Creo Questions...

[gpburdell]

Hey folks. With the current sale I'm thinking about adding a Creo to the stable, purposed primarily for gravel (forest service & rural dirt roads) as well as "light utility" in that I may add a lightweight MIK compatible rack for a trunk bag when I may need such. I'll use my Vado 4.0 for any heavy shopping/stuff.

Now down to deciding between E5 and Comp Carbon.

A few questions if anyone would be kind enough to share their experience and knowledge:

• Does the new Mastermind TCU support the Stealth mode the prior TCU supports? I've not seen confirmation that's enabled on the Creo? I figure I'll nearly always use my Garmin Edge and thus would be inclined to just keep the TCU dark most of the time.
• Do the Mastermind TCU versions bikes come with the remotes preinstalled? It seems they do but I've not found confirmation.
• Has anyone put a bash guard on the crank sprocket similar to how the Vado SL's come equipped? Be nice for the "light utility" riding with long pants.
• Creo manual references "do not exceed the cargo weight limits stated in the Owner's Manual Appendix A" yet the Specialized Bicycle Owners Manual doesn't seem to have that part. Anyone find any numbers?
• Any other Creo-specific carbon vs alloy comments (I know the usual / general thoughts as to the frame material differences)

(I did look @ the EVO, but just don't see myself using a dropper post, I can change the bars later on if I want the flare, and I'd be changing tires to a little wider than even the EVO stock tire)

 

[JeffC57]

I have a copy of Appendix A from 2019. Not sure if it has changed since then. Back then the structural weight limit of the Comp Carbon version of the Creo was 240 lbs. The E5 structural weight limit was 275 lbs. Structural weight limit includes both rider weight and cargo weight. Cargo weight limits for the carbon bike are 25 lbs with a rack mount, 5 lbs without. For the E5 frame the cargo limit is 30 lbs without a rack mount, 55 lbs with.
You may want to check the Specialized website for verification of these numbers or updated values. I believe I found my copy in the reference area of the site.
I rode both the E5 and carbon Creos before buying the the comp carbon. It was a smoother ride on the roads in my area where they use a lot of chip seal. If you can, ride both before you decide.

 

[gpburdell]

@JeffC57 - great input, thanks. While I'd poked around the Support site I hadn't dug enough or explicitly searched. A search found the 2022 info in the Levo page, and then knowing where to look I found the Creo page pointed to the (same) info labelled for 2021.

Seems to boil down to rack mounts = 55lb rear cargo; no rack mounts = 30lb rear cargo with alloy frame & rack mount clips, or 5lb max via seat bag on a carbon frame.

Test-riding both carbon & alloy Creo models isn't likely -- your test ride assessment matches my expectation from owning an analog carbon road bike and alloy hybrid.

 

[bobf]

I have a 2022 Creo. I like it! As far as I know:
1. Yes, MM display has stealth mode - no lights - as well as brightness control. There's also an option to turn off beeps.
2. Remotes (I assume you refer to the two buttons) do not come factory installed. In my case the shop I bought through installed them.
3. No bash guard for me, as I ride in bike shorts. Maybe a velcro strap that goes around your pant leg? A lot of bike shops sell them.
4. I have seen the same load info you show, but no other.
5. My thought on Carbon vs alloy is that its not a big deal for this bike, especially for your planned use. The motor helps overcome the weight difference. Future shock and big, soft tires make the ride plush.

The manual that came with my 2022 documents the older display. I had to look around in order to find out how to use the MasterMind: changing modes, switching screens, resetting, etc. I have yet to find a central source for info on Creo with MasterMind. And finally, the big question: Is the bike you want available in your size?

 

[mschwett]

Hey folks. With the current sale I'm thinking about adding a Creo to the stable, purposed primarily for gravel (forest service & rural dirt roads) as well as "light utility" in that I may add a lightweight MIK compatible rack for a trunk bag when I may need such. I'll use my Vado 4.0 for any heavy shopping/stuff.

Now down to deciding between E5 and Comp Carbon.

A few questions if anyone would be kind enough to share their experience and knowledge:

• Does the new Mastermind TCU support the Stealth mode the prior TCU supports? I've not seen confirmation that's enabled on the Creo? I figure I'll nearly always use my Garmin Edge and thus would be inclined to just keep the TCU dark most of the time.
• Do the Mastermind TCU versions bikes come with the remotes preinstalled? It seems they do but I've not found confirmation.
• Has anyone put a bash guard on the crank sprocket similar to how the Vado SL's come equipped? Be nice for the "light utility" riding with long pants.
• Creo manual references "do not exceed the cargo weight limits stated in the Owner's Manual Appendix A" yet the Specialized Bicycle Owners Manual doesn't seem to have that part. Anyone find any numbers?
• Any other Creo-specific carbon vs alloy comments (I know the usual / general thoughts as to the frame material differences)

(I did look @ the EVO, but just don't see myself using a dropper post, I can change the bars later on if I want the flare, and I'd be changing tires to a little wider than even the EVO stock tire)

with the current only $750 price difference, strongly advise the carbon version (unless you need the 30lb rear capacity). lighter and a better ride. i haven't ridden a creo e5 but i found the vado sl (which has a very similar aluminum frame to the creo e5) pretty harsh, even with larger tires. definitely would recommend 38 or even 42mm and tubeless for your application. 38 if you need fenders.

 

[gpburdell]

@bobf I appreciate the info. Glad to know the MM allows stealth mode. I have brightness control with my Vado but lowest setting isn't very dim, and no stealth mode.

Bash guard is a nice to have; I mostly ride with bike shorts or bib tights, but for the "light utility" riding in street clothes it'd be nice not to need a slap wrap. No biggy, just curious if anyone's looked into it.

@mschwett thanks for the insights on the vado sl. My intention is to shoe it with 42's (no fenders) and keep my existing carbon road bike for most road riding. Sale price difference between Comp E5 and Comp Carbon here is $1500 before tax, though that also includes the upgraded Future Shock 2.0 vs 1.5 and the new TCU.

Still, while both are presently obtainable in my size, I'm on the fence if I'll even pull the trigger now vs wait for autumn. Likely depends on whether they're still available when work bonus pays out.

Thanks to both of you.

 

[jodi2]

+1
I bought a Comp Carbon in summer 2020 and convinced my wife for a Vado SL in 2021. I thought the 5.0 with futureshock 1.5 to expensive so we bought a Vada SL 4.0 (alloy, no futureshock) for her. She was always complaining about the stiffness/uncomfortness of the new bike. And I said to her "Come on, I'm riding almost the same bike and carbon frame an this tiny suspension can't make much difference...".
Until I bought a Vado SL 4.0 in 2022 for myself... ;-)
Of course alloy Creo at least has futureshock 1.5 and like mschwett I don't have much experience with the alloy Creo. But the frame and comfort of the comp carbon is terrific. I paid in 2020 1200€ more for it and would choose it again for this extra price.
Another ascpect if it's worrying you: I had 5 bikes with carbon frames in the last 5 years. One was of poor quality (stiffness and paint), three were good/no complaints from my side and one was (once again...) terrific, the Creo Comp Carbon frame. Rocksolid (and I'm 230 lbs), also the paint (not one scratch after three yeurs of mostly gravel...). But paint quality may vary, there are some examples here of poor painted Creos (at least the appearance).

 

[gpburdell]

@jodi2 - I appreciate the input on carbon frames. My carbon Domane is really smooth even on rough roads; I've wondered how much was the frame and how much the isospeed stuff. My old alloy-frame hybrid (front suspension) can be pretty rough on the tail end. My Vado 4.0 is pretty smooth - but it's also rolling on cushy 650b x 2.3's

As for paint - I've seen a 2021 Comp Carbon Evo where the top tube paint seemed more clearcoat and showing the underlying carbon - something which some people might consider a poor paint job even if it's intended to be that way. I suppose I can do touch up if needed, and would likely preemptively install some paint protection film at the front of the downtube and rear of the seat tube.

 

[mschwett]

@jodi2 - I appreciate the input on carbon frames. My carbon Domane is really smooth even on rough roads; I've wondered how much was the frame and how much the isospeed stuff. My old alloy-frame hybrid (front suspension) can be pretty rough on the tail end. My Vado 4.0 is pretty smooth - but it's also rolling on cushy 650b x 2.3's

As for paint - I've seen a 2021 Comp Carbon Evo where the top tube paint seemed more clearcoat and showing the underlying carbon - something which some people might consider a poor paint job even if it's intended to be that way. I suppose I can do touch up if needed, and would likely preemptively install some paint protection film at the front of the downtube and rear of the seat tube.

a lot of people don’t like that “irregular carbon” look. currently the grey/black previous year’s model (with the old top tube display) is the raw carbon type, but the current model is an opaque grey. i wouldn’t pay $750 for the new display but that’s just me, i never use the display.

 

[jodi2]

@jodi2 - I appreciate the input on carbon frames. My carbon Domane is really smooth even on rough roads; I've wondered how much was the frame and how much the isospeed stuff. My old alloy-frame hybrid (front suspension) can be pretty rough on the tail end. My Vado 4.0 is pretty smooth - but it's also rolling on cushy 650b x 2.3's

I did (almost) the same on my wifes Vado SL St 4.0, 650B with 47mm and TL. Much more comfortable and together with 160 instead of 170mm cranks also much better for a small person on a S Vado ST. It's a pity that Specialized doesn't put 650B in the Vado SL ST in size S like it's common for MTBs.
Be warned, that the form of the Creo Frame is different than the Vado's (front and back wheel). Even with 650B the maximum possible tire size is about 47-49mm (50mm with some mud is already too much). So 650B is not that interesting with the Creo, I went back to 700/28" where the maximum tire size is (with a little bit of reserves for mud) ist around 43mm.

I've never ridden a Trek with Isospeed, so I don't know how good it works. But I like the idea very much. In the rear the Creo is even with carbon frame quite stiff (so I use a Canyon carbon "flex" seatpost). And in the front futureshock works great but some day it will need mainatenance and I'm sure this will be expensive like usual with Specialized...

 

[bobf]

I need to correct myself. In Mission Control, the switch for stealth mode says "turn off display LEDs." When I try it, the usual display does disappear, but in its place there is a comparatively dim battery gauge. To my eye it is dimmer than the lowest display brightness setting, but not totally dark. It briefly switches to "Eco" "Sport", etc. when you change modes.

 

[gpburdell]

a lot of people don’t like that “irregular carbon” look. currently the grey/black previous year’s model (with the old top tube display) is the raw carbon type, but the current model is an opaque grey. i wouldn’t pay $750 for the new display but that’s just me, i never use the display.

Doh! I completely misunderstood you - I was comparing the E5 vs Comp Carbon pricing. Since it's 450 miles to the nearest leftover 2021 Comp Carbon in my size, I'm not considering that as an option.

I don't think I'd pay a lot extra for the Mastermind TCU either - I'm more considering the frame material benefits, FutureShock 2.0 vs 1.5, and 2.6lb weight savings.

Be warned, that the form of the Creo Frame is different than the Vado's (front and back wheel). Even with 650B the maximum possible tire size is about 47-49mm (50mm with some mud is already too much). So 650B is not that interesting with the Creo, I went back to 700/28" where the maximum tire size is (with a little bit of reserves for mud) ist around 43mm.

I've never ridden a Trek with Isospeed, so I don't know how good it works. But I like the idea very much. In the rear the Creo is even with carbon frame quite stiff (so I use a Canyon carbon "flex" seatpost). And in the front futureshock works great but some day it will need mainatenance and I'm sure this will be expensive like usual with Specialized...

Yes, with the Creo I'd stick to 700c at either 40 or 42mm.

As for the isospeed, I can't say I have a lot of comparative experience but can related that they're repaving part of my usual lunchtime workout route and it's the rough pavement where they've machined the top off leaving diamond shaped cuts. Riding that on the Domane with 700c x 32's did not shake all the teeth out of my head.

 

[mschwett]

Doh! I completely misunderstood you - I was comparing the E5 vs Comp Carbon pricing. Since it's 450 miles to the nearest leftover 2021 Comp Carbon in my size, I'm not considering that as an option.

ah lol, i was saying that a) i wouldn’t pay 750 for the display and thus b) i’d get the 2021 model year comp carbon, for $750 more than an E5.

what size are you looking for?

 

[gpburdell]

ah lol, i was saying that a) i wouldn’t pay 750 for the display and thus b) i’d get the 2021 model year comp carbon, for $750 more than an E5.

Lol, and I still misunderstood. I get it now.

Yes, that would be a pretty easy decision... but unfortunately the only 2021 comp carbon within a reasonable distance is two sizes different than what I need. I suppose I could find a way to get a distant dealer to ship to a local dealer - as rayray mentioned in another thread - but at that point may as well get a 2022 model.

 

[Allan47.7339]

Some of the 2022's are on sale too but it's the more up market models. There are no savings with the wrong size bike either in use or if you take a loss on the bike when you sell it.