Battery question about cold temps

[Deercutter]

I have a E-cell monarch 1000 that I plan to use for hunting next year . I have read a lot that cold temperatures are not good for the batteries . I plan on using my bike when the temps are 30 - 45 degrees and being out for 6 -10 hrs . I would take batteries off the bike and bring them in the house and let them warm up before charging When done hunting . Would this damage batteries or would they be okay.
thanks Frank

 

[Stefan Mikes]

30-45 F is OK for the ride. Charging is allowed above the freezing point (32 F) but it is really better to allow the batteries to warm up to the room temperature before charging.

 

[JRA]

The biggest factor involved is condensation that is possible to form when going from cold to warm? If enough moisture forms inside the battery shell it could cause issues. Caveat is that it would probably take awhile for this to transpire if at all.

Cold weather does have an effect on the performance of the cells while being used at low temps and can be mitigated somewhat via wrapping the battery/downtube with a neoprene sheath. But for the temps you mention it shouldn't be too bad.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

JRA: I am a Winter e-biker so I know what I'm saying. If the battery is of a high quality, no worries. No need to wrap the battery at such temperatures either (actually 30 F if far from anything extreme). The only thing is a very cold battery shall not be charged as that's dangerous.

 

[Deercutter]

Great news now I can proceed as planned. Thank you for the replys . It pays to ask people who know

 

[sc00ter]

I use hiking shin guards wrapped around my battery if it gets below freezing. But lately it has been anything but freezing here.

 

[john peck]

Anything below 32 will sap about 20% of a naked battery in a hour´s ride. Roads here have a inch
of black ice under 2 of snow, I´m riding indoors.

 

[rich c]

The biggest factor involved is condensation that is possible to form when going from cold to warm? If enough moisture forms inside the battery shell it could cause issues. Caveat is that it would probably take awhile for this to transpire if at all.

Cold weather does have an effect on the performance of the cells while being used at low temps and can be mitigated somewhat via wrapping the battery/downtube with a neoprene sheath. But for the temps you mention it shouldn't be too bad.

A little neoprene sheath is not going to keep in any warmth in a 10 hour cold air soak.
Also getting home will be an issue if you ride anywhere near 1/2 your normal range to get to the hunting site.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Anything below 32 will sap about 20% of a naked battery in a hour´s ride. Roads here have a inch
of black ice under 2 of snow, I´m riding indoors.

Not while you're riding. The heat released inside the battery keeps it high above the freezing point. (I know it as my e-bikes let me measure the battery and motor temperature as I'm riding). For instance, - 7C outside and it is +8 C inside the battery.

I agree with Rich using a neoprene cover will help when Deercutter is out shooting.

 

[tomjasz]

While others will claim their battery is warmed by powering your bike it really depends on what sort of winter you live in. Here in Minnesota, it gets sub-zero. I had two customers that used electric DC clothing heat pads to warm their commuter batteries. Some here are referring to winters that are actually quite mild in comparison to MN.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Here in Minnesota, it gets sub-zero

The OP was saying 30-45 F in his area.

 

[Deercutter]

The OP was saying 30-45 F in his area.

I live 20mi east of Buffalo NY . It is 30 to 45 during October-November when I will be using it for hunting . when it’s colder I will be using my Atv .

 

[Nomad]

A little neoprene sheath is not going to keep in any warmth in a 10 hour cold air soak.
Also getting home will be an issue if you ride anywhere near 1/2 your normal range to get to the hunting site.

yes it is the question is how much

 

[Nomad]

As far as the temps you mentioned it not huge factor. I don't even think about my battery cover til it's in the thirties.

 

[razz]

The biggest factor involved is condensation that is possible to form when going from cold to warm? If enough moisture forms inside the battery shell it could cause issues. Caveat is that it would probably take awhile for this to transpire if at all.

Cold weather does have an effect on the performance of the cells while being used at low temps and can be mitigated somewhat via wrapping the battery/downtube with a neoprene sheath. But for the temps you mention it shouldn't be too bad.

I've wrapped my battery in some non breathable insulating tin-foil material, like a emergency blanket type. Does the material covering the batter have to be breathable? Over here is Canada it gets really cold, but I don't ride on those days only when it hits -5 celsius (21 Fahrenheit), but with the wind chill it's more like -12 celsius or 10 Fahrenheit.

 

[JRA]

I've wrapped my battery in some non breathable insulating tin-foil material, like a emergency blanket type. Does the material covering the batter have to be breathable? Over here is Canada it gets really cold, but I don't ride on those days only when it hits -5 celsius (21 Fahrenheit), but with the wind chill it's more like -12 celsius or 10 Fahrenheit.

The battery casing itself is not breathable and that is why there is potential for condensation to form inside the shell so whatever you put on the outside to keep it warm is not an issue. I don't have any real proof that there is condensation gathering in anyone's battery actually it just seems like it could given the change in environment and how other things will cause condensation going from cold to warm?

 

[tomjasz]

I don't have any real proof

Good logic. Winter temps with high humidity are common in Minnesnowta. I’m thinking my taking batteries into a dehumidified 60F basement I solve it. I haven’t see a problem in other seasons but again, I always pull batteries and use safe dry storage. Old timers have seen my cabinets often.

 

[razz]

The battery casing itself is not breathable and that is why there is potential for condensation to form inside the shell so whatever you put on the outside to keep it warm is not an issue. I don't have any real proof that there is condensation gathering in anyone's battery actually it just seems like it could given the change in environment and how other things will cause condensation going from cold to warm?

I was thinking of sewing a protective cover from a jacket and adding a 5 volt hat pad, wonder if that would fix the issue of the temps dropping to much in the batter and potentially causing condensation.

There any temp. testing out there. Tomorrow it will be -5 celsius, riding with a wind chill it probably be closer to -14 celsius. Radpower says not to go over -20 on their ebikes. Anyone ridded in such cold temps, is it safe on the battery?

Any idea if the controller also needs to be protected from the cold?

 

[tomjasz]

Any idea if the controller also needs to be protected from the cold?

Nope!

 

[mclewis1]

I was thinking of sewing a protective cover from a jacket and adding a 5 volt hat pad, wonder if that would fix the issue of the temps dropping to much in the batter and potentially causing condensation.

There any temp. testing out there. Tomorrow it will be -5 celsius, riding with a wind chill it probably be closer to -14 celsius. Radpower says not to go over -20 on their ebikes. Anyone ridded in such cold temps, is it safe on the battery?

Condensation issues are not usually present when you are riding, it usually only becomes a problem when you bring a cold battery back into a warmer moister environment (your house). To get technical you won't get condensation forming when the dew point is below the ambient temperature (which is the normal condition outdoors most of the time).

Using a little heat can help a battery in some more extreme (really cold) conditions but generally it doesn't make sense to use battery watts to heat a battery to try and save a few watts from the reduced efficiency of the battery. If you can be very efficient in using the heat (adding small amounts of heating inside the battery case for example) then it can make some sense.

The neoprene covers do help a bit, they give you some added wet protection above freezing and they give you a little extra insulation below freezing. Unfortunately you'd need to be substantially below freezing to start to see any real benefit from that extra insulation. I don't notice much of a reduction in my battery efficiency until it gets down to about -10C (it's in a common external downtube package). Above that it just doesn't seem to make sense to be concerned about it. Now if I was always running my batteries down to get the max distance possible I might think a little differently.

razz, one final thought ... don't over think all this, just ride a bit more to gain some real world experience.