Velotric Discover 1 Plus Cadence vs Torque
- Thread starter Rickeys
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Chazmo
fat-tire biker
- Region
- USA
- City
- Central Massachusetts
Does velotric offer some combined tech? I know on my bike I have never switched off the torque sensor, and the controller is programmed to use inputs from both sensors (they’re really one sensor, I think) to compute power delivery. The result, at least from Juiced Bikes (now defunct), has been terrific for me.
Gionnirocket
Well-Known Unidentified Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Y. O.
Supposedly these switchable sensors make less powerful motors more versatile.
Torque sensor is used for a more natural bike ride experience but can require more user input.
Cadence sensor can give you more power even with light pedal input.
That said my bike has both and uses both all the time. But since it's a 1000w mid drive just increasing PAS provides power as needed while feeling more natural throughout the range.
Torque sensor is used for a more natural bike ride experience but can require more user input.
Cadence sensor can give you more power even with light pedal input.
That said my bike has both and uses both all the time. But since it's a 1000w mid drive just increasing PAS provides power as needed while feeling more natural throughout the range.
Jeremy McCreary
Bought it anyway
- Region
- USA
- City
- Carlsbad, CA
My wife's Velotric Breeze 1 has the same SensorSwap PAS (pedal assist system). Absolutely brilliant!
Her typical split is 90/10 if not 95/5 in favor of torque-sensing. She only resorts to cadence-sensing on big hills that require too much pedal force to get the help she needs from torque-sensing. Over the top, and right back to torque-sensing.
The pedal force limitation is imposed by her creaky sacroiliac joints. Nothing she can do about it in our hilly area without motor help, and SensorSwap delivers the help exactly the way she wants it.
She absolutely loves the Breeze for many reasons, but the 48 lb weight, SensorSwap, and the powerful motor are at the top of the list.
We previously had well-designed 500W torque-sensing hub-drives with nicely implemented throttles. She tried using the throttle for the hills she uses cadence-sensing on now but didn't like it. That kept her on the flats — pretty limiting around here. Now she tackles any hill and rarely touches the throttle.
My main ride now is a Specialized Vado SL 1, a power-sensing mid-drive. The power delivery's definitely more sophisticated than the Breeze's but requires proprietary firmware and built-in rider power and pedal rpm sensors. These really drive up the cost.
Her Breeze cost over 65% less than my SL. But it's a highly competent ebike that I really enjoy riding. For the money, you just can't beat a dual-mode PAS like SensorSwap.
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Chazmo
fat-tire biker
- Region
- USA
- City
- Central Massachusetts
I still haven’t disabled the torque sensor on my bike, Jeremy. The natural feeling has always been a plus (for me) since I bought the bike. I realize cadence alone is a very different “feel” and I keep meaning to try it, but I haven’t.
Jeremy McCreary
Bought it anyway
- Region
- USA
- City
- Carlsbad, CA
Yes, look up their SensorSwap: Torque-sensing or cadence-sensing assist selectable on the fly with a single button push.
Purely torque-sensing ebikes should have been like this all along. They had to have the necessary pedal motion detectors for safety reasons anyway. Why not make full use of them?
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Jeremy McCreary
Bought it anyway
- Region
- USA
- City
- Carlsbad, CA
I still haven’t disabled the torque sensor on my bike, Jeremy. The natural feeling has always been a plus (for me) since I bought the bike. I realize cadence alone is a very different “feel” and I keep meaning to try it, but I haven’t.
No dual-mode PAS in 2022, so we had to choose between torque-sensing and simple on-off cadence-sensing PAS when we bought our first under-$3000 ebikes. Tested both flavors and went with torque-sensing without hesitation for exactly the reason you stated.
But simple on-off cadence-sensing has its place. It makes a good bit of sense for the many utility riders in this very hilly area, and I mentioned my wife's mission-critical use case above.
I gather that you can't switch between the 2 modes on the fly?
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Gionnirocket
Well-Known Unidentified Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Y. O.
I still haven’t disabled the torque sensor on my bike, Jeremy. The natural feeling has always been a plus (for me) since I bought the bike. I realize cadence alone is a very different “feel” and I keep meaning to try it, but I haven’t.
If you're not struggling on hills... then don't. Especially if the PAS power can't be end user programmed.
I rode my cadence only bike a few weeks ago and though very usable it's ehhhh compared to a tuned torque sensor set up.
With a properly powered/tuned mid drive there's absolutely no need for the cadence only option.
ymmv
Chazmo
fat-tire biker
- Region
- USA
- City
- Central Massachusetts
Yeah, exactly. I only wanted to experiment at some point to see what it feels like. I take it the cadence is a pretty “binary” experience (on/off).
Gionnirocket
Well-Known Unidentified Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Y. O.
Depends on the motor.
The Bafang BBS* that are end user tune'ble I think give a little better experience than just on/off with a gentle ramp up and then ramp down as you approach the selected target cadence. Like I said, imo very usable but a little lacking in rider natural experience. Having stepped up I wouldn't want to go back.
This seems to be a good solution for hub motors that may struggle with climbing.
Jeremy McCreary
Bought it anyway
- Region
- USA
- City
- Carlsbad, CA
Yes, pretty binary, which means a lot less control for the rider.
Definitely try it to feel the difference for yourself. With the kind of riding we see you doing, you can then pat yourself on the back for getting a bike that also offers torque-sensing.
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