want to make sure you're legal.

That said, if you like the look of the Wabash but want a class 3, just get a Civante! A side by side comparison of the geometry says there is basically zero difference between them.

 

[MDog51]

You might want to look at the Bulls Desert Falcon EVO . I have it….I love it.

I have a thread on the review in the Bulls forum….versatile class 3 with Di2 electric

 

[WattsUpDude]

You might want to look at the Bulls Desert Falcon EVO . I have it….I love it.

I have a thread on the review in the Bulls forum….versatile class 3 with Di2 electric

View attachment 94824

That’s a pretty bike!

I also really like the Canyon Grail :ON

 

[ruffruff]

Would you pass up a used Trek Verve2+ with almost no miles for a good price? Put a SpeedBox in it?

 

[WattsUpDude]

Would you pass up a used Trek Verve2+ with almost no miles for a good price? Put a SpeedBox in it?

I’m not that well versed in Bosch but I think that has the lower torque figure of 40Nm. Might be okay if your hills aren’t too steep or long.

 

[ruffruff]

Sooo I have a line on a Trek Verve+ 2 used with 14 miles on it for $2k.
It has a 40Nm motor in it and I can put a Speedbox on it for class 3.
But I'm thinking that 40Nm won't hold up long with a heavy rider and class 3 speeds.

 

[MDog51]

Sooo I have a line on a Trek Verve+ 2 used with 14 miles on it for $2k.
It has a 40Nm motor in it and I can put a Speedbox on it for class 3.
But I'm thinking that 40Nm won't hold up long with a heavy rider and class 3 speeds.

Trek Verve @ goes for $2750 brand new. Not a great deal for a used bike. The components are just ok.

my thoughts: if you want a class 3 get a class 3. Unlike “acoustic” bikes, electric bikes are very unforgiving so buying what you need “brand new” from a reputable manufacturer and dealer can save you time, expense and aggravation. Plus there are safety and warranty issues to consider.