Even More Neo Carbon Love

[Ravi Kempaiah]

OK, I love it. The build was easy and actually really fun to do! I just finished about a half an hour ago. I took a couple of rides around the block and it was great. I love the way the thing feels. Like a good quality regular bike!! Just with Superman helping me pedal. I can't wait to take it to work on Monday. One BIG problem though!! I can't seem to get the battery off. Is there some trick that I am missing??

Awesome..!
Indeed it's a great looking bike (post pics please)
If you have problem pulling off the battery, just push the top part of the battery slightly further in and try to release the bottom part of the battery out. Also, make sure you have unlocked that thing first

 

[Admin]

Hey Vern, glad it's working well for you! To remove the battery for charging etc. first make sure the battery is unlocked using the key (there's a silver lock on the side of the frame near the base of the pack) and then pull outwards on the battery away from the downtube starting at the bottom of the pack.

When putting the battery back on, you sort of fit the top of the pack in near the head tube and then push in the bottom part (where the plug is). I've attached a few images here that shows the pack and the downtube where it plugs in. Hope this helps...

 

[Dave]

Vern, Glad you like the Carbon. About the battery, I had the same problem. It is a very tight fit and begins to loosen up after a few times on and off. First make sure the battery is unlocked, the key should be turned all the way to the left or counter clockwise. Try and get your fingers or finger nails in the seam where the battery meets the frame and pull up. You may need to work it out this way several times before it finally comes out. If that does not work get one of those gripper pads you use to turn tight jar lids. My wife had one in the kitchen, and it allowed me to get a better grip on the battery. I would NOT use anything like a screwdriver or knife to pry it out. It will get much easier after several uses. After it is out you can carefully lube the outside of the connector with a small amount of lithium grease, this will help with removal the next time. Good luck, have fun!

 

[Vern]

I got it thanks. I was thinking about using a screwdriver to pry it loose; I'm GLAD it didn't come to that. Where can I get lithium grease??

 

[Dave]

Very good, it will get easier as you continually use the battery. Lithium grease can be purchase at just about any automotive store, or even Walmart, in the car section. Just go around the outside of the conncctor with some grease on a Q-tip, don't put the grease inside the connector where the electrical contacts reside.

 

[Vern]

Thanks for the help Dave.

My super duper quick review of the Carbon:

There is just something special about this bike! It rides so great and feels very smooth. It offers a much better ride than I had thought that it would. It is actually better than my mountain bike; It is not quite as damped, but more like a sports car than an off road truck. I think my favorite part of the bike is that it is a bike first and an ebike second. If that makes any sense. I took it for a ride this morning and my son wanted to ride his bike along with me. I just rode it like a bike, without the motor at all; AND it was still great. I remember test riding the Motiv Shadow, Pedego, and Prodeco bikes and not getting that same feeling. Some of those are great ebikes, but they don't feel like a great bike. I would definitely not feel stranded if the battery died on me on the Carbon. The Carbon is a fine regular bike as well as an ebike. It probably wouldn't compare to a regular light road bike, but then again it isn't. It offers a far better ride and it DOES have a motor when you want/need it. I completely understand people buying ebikes that are...well more "e" than bike, but for me the Carbon is a great match. My only gripe with the bike is that I do wish it had a slightly higher top speed in pedal assist mode. The thing has great torque and accelerates very quickly, but I would trade some of that acceleration for a slightly higher top speed. However, I am VERY glad with my choice of bike. I am also glad that I didn't go for the 650b or 650b Jumper. Those are great bikes, but for commuting the Carbon is a better fit.

I think with any electric vehicle there is a the problem with the power/weight ratio. Batteries and motors just weigh to darn much!! To me, some ebikes barely make up for the extra weight they carry with the amount of power that they offer. That is one of the reasons I started to almost dismiss the Neo line of bikes. I was underwhelmed by the feeling of the Neo Cross and I know that the specs on the Carbon are almost identical, but to me the Carbon is far superior.

Do I still long for the Dash?? A bit! I think it is also an awesome bike, but I love the feel of the Carbon.

Love at first ride!!

 

[Vern]

Quick question, Dave or Others??

I have put about 10 miles on it today. I have used only used 1 bar??? Should I charge it?? If I only ride it a few miles on the weekend, should I just wait until the battery is low or at least lower???

Also, am I crazy or is there almost no difference between the different modes of pedal assist??

 

[Dave]

I usually wait until I am showing 2 bars left, then I charge. I think the only real no,no is to store the battery for long periods of time with a low charge. BTW, these batteries have no memory so charging with one bar down should not hurt.

There is definitely a difference between the modes of PAS on my Carbon. It is most noticeable on a straight away. How much difference you notice will also depend on the gear you are in. I can also hear the motor working a little harder in a higher PAS mode. Try upshifting after you raise the PAS mode and you should feel more power come in as you apply pedal pressure.

I really enjoyed your review and thought you hit the nail on the head as far as the features and benefits of the Neo Carbon. I took mine out today on a flat paved straight away in sport mode. I managed 27mph with hard pedaling before I got tired. What a blast!

 

[EddieJ]

Vern, like you I have never noticed any difference at all between the modes on my Xtrem, and that is after approx. 1000miles of use. When using pedal assist, I just leave it in eco mode.

 

[Dave]

Interesting Eddie. I know you posted similar findings on Endless-Sphere, and other Neo owners found they did notice differences in the PAS modes. I'm not sure why some of us do and others don't. I do know that my battery level goes down quicker in the higher PAS modes, and that I can feel and hear more power being delivered to the motor, with the same approximate effort. For example, I don't work as hard climbing a long steep hill in sport mode, as I do eco mode.

 

[Admin]

I have put about 10 miles on it today. I have used only used 1 bar??? Should I charge it?? If I only ride it a few miles on the weekend, should I just wait until the battery is low or at least lower???

Hey Vern, I'm glad to hear the Neo Carbon is working out well for you and I enjoyed the short review! Regarding battery care, I've read that keeping Lithium batteries between 50% and 90% is ideal (this is what the Toyota Prius does) and just trying to it cool but not freezing cold (heat is the real enemy).

Given your use case of having expended 1 bar, I think you could leave it for short spans of time but I'd consider topping it off weekly and avoid getting any lower than two bars without charging after.

 

[Vern]

I did my first commute yesterday. About a mile in it started to drizzle. I thought for a second, "Should I turn around? Aw, screw it. I'm doing this!" Fortunately the rain cleared up and I had a great time. Today it is actually raining so back to the Honda for me. I'm not that hardcore!!

Commute Comparison
TO WORK(About 13.5 miles)
Car 25-35 min- the trip is a bit longer by car!!
Reg Bike 50 min-best time
E-Bike 42 min-Hopefully I can improve on this time. The roads were wet and I hit every light
Battery-Mostly in Eco mode and I used two bars

BACK Home(About 13.5 miles Mostly a steady climb though)
Car 30-40 min
Reg Bike 85 min-best time
E-Bike 52 min-This was my main interest in buying an e-bike, to reduce my trip home time!!! I am VERY glad that my Carbon did not disappoint. Hopefully I can improve on this time as well!
Battery-Mostly in Eco mode and I used three bars - A bit disappointing, but not too bad. I did have it in higher assist levels at times.

Other notes
I enjoyed the trip very much, however, it is no walk in the park. I think I worked just as hard on my e-bike as I have done on my regular bike. That is OK with me, I want/need the exercise. I really wanted an e-bike to make the commute a more reasonable and practical endeavor as opposed to doing it on my regular bike. I mainly wanted it to reduce the trip time, not necessarily the amount of effort. So I am overall very happy. I do, however, keep wishing the Carbon topped out at closer to 30 mph. That would shave a few minutes off of my time. I also wonder how fast I could do the trip on a light road bike instead of my mountain bike with road tires. I think if I were in better shape, hopefully soon I will be, I could make it to work in about the same amount of time on a regular road bike as with my Neo Carbon. However, on the way home I don't think I could ever beat my e-bike time on a regular bike.

I also wonder if there are any mainstream e-bikes that could do it faster?? Would the Dash be faster, anything else?? Maybe, but I don't think I'm buying another ebike anytime soon. So if i want to get there and back any faster I guess it is just up to me to get in better shape.

 

[Brambor]

Good job Vern - I think your commute topography is very similar to what mine will be. Mine will be more up hill on the return trip. There is still about 4 feet of snow in the woods and I have evening commitments until Thursday but weather permitting my commuting will start this Friday.

 

[Magmir]

That's a great breakdown of your various commute times, Vern. The delta between your car and Ebike isn't that great as it is, and I bet it'll continue to decrease. My Ebike commute time has come down in the last month. I think it's little things like nailing the optimal route, pedaling efficiency, getting more comfortable snaking around cars, etc. The other thing to keep in mind is that depending on outside factors like traffic, the car commute could drastically increase, whereas your ebike commute will likely be capped at the above-listed times.

Like you I also have a need for speed and have thought how a few more mph would be great. I just tell myself that I'm never really in that big of a rush.

With the excetion of tour riders I doubt most cyclists' could match their Ebike commute with a high end road bike. Even tour riders average around 25mph on the flats and 21 on hills, whereas us common folk are more like 17 and 10, respectively. The Ebike basically makes us like tour riders. Not to mention the Ebike is much more comfortable to ride.

 

[Admin]

I loved reading your breakdown Vern! Thanks for keeping track and sharing the results, it's inspiring when you realize just how convenient and fast an ebike can be... even if you'd like it to go just a little bit faster

Do be careful out there, especially if it gets wet! I've taken some hard spills on my bicycles and skateboards before when rounding a shaded corner at high speed... there will sometimes be water or ice crystals that haven't melted and wham! Next thing you know your face is hitting the concrete (usually the chin in my case) and layers of skin are being peeled off



That's an accidental selfie I took recently while trying to change songs on my phone. Didn't realize just how many bare patches there are on my chin until I saw this.

 

[Ravi Kempaiah]

Just wanted to reiterate Court's point.

Unless one has a separate bike lane and smooth traffic, it's pretty risky to ride at 28 or 30mph on any BIKE/EBIKE.
On Reddit, every other day I see some dude getting hit by a car or something. Not trying to induce fear but that's the reality (more here: https://www.reddit.com/r/bicycling/) and also I hope you have a very nice helmet. (NSFW pictures: http://imgur.com/a/GdR2W, and more info https://www.reddit.com/r/bicycling/comments/21flmm/i_went_over_my_handle_bars_without_my_helmet_it/)

Taking Vern's case into consideration. If you travel at 30mph the whole way (13.5 miles), you'll reach the destination in 27 mins. If you travel at 25mph, you'll reach in 32 mins. So considering the traffic signs, you might save 4 mins but is it worth the extra risk??
Carbon has narrower tires and sometimes when you try to go over small curbs at that speed, the wheel doesn't have enough traction and slips. This happens even if one has 2.3 inch tires.

Having said that, safe commute by ebike is one of those truly delightful activities.
Great start Vern and I am sure you will pick up more stamina and muscle power to get back home in 45 mins which is very close to what it takes by car.
Also, many universities/companies offer some perks like free or 50% discount on registration/parking fees for your car if you are commuting by metro or bike. Our university provides 50% discounts on parking for anyone who plans to use EV cars or bikes (I save $200 right there); something worth checking out.

 

[Vern]

Just wanted to reiterate Court's point.

Unless one has a separate bike lane and smooth traffic, it's pretty risky to ride at 28 or 30mph on any BIKE/EBIKE.
On Reddit, every other day I see some dude getting hit by a car or something. Not trying to induce fear but that's the reality (more here: https://www.reddit.com/r/bicycling/) and also I hope you have a very nice helmet. (NSFW pictures: http://imgur.com/a/GdR2W, and more info https://www.reddit.com/r/bicycling/comments/21flmm/i_went_over_my_handle_bars_without_my_helmet_it/)

Taking Vern's case into consideration. If you travel at 30mph the whole way (13.5 miles), you'll reach the destination in 27 mins. If you travel at 25mph, you'll reach in 32 mins. So considering the traffic signs, you might save 4 mins but is it worth the extra risk??
Carbon has narrower tires and sometimes when you try to go over small curbs at that speed, the wheel doesn't have enough traction and slips. This happens even if one has 2.3 inch tires.

Having said that, safe commute by ebike is one of those truly delightful activities.
Great start Vern and I am sure you will pick up more stamina and muscle power to get back home in 45 mins which is very close to what it takes by car.
Also, many universities/companies offer some perks like free or 50% discount on registration/parking fees for your car if you are commuting by metro or bike. Our university provides 50% discounts on parking for anyone who plans to use EV cars or bikes (I save $200 right there); something worth checking out.

Ravi,

I appreciate the concern and I do have a very good helmet and I am VERY cautious and safe. I have a pretty unique commute where most of it is wide open bike lanes with almost no cars on them. The last 4 miles, in route, is completely isolated from cars and I rarely see more than 3 or 4 people, (on the way to work anyway). It is almost like a bike highway! These are many other portions where I wish that I could make up a bit of time with a few more MPH. It is not a big deal, nor is it a deal breaker, but with a family, a difficult job, a house, and ..... time is VERY precious to me and quite honestly that speed is fun!! That being said, I think that you are right about whether a few minutes here or there are worth the risk, probably not?? Also, I have noticed a few times where my Carbon's skinny wheels were reluctant to let me turn on a small elevation change in the road. I almost ate it once and a couple of other times were scary too. IT happened to me three times while riding on the side of the road where the asphalt meets the concrete for the sidewalk. I think if I were going 30 mph then, I probably would have crashed. I think I will try to avoid doing that, but a few sections of my journey have no bike lane and I have to! With all that being said a few mph here and there do make a difference and I am very glad that I didn't buy a bike that tops out at 20.

 

[Ravi Kempaiah]

Excellent!!
Welcome to the world of Neo Vern

 

[EddieJ]

I was in the cycle shop yesterday and the shop owner was really excited by a new piece of BH diagnostic and tuning kit that they have just paid out for. I mentioned again about not noticing any difference, and the response was an instant, we can tune the differences in. That comment now leads me to believe that I haven't been imagining it, and that there has been an issue all along.

 

[Admin]

Hey Eddie, I'm a bit confused here. Your shop has some tuning equipment that will let your bike go faster? Or is there some issue with your ebike that they are trying to fix?