Bosch Performance CX - Please Help With Troubleshooting

[Base]

He lives up north somewhere?

halfway between gotenborg and jonkoping, somewhere near a big lake. just realy remote in an onld "farm" house whrere they do not have any city luxuries, so no water from taps, no electrics etc. Heating with a big woodstove to cook on and a windmill and solar with some batteries for a bit of power for a small fridge (they do still use the outdoor cold-hut for sotrage)

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Additional info after having read your earlier post Nik. Bosch E-Bike promises spare e-bike parts up to 7 years post the given generation. With the 1st Gen, your e-bike is very old. A time for change!

I'm for Specialized as the brand has demonstrated an excellent attitude regarding the warranty and the "lifetime frame warranty". Give the brand a try! Note: You need to find a good local bicycle store that will handle your purchase and post-sales care. It is not wise to buy an e-bike online.

 

[Base]

Suburbs of Stockholm here, but I honestly dont own a car, which means anything within biking distance would be preferable. Sadly (for situations like this) its mostly residential areas around here.

bike nation and cykelcity pop up in my mind. (a few years ago besides the BLX also the nordics were my service territory) and there should be a bakfiets expert overt there who does some Bosch service as I recall.

usually a bosch dealer would hook the bike up to the diagnose software and tipically would charge something between 15 to 25 euro for a qwuick inspection/update.

sadly there are not that many shops who service or rework DriveUnits of e-bikes. the closest is in Finland, thats why I suggested to ship them the BDU after contacting them. Might be that they can service the bdu or sell you a reworked version.

btw, Bosch had the Classic bdu, than Gen1, Gen 2 has the different versions whoch also was the cx branded line. Both Classic and Gen 1 had massive issues with water intrusion, hence the sideplate with new bearings and seal which is offerd as spare. later version have less issues with water penetration although this could still occur from either transporting the bikes on a hitch style transportplatform on motorways in a downpoor or using a pressure washer.

 

[Base]

General question though to all of you: do you think that it is worth spending a lot of money on these kinds of repairs / replacements on a bike that is 10 years old? Or should I expect the bike itself to require extensive services in the coming years as well?

Hard to say when I did not have the bike in my hands. You could post some pictures of the bike, with some closeups on parts where you would have doubts on.

 

[nik_lin]

Nik, I'd say find a new e-bike from a respectable company with a good representation in your area. (I'm not a fan of Bosch E-Bike, a Specialized user here). What local choice do you have?

I own no car either as of recent

I own two e-bikes: A full power Specialized Turbo Vado for heavy duty and a Turbo Vado SL for recreation. My big Vado gets very old and I will expect trouble such as a new battery and motor in the coming years. If that happens, I'm choosing another new Specialized full power e-bike. My Vado SL has a big mileage but is a way newer.

I have seen stores selling Specialized here, but I would say Scott is probably the most common e-bike brand for the last 10+ years. Trek also seems popular nowadays.

You consider Specialized to be better than Bosch-driven bikes? What would you consider to be the benefits? I saw 90nm torque mentioned in the specs, which is just a tiny bit higher than the Bosch Performance CX 85, but I havent actually heard anything specific about them before (neither positive nor negative).

Am I correct to assume that the Turbo Vado is a heavier bike with a stronger engine, while the SL is a lighter weight version with a weaker motor?

 

[nik_lin]

halfway between gotenborg and jonkoping, somewhere near a big lake. just realy remote in an onld "farm" house whrere they do not have any city luxuries, so no water from taps, no electrics etc. Heating with a big woodstove to cook on and a windmill and solar with some batteries for a bit of power for a small fridge (they do still use the outdoor cold-hut for sotrage)

Haha, not the direction I would have guessed (obviously), but yeah there are some remote locations in most areas But far up north is like proper wilderness with miles to the nearest neighbor, that kind of thing.

Personally, I would never be able to live like that I am way too comfortable. Cudos to them though, for going old school like that.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

You consider Specialized to be better than Bosch-driven bikes? What would you consider to be the benefits?

It is the Specialized electronics.

• ANT+ connectivity allows using any GPS bike computer to be driven by e-bike data
• You can regulate the assistance and max motor power in 10% increments as you ride (Micro Tune mode). Allowing you to hit exactly the speed of your companion or a group, and also decrease/increase assistance to meet your terrain/wind/range
• Range and Range Trend as vital tools to control the range on the battery
• Precise assistance tuning from the App for 3 presets: assistance and max motor power separately.
• Smart Control:
  • Set the distance and elevation gain as well as the minimum battery level at the end of the ride in the App. The App will automatically adjust the assistance so you will reach your ride goal still on the battery
  • Set the ride time and the remaining battery level; the assistance will be adjusted so you are guaranteed to ride for the specified time still on the battery
  • Connect a heart rate monitor, set the initial assistance. The assistance will be adjusted so your HR threshold will never be exceeded.

I need to hear about the Bosch E-Bike with these capabilities yet

Am I correct to assume that the Turbo Vado is a heavier bike with a stronger engine, while the SL is a lighter weight version with a weaker motor?

Affirmative. The things have changed recently. Vado SL Gen 1 (a lightweight low power motor e-bike) has been discontinued. Now, it is Vado SL 2, a 50 Nm 520 Wh battery (plus optional 160 Wh Range Extenders) carbon or alloy e-bike, which occupies the niche between full power Vado and the older SL (weight 16-20 kg depending on the version).

The latest Vado SL 2, Carbon, Equipped. The photo from last Saturday.

 

[Base]

BES3 covers most off these

https://www.bosch-ebike.com/fileadmin/EBC/0_Relaunch/Videos-and-Animations/Indivual-riding-modes-animation/Bosch-eBike-indivual-riding-modes-animation-EN-1440x2160.mp4

Biggest difference between the Bosch BDU and the Mahle/Brose DU's is that the Bosch system is a complete package from Bosch, so there is less customization possible from the OEM side. Spec did a integration job by them selves, they designed the 2 systems with the different DU's around their software and these drive units behave differently compared to other brands based on their own preferences. Also the HMI and the Battery is our their own.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

BES3 covers most off these

Please enter 40% Assist and 60% Max Motor Power. Is Micro Tune there? Smart Control? ANT+ connectivity? Isn't the Bosch tune capability an additionally paid service?

Biggest difference between the Bosch BDU and the Mahle/Brose DU's is that the Bosch system is a complete package from Bosch, so there is less customization possible from the OEM side.

That's it. Bosch keeps the OEMs hostage. Specialized owns SL motors made by Mahle (no other brand can buy them). Specialized has also a special relationship with Brose.

Spec did a integration job by them selves, they designed the 2 systems with the different DU's around their software and these drive units behave differently compared to other brands based on their own preferences. Also the HMI and the Battery is our their own.

That's a big benefit. Neither Mahle nor Brose could develop equally excellent e-bike system or batteries on their own. Specialized had enough resources to develop its consistent system across the whole Turbo family. The Spec App works as good on my MY 2017 Vado as on the latest Vado SL2.

Meanwhile TREK had 6 different e-bike systems quite recently but owned none.

 

[nik_lin]

Additional info after having read your earlier post Nik. Bosch E-Bike promises spare e-bike parts up to 7 years post the given generation. With the 1st Gen, your e-bike is very old. A time for change!

I'm for Specialized as the brand has demonstrated an excellent attitude regarding the warranty and the "lifetime frame warranty". Give the brand a try! Note: You need to find a good local bicycle store that will handle your purchase and post-sales care. It is not wise to buy an e-bike online.

I think ( based on the guide at https://bicifix.es/bosch-e-bike-motors-guide/ ) it is actually a generation 2 motor, the CX model was brand new when I purchased the bike It was not available in Sweden, so I purchased my bike from an English dealership online

If they provide spare parts for 7 years, then I guess 2026 is the deadline for the gen 2 CX. But yeah, its not exactly brand new by now.

 

[nik_lin]

bike nation and cykelcity pop up in my mind. (a few years ago besides the BLX also the nordics were my service territory) and there should be a bakfiets expert overt there who does some Bosch service as I recall.

usually a bosch dealer would hook the bike up to the diagnose software and tipically would charge something between 15 to 25 euro for a qwuick inspection/update.

sadly there are not that many shops who service or rework DriveUnits of e-bikes. the closest is in Finland, thats why I suggested to ship them the BDU after contacting them. Might be that they can service the bdu or sell you a reworked version.

btw, Bosch had the Classic bdu, than Gen1, Gen 2 has the different versions whoch also was the cx branded line. Both Classic and Gen 1 had massive issues with water intrusion, hence the sideplate with new bearings and seal which is offerd as spare. later version have less issues with water penetration although this could still occur from either transporting the bikes on a hitch style transportplatform on motorways in a downpoor or using a pressure washer.

Wow, funny how you know of dealerships I have never heard of I guess most of my searches have been too local to discover them. I think Cykloteket is probably one of the most well known and respected chain of stores around here, but they sadly removed their store in my area.

As I mentioned, mine is the generation 2 CX motor, so maybe its a bit better in terms of rejecting water? But I have biked in proper drenching downpours many times in the past, so the fear of possible water damage has struck me more than once...

 

[nik_lin]

Hard to say when I did not have the bike in my hands. You could post some pictures of the bike, with some closeups on parts where you would have doubts on.

I dont have any photos of it to be honest, but its a KTM Macina Sport CX with carbon fiber frame and 75nm motor. Mostly Shimano stuff on it.

In truth, I have had pretty much no issues with it. Never replaced anything except for things like break pads and discs. Nothing in particular that I am specifically concerned about, just a bit worried that perhaps over time things will be have been worn down and need to be replaced? I know old cars are like that, you repair one part then the next week something else falls apart. Then you fix that, and another problem shows up. In the end you have paid more than a brand new car (or at least a decent second hand one). Thats why I was asking people in here what they thought, whether its going to be the same with e-bikes

I tried 2 other electric bicycles last year, a friend and his wife bought one each, both totally different models. Dear god, I got depressed when I tried them out. Something about the weight or tuning just made me so bored, it felt like you never had any proper acceleration. You had to bike for quite a distance to get up to speed. Sure, it gets the job done, but I didnt enjoy the experience at all. A bit afraid that if I change bike I may end up with something similar.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

You need a demo ride Niklas.

Specialized dealerships around Stockholm:
1. Specialized Concept Store Stockholm
2. Cykelcity
3. Sportson Sodermalm
4. Ag Sports AB
5. Sportson Farsta.

 

[Base]

well, the nordics were in my service region once, so I had contact with dealers there and know the hassle to get stuff from the EU into Norway....

basicly when your bike is in good condition it would be wise to get the BDU checked en referbished, way cheaper than replacing the complete bike. It might just be a corroded connector or a simple part swap. Or they could advice on what would be possible or offer a refurb BDU if this one is FUBAR


as a comparison I still have a L500++ in our fleet which has been build in 2011 (and is infect a prot-bike) and that still runs ok, battery is not superb but works silll for what it should do.